The Missing Memorandum

[Stewart P Evans]

Barking Up the Wrong Tree

Hi All,
In an earlier post I quoted Robin Odell on the Macnaghten Memorandum he examined in 1965–
"I clearly remember that in my draft text I described the notes, 'written on several lined blue foolscap sheets'. Joe thought this direct reference might get his contact into difficulty so the text was put into a more matter-of-fact context. As far as I am aware, there was never any comeback once the book was published." Robin added, "The foolscap sheets are plain and not official police letterhead; there is no file reference, embossing or rubber stamping."
Stewart Evans responded by saying that this version of the Macnaghten Memorandum "doesn't exist"; also that "there is no reason at all to suppose that what Robin saw was not the same document that everyone else saw before it was folio numbered in the 1980s before microfilming."
I have since received further communications from Robin Odell, which I reproduce below with his kind permission–
"Dear Simon,
"I thought I would share this with you. One of the advantages of being a boring old fart is that we sometimes do remember things and even keep old papers tucked away in the attic!
"Digging around I found my old Harrap file. In it there is a letter from Joe Gaute, dated 15 February 1966 acknowledging receipt of my revision material for the Mayflower paperback. He writes that he is 'slightly bothered' over my description of the MM material, and goes on, 'You do describe the whole appearance of the statement and if anyone went to the trouble of checking, it is quite obvious that it has been seen.'
"At the publisher's request, the revision material was incorporated in an annotated copy of the hardback, hence, I do not have a copy of the text before it was edited. I am clear, though, about the description and, of course, acceded to Joe's wish not to give the game way. Appropriate deletions were therefore made to the MM references.
"Just a footnote to history.
"Best wishes
"Robin"
It is clear from Joe Gaute's letter that Robin originally described the document in some detail, so I have no reason to doubt the reliability of his memory.
On balance it would appear that a memorandum written on unembossed lined blue foolscap did once exist. It is therefore important that we attempt to locate its present whereabouts and deduce whether this may have been Macnaghten's "draft" version. Maybe then we will be able to make a full and proper judgment on the origins of the Aberconway version.
May I just add that Robin told me, "I'm not keen to get embroiled in what seems to be a developing squabble over MM. However, if my reference to Joe Gaute's letter helps to further the truth of the matter, I don't mind it being quoted. It is, after all, a matter of record."
I would therefore ask everyone to kindly respect Robin's wishes.
Regards,
Simon

Simon, dear old boy that you may be, I'm afraid that you are barking up the wrong tree on this one. And from emails I have received I am not the only one who thinks so.

I have already extolled Robin's undoubted virtues, but on this one he is relying on a forty five year-old memory. I know that my memory isn't that good at such a remove in time, nor is anyone else's for that matter. Someone else who is au fait with the documentation and what has been written here, like me, feels that Robin is confusing his memory with that of the many documents that are on blue-lined paper, such as Hutchinson's statement which Robin focuses on in his book. In every other respect such as lack of heading, no page numbers, alignment, content, and even date, the known official Macnaghten document agrees. Not only that, the photocopy I have of the document, made in 1968, is clearly the same one.

I don't intend to 'squabble' over this for I am 100% happy that what I say is correct. It is pointless to say that 'On balance it would appear that a memorandum written on unembossed lined blue foolscap did once exist'. And I fear that if you 'attempt to locate its present whereabouts and deduce whether this may have been Macnaghten's "draft" version' you are in for a long, lonely and ultimately fruitless search.

[Stewart P Evans]

Photograph

My photograph of the last page of the Macnaghten memorandum.


Photograph - S P Evans.

[Stewart P Evans]

Photocopy

1968 photocopy of last page of the Macnaghten memorandum.

[Stewart P Evans]

Pdf

The PDF file of the memorandum here on Casebook is the same as my photographs, I note that the folio numbers weren't stamped on the actual document but on the backing sheets to which the pages are attached.

[Stewart P Evans]

Public Record Office

Top of the first page of the Macnaghten memorandum showing the placing of the Public Record Office folio number on the backing sheet. Note lack of heading and official stamps on the page.

[mariab]

SPE wrote:
I note that the folio numbers weren't stamped on the actual document but on the backing sheets to which the pages are attached.
Makes complete sense for the preservation of the original documents.

[Stewart P Evans]

Unfortunately

SPE wrote:
I note that the folio numbers weren't stamped on the actual document but on the backing sheets to which the pages are attached.
Makes complete sense for the preservation of the original documents.

Unfortunately this isn't the case for all of the documents. Many have Record Office stamps on the actual documents.

[mariab]

Hmmm. I understand.

[Rob Clack]

This is how the second page looked in 1988. It's from the documentary 'The Shadow of the Ripper'



Rob

[Stewart P Evans]

Thanks

This is how the second page looked in 1988. It's from the documentary 'The Shadow of the Ripper'
[ATTACH]10586[/ATTACH]
Rob

Thanks for that Rob, it hasn't changed much.

[Rob Clack]

Thanks for that Rob, it hasn't changed much.

