Anderson in NY Times, March 20, 1910

[DVV]

The phrase "his people" could mean "his family" (as in "I don't know him. Who are his people?"). I think that's the sense in which Anderson used it.

Yes Chris, that's it,

and given the context, the word is well chosen.
The French translation would be: "ses gens", meaning "his family", but with some sort of "clanic" connotation.

Amitiés all
David

[Jeff Leahy]

Interesting thought David, since I happen to be one of the few that believed Pizer and his family when they claimed none of them had ever heard "Leather Apron" being used to refer to Pizer.

Best regards ami

Just to rremind everyone that Paul Begg covered this topic in some detail at this years conference and the full DVD is now available from Adam Wood at only £15...

Jeff

PS I think the DVD's got to Adam eventually, apparently I sent them to the wrong address but luckily found there own way back via Rob Clack...cheers for that I do appologuize.

[Chris]

The phrase "his people" could mean "his family" (as in "I don't know him. Who are his people?"). I think that's the sense in which Anderson used it.

[DVV]

Oh yes, AP, Cutbush would be another Ripper living with foolhardy relatives...
Such a situation hardly strenghens their candidacies, imo, although both are serious suspects.

Best wishes,
David

[jason_c]

Seems to me that right off the bat "his people" suggests Jewish people by the known demographic of the area he is speaking about.....so he shows some bias immediately..(the total absence of any proof for his speculations is obvious...not only did they not know where the culprit lived, he could have come from any point that was walkable from outside the less than square mile he kills in )....trying to be "Sherlockian" himself I suspect, from the start...based on his opening comments that the murderer was a local Jew living with "his people", and that they "refused" to give him up to what he concludes is the "Gentile" justice he and his colleagues represent.

"Gentile" Justice. He doesnt say that they protected their own family in the form of a serial killer on the lamb...or that he hid among other Jews because he had committed crimes in any country that he could be hanged for.... its the "Gentile justice" that the harboring Jews couldnt abide by. Not the heinous acts themselves. Truly insulting if you were a law abiding local Jew.

I admire the efforts to paint him in more flattering tones, but for myself, I see and hear probable prejudice.

All the best Jason

I do remember reading a dissertation on casebook that suggests these Polish Jews were wary of "Gentile justice" due to the persecution they had received in Poland/Russia. Gentile justice in mainland Europe(and at times in Britain) was a story of persecution and mob rule.

Perhaps Jews as persecuted minority may make you more open minded to these prejudices of Anderson rather than the traditional Gentile anti Jewish beliefs.

[Cap'n Jack]

Well, David, as laughable as that situation is, that is exactly what happened in the case of Thomas Cutbush. But he was not a Jew, so of course, would not have murdered anyone.

[DVV]

Hi again,

the very idea that people, Jewish or not, would have protected and sheltered Jack the Ripper is laughable.
Who would sleep with such a guy around?
"Give your knife to mommy and go to bed, Jacky".

Amitiés,
David

Actually Anderson explains the reasoning himself.

"One did not need to be a Sherlock Holmes to discover that the criminal was a sexual maniac of a virulent type ; that he was living in the immediate vicinity of the scenes of the murders ; and that, if he was not living absolutely alone, his people knew of his guilt, and refused to give him up to justice. During my absence abroad the Police had made a house-to-house search for him, investigating the case of every man in the district whose circumstances were such that he could go and come and get rid of his blood-stains in secret. And the conclusion we came to was that he and his people were certain low-class Polish Jews; for it is a remarkable fact that people of that class in the East End will not give up one of their number to Gentile justice"

Seems to me that right off the bat "his people" suggests Jewish people by the known demographic of the area he is speaking about.....so he shows some bias immediately..(the total absence of any proof for his speculations is obvious...not only did they not know where the culprit lived, he could have come from any point that was walkable from outside the less than square mile he kills in )....trying to be "Sherlockian" himself I suspect, from the start...based on his opening comments that the murderer was a local Jew living with "his people", and that they "refused" to give him up to what he concludes is the "Gentile" justice he and his colleagues represent.

"Gentile" Justice. He doesnt say that they protected their own family in the form of a serial killer on the lamb...or that he hid among other Jews because he had committed crimes in any country that he could be hanged for.... its the "Gentile justice" that the harboring Jews couldnt abide by. Not the heinous acts themselves. Truly insulting if you were a law abiding local Jew.

