Life INSIDE 13 Miller's Court

[Phil H]

Jane,

Thanks for that informative post. I recall you well from my old association with Casebook in 2005, and you have lost none of your insight and knowledge.

It is still the questions that intrigue me - though i don't for a moment believe them crucial.

That after several months in that room there was scarce a trace of personality - we know there was a pipe on the mantlepiece, so much detail, but nothing that throws light on MJK's personality.

There had been more clothes there, but they were not Mary's. It was cold and wintry but we are reduced to believing that someone burned clothes to stoke a fire - an experiment someone should try sometime.

Fascinating - at least to me - but of minimal relevance perhaps.

Thanks again,

Phil

[Rubyretro]

[There had been more clothes there, but they were not Mary's. It was cold and wintry but we are reduced to believing that someone burned clothes to stoke a fire - an experiment someone should try sometime.

I've always wondered if JtR hadn't used the clothes to protect his own, or at least to wipe his hands on, and they hadn't got bloody handprints on them
-so he burned them ? Maybe he had to burn something of his own, and burned the other clothes to disguise it ?

Effectively, if there was no other fuel in the room for the fire, maybe he only had the clothes to burn -but as you say it couldn't have been easy to get them going, nor pleasant in the room.

I believe that women used bundles of rags as sanitary towels, when they had a period (my mum said, still the case in the 1950s), and then put them on the fire -so they did often burn fabric.

[Stephen Thomas]

Jane,

Thanks for that informative post. I recall you well from my old association with Casebook in 2005, and you have lost none of your insight and knowledge.

Hi Phil

Yes, Jane is a star and may I say it's nice to see you back (to see you back, nice ).

You were always one of the very best posters here.

Regards

[Hamrammr]

This is a very interesting/informative post. I can't read it all at the moment but look forward to doing so. It makes me wonder just how much the fire was utilized in these dwellings. Presumably it was used instead of a bin, so everything ended up in there - discarded food, worn clothing, old letters, any broken furniture... and lets not forget 'evidence.'

[harry]

From what I remember from the old boards,Kelly's accomodation was part of a room that was at one time a storeroom belonging to Mccarthy's shop.It had been boarded off to form a bed/sitter.If that is true it is not a typical court home.

I was born in an early or pre Victorian court in a city in England.The court entrance was as Millers Court,an arched passageway,on one side of which was a shop.The end of the passage opend up into the court proper,on each side of which were terraced houses.Small three storied affairs,each room approx 12foot by twelve foot and six foot high.At the rear of the ground floor room was a back kitchen slightly higher and longer than the other rooms.Outside of that was an outside toilet and shed.there was no garden.Lighting to the ground floor only, was by gaslight.There was a kitchen range and copper in the kitchen.Cooking was done on the range,and washing in the copper.Washing was dried in the kitchen mostly,but somtimes in the court itself.Ironing was by flatiron heated on the rangeA narrow stairway led to the upstairs rooms.
Food storage was not a problem,as the town centre was a few minutes away.Pigs trotters, tripe,faggots and peas,and fish and chips,were cheap and weekly meals.
I talk about the late 1920's early 1930's,but by my parents and grand parents accounts little had changed since late Victorian times.My grandfather was born 1860's.
I cannot of course say that court was identical to Millers Court,except for the entrance,though I do not think the architecture of courts would vary to any great degree,but one thing I will say.The courts were insulated by their construction from outside noise,so I have no problem at all in accepting that the cry of murder came from within Millers Court.

[Lord-z]

It is still the questions that intrigue me - though i don't for a moment believe them crucial.

That after several months in that room there was scarce a trace of personality - we know there was a pipe on the mantlepiece, so much detail, but nothing that throws light on MJK's personality.

I don't know if she would have that many personal effects. I could imagine that a person in her circumstances would pawn or sell their effects, in order to survive. If they did not have money to pay rent, which Mary Kelly, evident by her being found by a past-due rent-collector, apparently didn't, they were out on the street, and I can imagine that being a problem in November. Not to mention keeping starvation off for a few more days. Plus, the risk of having them stolen. It wasn't that secure of a neighbourhood.

[Rubyretro]

Fascinating, Harry..

[Jane Coram]

Hi Harry,

Lovely to read your post. Those were the days. Sigh. (Actually daft as it sounds, I really miss them. You knew where you were then and life seemed much simpler!)