[ATTACH]10587[/ATTACH]

Hi Stewart,

It hasn't, has it. And it's quite clear even on your photocopy that the folio number is not on the actual document.

Regards

Rob

[Simon Wood]

Hi Stewart,

Before we all suffocate under an avalanche of "official MM" images which are not in contention, and without wanting in the least to squabble with you, all I will say is that in 1965 you were not at Robin's house looking through the Scotland Yard box files borrowed by Joe Gaute.

So how you can state with 100% certainty that the lined blue foolscap MM seen by Robin never existed is beyond belief.

Regards,

Simon

[Stewart P Evans]

Fine

Hi Stewart,
Before we all suffocate under an avalanche of "official MM" images which are not in contention, and without wanting in the least to squabble with you, all I will say is that in 1965 you were not at Robin's house looking through the Scotland Yard box files borrowed by Joe Gaute.
So how you can state with 100% certainty that the lined blue foolscap MM seen by Robin never existed is beyond belief.
Regards,
Simon

Fine, OK then, carry on as you were. I shall take no further part in this.

[Trevor Marriott]

Simon, dear old boy that you may be, I'm afraid that you are barking up the wrong tree on this one. And from emails I have received I am not the only one who thinks so.

I have already extolled Robin's undoubted virtues, but on this one he is relying on a forty five year-old memory. I know that my memory isn't that good at such a remove in time, nor is anyone else's for that matter. Someone else who is au fait with the documentation and what has been written here, like me, feels that Robin is confusing his memory with that of the many documents that are on blue-lined paper, such as Hutchinson's statement which Robin focuses on in his book. In every other respect such as lack of heading, no page numbers, alignment, content, and even date, the known official Macnaghten document agrees. Not only that, the photocopy I have of the document, made in 1968, is clearly the same one.

I don't intend to 'squabble' over this for I am 100% happy that what I say is correct. It is pointless to say that 'On balance it would appear that a memorandum written on unembossed lined blue foolscap did once exist'. And I fear that if you 'attempt to locate its present whereabouts and deduce whether this may have been Macnaghten's "draft" version' you are in for a long, lonely and ultimately fruitless search.

Stewart

I would like to add my input to this issue.

I do not subscribe to the belief that Robin is mistaken and his memory has failed etc. No matter how old you are there are some things that never fade from your memory. In particular memorable events througout you life. your first day at school. your first kiss, in your case and mine Stewart even your first police arrest.

I would sugest that when Robin came across this document it would have been like finding the holy grail so it would have had an impact on him and would have been emblazoned on his memory from that day on.

Now working on the premise that the document he saw was as described where does it fit into the scheme of things. As the content of the document as transcribed by Robin is almost identical to the orginal and was on blue lined paper the type we know was used by the police at the time it is most likely the draft he prepared before transcribing it onto official paper. A practice i used to adopt in the police service and i am sure you did also. A practice that is still adopted today in every walk of life.

The question is where is it now obvioulsy Robin only viewed it and it was returned.

Here we have another example of important ripper and ripper related documents going missing from under the noses of the police in whose care the documents were. Now who could have taken them? Certainly not members of the public even way back in the 60`s No member of the public or ripper researcher could not just walk into a police station and rummage around.

Now only yesterday I found out that another document in more recent times has also gone missing in similar circumstances.

[Stewart P Evans]

Great

Stewart
I would like to add my input to this issue.
I do not subscribe to the belief that Robin is mistaken and his memory has failed etc. No matter how old you are there are some things that never fade from your memory. In particular memorable events througout you life. your first day at school. your first kiss, in your case and mine Stewart even your first police arrest.
I would sugest that when Robin came across this document it would have been like finding the holy grail so it would have had an impact on him and would have been emblazoned on his memory from that day on.
Now working on the premise that the document he saw was as described where does it fit into the scheme of things. As the content of the document as transcribed by Robin is almost identical to the orginal and was on blue lined paper the type we know was used by the police at the time it is most likely the draft he prepared before transcribing it onto official paper. A practice i used to adopt in the police service and i am sure you did also. A practice that is still adopted today in every walk of life.
The question is where is it now obvioulsy Robin only viewed it and it was returned.
Here we have another example of important ripper and ripper related documents going missing from under the noses of the police in whose care the documents were. Now who could have taken them? Certainly not members of the public even way back in the 60`s No member of the public or ripper researcher could not just walk into a police station and rummage around.
Now only yesterday I found out that another document in more recent times has also gone missing in similar circumstances.

Great, that will at least mean that Simon has company along the way. Perhaps you can start an action with New Scotland Yard to demand the production of this 'missing' document. Best of luck.

If you read Robin's book you will see that he did not really pay much attention to it, merely using it in his assessment of Druitt as presented by Cullen. He paid greater attention to Hutchinson's statement that was on blue lined paper. I shall, perhaps, give Bob a ring and discuss it with him.

I can see from what you write you have little knowledge of the disposition of these documents back in the 1960s and 70s and you should have fun trying to trace this one!