I admire the efforts to paint him in more flattering tones, but for myself, I see and hear probable prejudice.

All the best Jason

[DVV]

Hi Jason,

I don't think Mrs Long could recognize a Jew looking briefly at his back.
She most certainly had in mind all that stuff about Leather Apron.

Amitiés
David

[jason_c]

Hi Jason,

Are you suggesting Mrs Longs statement gave Anderson the ammunition he needed to suppose the killer was specifically a Polish Jew? Seems to me there were Jews from around the world in London, and lots of Russian and German Jews. How does Mrs Longs "foreign" looking man lead to a probable Polish Jew?

Best regards Jason

Actually Anderson explains the reasoning himself.

"One did not need to be a Sherlock Holmes to discover that the criminal was a sexual maniac of a virulent type ; that he was living in the immediate vicinity of the scenes of the murders ; and that, if he was not living absolutely alone, his people knew of his guilt, and refused to give him up to justice. During my absence abroad the Police had made a house-to-house search for him, investigating the case of every man in the district whose circumstances were such that he could go and come and get rid of his blood-stains in secret. And the conclusion we came to was that he and his people were certain low-class Polish Jews; for it is a remarkable fact that people of that class in the East End will not give up one of their number to Gentile justice"

Perrymason

We have Long's "foreign appearance" testimony in the Chapman inquest. As we know foreign often meant Jewish.

Hi Jason,

Are you suggesting Mrs Longs statement gave Anderson the ammunition he needed to suppose the killer was specifically a Polish Jew? Seems to me there were Jews from around the world in London, and lots of Russian and German Jews. How does Mrs Longs "foreign" looking man lead to a probable Polish Jew?

Best regards Jason

[jason_c]

Why is it that the vast majority of the Ripper theorizing on the part of the Senior men starts years after the investigation has gone cold, and why is it that there is no single cohesive train of thought that exists within them all?

How could they all have such varied beliefs?
How can we consider so many completely different suspect profiles as valid results of their investigations?

Anderson says in essence, the searches confirmed his suspicions that the man was being sheltered by his own kind, and that "kind" were Polish Jews.

Aside from the very high concentration of Jewish people living in the East End at the time, what evidence is there in either the Nichols case or the Chapman case or the Tabram case for that matter.....the ones Anderson was in town for before the house to house searches were executed, that suggests a Polish Jew as the probable killer?

Best regards David, Simon.

Perrymason

We have Long's "foreign appearance" testimony in the Chapman inquest. As we know foreign often meant Jewish.

As I view it, Mike, it's rather simple. After all, Anderson's theory is an elaboration of the old Leather Apron trail. This Jew also hided himself among relatives...!

Amitiés,
David

Interesting thought David, since I happen to be one of the few that believed Pizer and his family when they claimed none of them had ever heard "Leather Apron" being used to refer to Pizer.

Best regards ami

[DVV]

As I view it, Mike, it's rather simple. After all, Anderson's theory is an elaboration of the old Leather Apron trail. This Jew also hided himself among relatives...!

Amitiés,
David

Hi Simon,
my best wishes too

You're right, the first time we hear of an Anderson theory is 1895. Years before, Anderson had stressed the fact that the police had no clue to the murderer.
This said, the suspects put forwards by Macnaghten reflect the main police theories at the time, and Anderson, as well as others, may have favoured a Jewish suspect.

Amitiés,
David

Why is it that the vast majority of the Ripper theorizing on the part of the Senior men starts years after the investigation has gone cold, and why is it that there is no single cohesive train of thought that exists within them all?

How could they all have such varied beliefs?
How can we consider so many completely different suspect profiles as valid results of their investigations?

Anderson says in essence, the searches confirmed his suspicions that the man was being sheltered by his own kind, and that "kind" were Polish Jews.

Aside from the very high concentration of Jewish people living in the East End at the time, what evidence is there in either the Nichols case or the Chapman case or the Tabram case for that matter.....the ones Anderson was in town for before the house to house searches were executed, that suggests a Polish Jew as the probable killer?

Best regards David, Simon.