Life INSIDE 13 Miller's Court

[Zodiac]

Okay, I've rambled with my usual blend of useless junk, so will quit now

Not useless to me Claire, very helpful actually, thanks

Best wishes,

Zodiac.

[harry]

Glad you had a laugh Jane,usually my posts don't have that affect.
Success with your book,I know it will be good.Although I lived the opposite side of England to London,I believe there would have been a lot in common.As I said,my grandparents were born 1860's,and although our lives overlapped by a good many years,I remember little,but some of the things that come to mind does I think help.I was taught never to enter a house before knocking and being given permission to enter.Whether this was common in London I cannot say,but it might explain why no neighbours discovered Kelly's body,and why the killer might have felt he wouldn't be disturbed.
My grandfather was a plumber by trade,but like other workers,his mornings ritual could be timed almost to the minute.That included using the outside closset,and leaves me to believe that the neighbour of 29 Hanbury St, was telling the truth and could be sure of the time.
I must mention the curious character Johny or Spanish onions.Known by both names.He was a fellow who in the 1930's,in springtime,pushed his bicycle around the streets selling onions.Bunches of them roped together and tied to his bicycle.Said they and himself came all the way from Spain.Claimed to have cycled all the way.Always had a ready answer,and I am sure if anyone had challenged his story and asked how he could have crossed the channel,his reply would have been,"I didn't come that way".He was one of many,all trying to sell something,or mend something.The tac man,the tinkers,the scissors sharpener,all had their day,and would be good for a story.

[claire]

That's two connections of East End Victoriana with the Teenage Cancer Trust in two days, Jane, the other being the Wilton's benefit for same that I was reading about last night. Not connected at all?
And I'll definitely have a copy once you're done

[Barnaby]

Hi Clare,

I'm in the process of putting together an e-book on life for the common or garden East Ender in the LVP, which will cover more or less everything from cockles to roosters. (And be very grateful I didn't put what I was originally going to put there). It's coffee table format, with lots of pics and odd snippets in, so not exactly William Fishman, but might be of interest.

All proceeds are to being donated to a charity, mainly the Teenage Cancer Trust. (£2 donation.) I'll let everyone know when they're done. It shouldn't be long. I'm ploughing through as we speak!

Please advertise this on the Casebook when it is complete. I would love a copy!

[joelhall]

I'm not so sure about the comment that photos of men, even well to do in the Victorian era had stains and such over their clothes. I have a wealth of photographs of our family, and they all have clean clothes and are well groomed - and they were not well-to-do people either. My family was mostly farmers and labourers, with the occaisional rise up to a trade. They wouldn't dream of looking a state in photographs, especiall if they were taken at a photographers studio for a paid up family or personal portrait.

clothes were important to people then - far more important than to us today. We have the benefit of modern homes and central heating, fans in summer and some have air conditioning. The Victorian poor would have what they could afford to keep them warm, dry, clean, cool, etc. So it stand to reason they would look after their clothes a lot more than we do today, repairing holes and tears, keeping them clean, etc.

Washing could simply be done in the bath. This goes for bed linen too. It was a chore which needed doing to keep out bugs and pests, and stop you stinking horribly - even more so than washing. Anyone who's ever been homeless or been up close with the homeless (sadly at one point I was unlucky enough to be homeless) will know that youre clothes start to stink something awful very quickly, much more so than you do youself.

People who keep this up end up getting pretty ill, and the clothes themselves fall apart. If you have the opportunity you clean them, fix them, or buy (or steal) newer ones. Thrift shops would of course be dotted all round the area.

About the food - other than the fire place, the kettle to swing over it and a table we are no doubt talking about takeaway food. Fish, fruit, pies, etc - all Victorian!

And this is probably why Mary Kelly owed such a high rent when she died - she was getting food and other bits and bobs on the slate as well, or possibly borrowing money, which he simply added to her rent owed.

[Steve S]

Just a couple of comments....Since I often spend a week or so living 18thcent style,(people have funny hobbies...)..You very soon adapt to a different level of cleanliness...As mentioned,outer clothes are simply brushed off when dry,,,A lot of rubbish goes on the fire..and a simple rinse of face and hands is enough to start the day!
Steve

[Rubyretro]

and a simple rinse of face and hands is enough to start the day!

Living 18th century style must surely curtail your ' love life'.

[Steve S]

Not when you're both living the same............And there's normally a bar of castille soap around somewhere(washes the hair quite well)....Anyway,after a day of period exertion,sleep is normally uppermost in the mind!

[claire]

I don't even want to think about what 'period exertion' entails...

[Steve S]

In my case....Military drill...gun cleaning...kit maintenance..cutting/collecting firewood...getting water.....nothing exciting............sorry if that's disappointing!

[Rubyretro]

I would think after the 'period exertion' -'gun cleaning' was just what was needed. (otherwise a great deal of 'kit maintenance' would certainly be on the cards.
(great one, Claire).

[Steve S]

A suitably Hogarthian line for things to follow...............

[claire]

I would think after the 'period exertion' -'gun cleaning' was just what was needed. (otherwise a great deal of 'kit maintenance' would certainly be on the cards.

Ewwwwww!!! Too rude, heheh

[macknnc]

Like Steve I am also a historical reenactor and have been one off and on for over 30 years..

And yes, without a doubt it is illumniating to 'visit' the 18th or 19 centuries now and again..Though I hasten to admit one the nicest things about these 'visits' is you don't have to stay...(Much like what they say about grandchildren..you get to give them back..)

But the point here is that much of what we consider necessary for living is in fact a luxury and something you don't have to have to live. One member of my group goes out for trips of week or so..his pack, including food, weighs about 12 lbs..I've gone with him and yes it is very possible to live for week like this..but it is a little stark..

I would think Mary Kelly had or at least had access to what she absolutley needed to live...Bathing every day is a 'modern' thing...and when everybody shows the same lack of hygiene, it would be fairly easy to tolerate. Sanitation in Whitechapel was fairly loosely defined..and would have shocked most of us right down to our souls...

Something I said in another post is worth repeating here..You can't judge or truly imagine 19th century lifestyles with a 2010 brain...

[tylerxxlovex3]

Hi Clare,

Far from useless ramblings that was a very good post!

Hi Harry,

the latter paid full board which included meals and often use of all facilities(sometimes including the landlords wife

That made me laugh out loud. Thanks for starting my day of with grin.

I'm in the process of putting together an e-book on life for the common or garden East Ender in the LVP, which will cover more or less everything from cockles to roosters. (And be very grateful I didn't put what I was originally going to put there). It's coffee table format, with lots of pics and odd snippets in, so not exactly William Fishman, but might be of interest.

All proceeds are to being donated to a charity, mainly the Teenage Cancer Trust. (£2 donation.) I'll let everyone know when they're done. It shouldn't be long. I'm ploughing through as we speak!

Much love

Janie

xxxx

I'm sorry to keep bringing up old threads but this one was so good! Does any one know if this book has come out yet? I would LOVE to read it!