prices for prostitution

[Edward]

Fee for service

Hello All -

While we're on the topic of fee for service (no pun intended), is it true that none of the victims were found to have money on their person when discovered? If so, I find that fact interesting. The first rule in the "oldest profession" is to get the money up front. Some argue that the victims' economically-depressed condition precluded demanding an up front fee. I do not agree with this argument. Get burnt once or twice, and you demand the fee up front.

Comments?

Cheers,
Edward

[Hunter]

Hi Edward,

You've brought up something that has been much debated and is still quite purplexing. The killer evidently rifled through the pockets of Nichols, Chapman and Eddowes, so he could have gotten his money back that way. Of course, Kelly was undressed in bed and many of her clothes burned in the fireplace so he could have taken the money at any time after her murder. Stride had no money on her at the time of death and there was no indication that her pockets had been molested.

Where does that leave us? In all but one case he could have paid his fee and then taken it back afterwards. Stride's murder is unique in many ways leading to the debate as to whether she was the victim of the same killer or not. It may be that some of the women demanded payment up front and some after they arrived at the location to consumate the deal. There may be no standerd practice one way or another for any of them.. If she felt like she could trust him, she might wait until a little foreplay had begun to ask for payment and the murderer, having arrived at the chosen location decides to kill her before that starts. It may never be known for sure.

[claire]

I suppose it might be usual to wait until you get to the location to hand over the money...just because you wouldn't want to be observed passing over payment out in the open. I know that it seems that our ladies weren't observed with their attacker in the open, but if that was the convention, then that was the convention, if you see what I mean.

As we know, there wasn't any medical evidence they had engaged in sex immediately before death (not, of course, that they didn't, but just that there doesn't seem to be any contemporary evidence they did)...so, I rather think that he killed them the instant they reached a suitable location, them following, him behind, knife ready. Handing over money is just time wasting, in such a scenario.

As for prices, I was reading the Sarah Wise book today and she quotes the price of 2/- for a night with a woman in her room in the Nichol, immediately adjacent Whitechapel.

[protohistorian]

.........

The more I read your posts, the more I like you. Dave

[Natalie Severn]

The more I read your posts, the more I like you. Dave

........and if you ever meet Colin you will like him even more Dave!

[David Monaghan]

Hi there,
I know that this has been covered in other threads, but I'm b***ered if I can find the posts again...

I just wanted to find the source for the fourpence encounter with prostitutes in our geographical and temporal range of interest...I was just (to my shame) browsing through that Monaghan book (JtR's Secret Confession) and noting that the Secret Life stated that he paid women 5, 10 shillings--sometimes up to 10 and 20 pounds. Clearly, this top range related to higher class (class in the vernacular, not necessarily higher social class) and younger women in rooms and houses offering particular services...but, even looking at the lower end, the difference between 4d and 5 shillings seems to me to be a heck of a chasm.

So, can anyone please point me to a reference that states the sum that our ladies would have charged? It would be most appreciated; I am going to be asked about it in my MPhil viva, I am sure, and I am woefully ill-prepared! Thanks, muchly, as usual.

Claire,
don't be ashamed of reading my book!! Consider it a guilty pleasure.
The price of a prostitute in 1888 is a hugely relevant question. WT Stead's Maiden Tribute series in the Pall Mall Gazette of 1885 has a lot of detail. He says the "London Minotaur" rerely pays less than £5, but that is for a virginity. Walter's My Secret Life has great amounts of detail. But he describes a sliding scale from nothing to £50 paid for securing the virginity of Louise. I found most interesting the discriptions of negotiation for services - some of which were voyeuristic rather than physical - that were undertaken. Walter says of the early part of the relationship with Mary Davis (married name of MJK) that she "sold herself for just five shillings" when she could have been a two-sovereign woman in the West End. The Whitechapel women were less than half the price of the West End girls, particularly those the Quadrant. However, there was no such thing as standard rate. Everything was negotiable.
regard
David Monaghan
Author
Jack the Ripper's Secret Confession

[doris]

http://www.casebook.org/victims/polly.html I believe Donald Rumbelow was the one who discovered the prices for sexual services but I cannot remeber the book just now. It is mentioned in the above link. Hope this helps, Dave

I wouldnt believe anything that Rumbelow says.

He appears to be happy to repeat anything he finds in a book without questioning or verifying it at all.

doris

And I have just ordered a good 2 feet or so of books about Victorian London, and east end criminals and the lower orders and what the poor sods got up to, I too would like to get some definative answers about the going rate for 'daughters of sin'