Anyway -- Just a bit on burning the clothes. Mary wouldn't have burnt those clothes on the fire, unless she'd gone totally bonkers. The items that Maria left, if pawned, would have just about raised enough to pay off half the debt that Mary owed McCarthy. The pilot coat alone, if it was in reasonable condition would have fetched almost a weeks rent - certainly 4 shillings. The bonnet, perhaps 2 shillings, the shirts 2 shillings and sixpence each, the children's clothes another 2 shillings. Added together, it would have been more than enough to satisfy McCarthy for a bit.

I'm fairly certain that Maria brought them around to Mary so that she could pawn them to get enough to pay the rent. I can't see any other reason she would have taken them there that night. The fact that she left a pawn ticket for a shawl as well is a bit of an added pointer. I suspect that Maria asked Mary to get the shawl out of hock, while she was there, using the money she got from the other clothes.

Much love

Janie

xxxx

[Phil H]

Jane

Very good points - a shawl would be particularly useful with winter coming on and cold weather.

Phil

[Marc]

Jane and Harry, great post, almost like being there, thanks !

[harry]

Thanks for your kind remarks.
The best description of Kelly's situation,is to say it was a bed/sitter existance.Not uncommon then, but much rarer now.On the question of toilet and water,the usual arrangement was that the occupant was allowed the use of the house or building's conveniences.The night time functions was as Jane described.The sitter differed from the lodger situation,in that the latter paid full board which included meals and often use of all facilities(sometimes including the landlords wife).
The gradual spread of the flat or unit accomodation,which began about 1888,took over from the bed/sitter,lodger situation.I guess one could say the bed/sitter occupant had to be very versatile,especially the woman who was expected to do do the cooking and cleaning,and Walter Dew's description of Kelly,seems to imply that as to personel hygiene,she was very proficient.
In addition to the kinds of food I mentioned in an earlier post,there were kippers,Chickelin,Salmon and Shrimp and others not in favour today.Cheap,but appetising,and beneficial.
As Jane says,the good old days,where after 5pm a child could safely play in the streets.

The happiest days of my life,was spent in the arms of another man's wife...........My Mother.

[claire]

Hi Harry, Jane, all,
Fascinating stuff.
As noted, it's really worth bearing in mind that people who lived at the bottom of the pile simply didn't--don't--have that many belongings. I well recall, myself, having the sum of my belongings in a plastic carrier bag--if you had anything of value, it was wise to sell it, pawn it, or assume it would be stolen. I think we've become so attached to this idea of Mary as being 'a cut above,' on the basis of her having a room. It's worth remembering that, technically, she no longer had the means to rent a room; she was as poor as could be.
The fact that there was nothing in the room but the clothes she'd stood up in and some stale crusts doesn't mean that she was part of a Fenian sleeper cell, or that she bailed out to permit another woman to be murdered in her place. If she was that wily, or that well-connected, her rent would have been paid. The only thing that the paucity of belongings tells us is what we already know--she was poor as hell.
If we are to assume (and I do) that she made more of an effort than many other women in her circumstance, I would suggest that is simply because she had not yet accustomed herself to the desperation of her existence.
A couple of other notes about food...a lot of food stuffs were sold ready-cooked; eg. shellfish and smoked fish (these were cheaper, sold out of B'gate, and popular amongst the costers who could buy them cheap, later in the trading day). And someone else has already mentioned penny-packets of eg. sugar, tea. The point is that one wouldn't have to have access to a stove to eat cooked food at home. Food storage facilities, beyond a cupboard and a table, weren't within the reach of the poor, so it was normal, of course, to buy what you needed on a daily basis--particularly if the money you needed to live was earned on such a daily basis.
Okay, I've rambled with my usual blend of useless junk, so will quit now

[Rubyretro]

Such an interesting thread ..!

[Jane Coram]

Hi Clare,

Far from useless ramblings that was a very good post!

Hi Harry,

the latter paid full board which included meals and often use of all facilities(sometimes including the landlords wife

That made me laugh out loud. Thanks for starting my day of with grin.

I'm in the process of putting together an e-book on life for the common or garden East Ender in the LVP, which will cover more or less everything from cockles to roosters. (And be very grateful I didn't put what I was originally going to put there). It's coffee table format, with lots of pics and odd snippets in, so not exactly William Fishman, but might be of interest.

All proceeds are to being donated to a charity, mainly the Teenage Cancer Trust. (£2 donation.) I'll let everyone know when they're done. It shouldn't be long. I'm ploughing through as we speak!

Much love

Janie

xxxx

[Rubyretro]

put me on the list to buy a copy !!