Why Hanbury St. No. 29?

[K-453]

If all back yards in the row of houses were accesible, why going into that of 29, which was quite in the middle?

That makes it look like Jack met Annie in front of that house. If they turned into Hanbury Street from another street, they would rather have gone into a house at the end of the row, wouldn't they?

[The Grave Maurice]

Do we know that all the houses on that stretch of Hanbury were accessible? (Number 29 was left unlocked, but that doesn't necessarily mean that all of the others were as well.) Anyway, I've always assumed that, since Annie knew the area, she led JtR to that particular house knowing it would be unlocked and thinking they would be safe from interruption while conducting their business. Unfortunately, she was right.

[lynn cates]

right

Hello Maurice. I completely agree. Of course, Mrs. Long's testimony seems to indicate her assailant was a bit more willing than she. But she knew the lay of the land. (Oops! No pun intended.)

Cheers.
LC

[Rubyretro]

Although I think that Lynn and TGM are most probably right, it is worth
at least considering the fact that Mrs Richardson held religious meetings at
number 29, and religious mania/hatred of prostitutes could be a possible factor in the case, since we don't know who Jack was. Also people apparently did come off the street and doss on the stairs, and so JTR could equally have known the house and yard that way.

I find it incredible that the Ripper took the risk of being caught red handed in the yard, like a rat in a trap, with plenty of people in the road and getting ready for work. It makes me wonder if he was familiar with the house and knew that the door was unlocked and none of the residents would likely be coming into the yard at that time ?

[Stephen Thomas]

There was a workshop at the back of the garden of #29, separate from the house and it may be that the front door was left open 24/7 to allow access to it.

[lynn cates]

kind of killer

Hello Ruby.

"I find it incredible that the Ripper took the risk of being caught red handed in the yard, like a rat in a trap, with plenty of people in the road and getting ready for work."

And this is what led me to believe he must be entirely dissociated and not a planning killer.

Cheers.
LC

[Rubyretro]

And this is what led me to believe he must be entirely dissociated and not a planning killer.

Cheers.
LC[/QUOTE]

Well, I like the quote in Bob Hinton's book about the golfer congratulated on a 'lucky' shot who replied "yes, and the more I practise, the luckier I get".

JTR was very lucky indeed not to get caught. It's not feasible that he didn't practise i.e. plan.

[DVV]

I find it incredible that the Ripper took the risk of being caught red handed in the yard, like a rat in a trap, with plenty of people in the road and getting ready for work.

Hello Ruby

is that really incredible ? If Davis had gone out earlier, who would have been the more frightened ?
Davis, I guess, and the ripper wouldn't have been caught.

Amitiés

[Edward]

Victim's Choice

Hello All -

I absolutely agree that Jack was lucky. He escaped from multiple murder sites without arousing suspicion. It seems his appearance did not look out of place in the East End. (planning?) I feel that it is probable the women led Jack to the secluded places since they were the ones plying their trade (most likely in locations that they were familiar with).

The killer performed a certain amount of planning insofar as he brought along a knife. Beyond that, who knows how much planning took place? The killer certainly planned on escaping after the deed(s), and managed to do so each time. The backyard of 29 Hanbury certainly could have turned out to be a trap. At the time, he certainly felt that the backyard was safe enough to perform the act. Perhaps he did feel that he was at risk in that backyard, but at the moment of truth, his urge to kill overcame any concern for his own safety. (I have this woman here in a secluded spot, here goes!). Dutfields Yard was also a risky location with people all around the club and only one way out, so it appears that he was willing to take on a certain amount of risk. Finally: We don’t know how many times (if ever) the killer felt vulnerable enough to not go through with a murder/mutilation. (too many witnesses about, police presence, location too exposed). Jack must have had some risk threshold beyond which, he would not venture. It seems improbable to me that Jack would find a suitable victim in a suitable location every time that he went out hunting.

I think that 29 Hanbury Street was most probably the victim’s choice. (sorry if I am off topic at times)

Cheers,
Edward

[K-453]

Do we know that all the houses on that stretch of Hanbury were accessible?

I read that somewhere, and the houses were built following a similar plan. They probably also were inhabited by the same class of people, i. e. labourers who had to leave home at all hours for work. That was the reason why 29 was left open.

[K-453]

I made a screenshot of the blown-up ordnance map from 1894. No. 29 must be one of the houses under the big, black H from 'Christchurch'. Correct me if I am wrong.

As you see, it is quite in the middle. There are a lot of back yards and passages around, where a prostitute could seek refuge with her client. That is why I am wondering why they went into 29.

[The Grave Maurice]

They probably also were inhabited by the same class of people, i. e. labourers who had to leave home at all hours for work. That was the reason why 29 was left open.

OK, here's another idea. Perhaps Annie chose 29 because she knew there wasn't a big, strapping landlord or tenant on the premises to give her and her client grief. That may not have been true of all the houses on the street.

[Lechmere]

If the Ripper was a local, with a grudge against women in general or prostitutes in particular, or maybe had a mother complex or just wanted to strike out against powerless victims and late night prostitutes were the most readily available potential victims, then where would he kill them?
The only viable option would be to pick up a prostitute and go to wherever they took you and then take your chances.
The prostitute would take their client to a spot where they could have a quickie that would be all over and done within 5 minutes. The same sort of time the Ripper in all likelihood took to kill and mutilate.
All of the murder scenes were ‘dodgy’ and in my opinion all were chosen by the victim. If it was suitable for illicit sex it was suitable for what the Ripper had in mind.

If you prefer Druit, Maybrick or Tumblety you have more of a problem as they would have had other options. Or Le Grand for that matter.
Also I don’t think a prostitute would have taken a nutter like Kosminsky or Isenschmidt to anywhere secluded.

[The Grave Maurice]

We don’t know how many times (if ever) the killer felt vulnerable enough to not go through with a murder/mutilation. (too many witnesses about, police presence, location too exposed). Jack must have had some risk threshold beyond which, he would not venture. It seems improbable to me that Jack would find a suitable victim in a suitable location every time that he went out hunting.

A well-made point, Edward, and one that I often have a tendency to overlook. Thanks for the reminder.

[lynn cates]

talk, talk, talk

Hello Lechmere. Can't speak for Kosminski, but so long as Isenschmid did not converse, he could pass. The bizarre conversations, full of violence, were a dead give away.

Cheers.
LC