Was JtR a necrophile?

[RockySullivan]

Hi Errata, not sure how much you've looked into the 1884 torso(s) case but what's your opinion? Work if the torso killer? The skull was found but dumping similar. Except for the line powder. What's your opinion on the killer's use of the powder?

[John G]

I think all of the Torso Murders were the responsibility of the same killer, even the earlier Battersea and Putney Torsos. As Trow points out, "Whoever dismembered the Torso victims-all of them-was very adept at joint disarticulation and did it well." (Trow, 2011)

As regards the Tottenham Torso-the "The Girl with the Rose Tattoo", the display of body parts are indicative of a rare, if not unique, signature, as are the subsequent torso murders. What is also remarkable is that the appearance suggested a women of refinement. Moreover, whoever deposited the body demonstrated incredible daring as the area was regularly patrolled by the police: giving the killer just a 5 minute window of opportunity during which the relief took place. It was as if the killer was taunting the police, as with the Scotland Yard torso, and Pinchin Street-just a few hundred yards away from Berner Street, possibly deposited by the same railway arches that Scwartz ran to, with the victim probably murdered on the anniversary of Chapman's murder.

[RockySullivan]

I think all of the Torso Murders were the responsibility of the same killer, even the earlier Battersea and Putney Torsos. As Trow points out, "Whoever dismembered the Torso victims-all of them-was very adept at joint disarticulation and did it well." (Trow, 2011)

As regards the Tottenham Torso-the "The Girl with the Rose Tattoo", the display of body parts are indicative of a rare, if not unique, signature, as are the subsequent torso murders. What is also remarkable is that the appearance suggested a women of refinement. Moreover, whoever deposited the body demonstrated incredible daring as the area was regularly patrolled by the police: giving the killer just a 5 minute window of opportunity during which the relief took place. It was as if the killer was taunting the police, as with the Scotland Yard torso, and Pinchin Street-just a few hundred yards away from Berner Street, possibly deposited by the same railway arches that Scwartz ran to, with the victim probably murdered on the anniversary of Chapman's murder.

Hi john, I think that 5 minute window shows connections to the rippers MO of timing police beats. I used to think the whitehall torso was a dig at Scotland Yard, but now I think Scotland Yard just happen to be one place the killer could dig at.

[John G]

Hi john, I think that 5 minute window shows connections to the rippers MO of timing police beats. I used to think the whitehall torso was a dig at Scotland Yard, but now I think Scotland Yard just happen to be one place the killer could dig at.

Hi Rocky,

Good point about police beats-obviously a crucial issue at Mitre Square as well. I agree that he must have had a knowledge of the Scotland Yard site, however, it was still a tremendous and audacious gamble, particularly when you consider he could have just thrown the body parts in the Thames.

Regarding the earlier Battersea Torso, a knife and fine saw were used for dismemberment, exactly the same tools as the latter cases.

[RockySullivan]

Hi Rocky,

Good point about police beats-obviously a crucial issue at Mitre Square as well. I agree that he must have had a knowledge of the Scotland Yard site, however, it was still a tremendous and audacious gamble, particularly when you consider he could have just thrown the body parts in the Thames.

Regarding the earlier Battersea Torso, a knife and fine saw were used for dismemberment, exactly the same tools as the latter cases.

Interesting about the tools John. My theory about the whitehall torso is the killer may have been one of the workers possibly Lawrwnce or Young who kept their tools in the very dark part of vault where the torso was found and limbs buried. The medical opinion was that the parts had been in the vault for six weeks and had left a black stain from decomposing on the wall. Nothing could convince me these workers wouldn't notice a decomposing torso filled with maggots and limb sticking out of the ground. The workers may have figured they were safe.

"Frederick Wildborn was the first witness examined, and he said: I live at 17, Mansell-road, Clapham Junction, and am a carpenter employed by Messrs. Grover and Sons at the New Central Police Office at Westminster. On Tuesday last I was at the buildings, and my work took me to all parts of the place during the day. At six o’clock on the morning of the previous day I had occasion to go to the vaults to find my tools, my labourer having taken them there on the Saturday. I then noticed what I took to be an old coat thrown on one side. It was lying in the corner of a recess. It was very dark there, even in the middle of the day. I could not find my tools - my labourer having, in fact, already removed them"

Note: [Coroner] Has this vault been used for putting your tools in for any length of time? - For some weeks until the last three weeks. I always placed my tools there from Saturday to Monday, because I considered them safer there than in the locker. I have not noticed any similar parcel before.

So had the parts been in the vault for the last three weeks and six was an over estimate?

The Foreman - Were there any tools stolen from there since the works commenced?
Witness - Only one such theft that I know of.

I believe there are indications the killer was a construction worker or laborer. If a saw was used to dismember the body how many profession make use of a saw. Note the stolen tools from the vault and take note of this when considering a saw was used to dismember the bodies:

John Richardson, a market porter, was described as a tall, stout man, with a very pale face, a brown moustache, and dark brown hair. He was shabbily dressed in a ragged coat, and dark brown trousers. He explained that there had been a robbery of the cellar at number 29 Hanbury Street and some tools (two saws and two hammers) had been stolen. The door to the cellar was in the back yard where Richardson's mother operated a packing case business. He stated that after the robbery it was his habit on market days to go around to Hanbury and check to see if the padlock was still secure. On non-market days, apparently, he just didn't bother.

http://www.casebook.org/dissertations/rn-doubt.html

[John G]

Hi Rocky,

I think one thing that's interesting about Richard Lawrence is that he was 40 years old at the time of the Whitehall Mystery (Scotland Yard Torso), so he would have been 25 at the time of the Battersea Torso, 1873. He also admitted to retrieving his tools from the recess where the parcel with the torso was found the same day, but claimed he saw nothing. However, it should be noted that although Winborn found the parcel that day- he left his tools in the same recess- he didn't immediately act upon his discovery. It was only when it was still there the next day that he reported the matter to his foreman and the parcel was opened, revealing the torso.

[RockySullivan]

Hi Rocky,

I think one thing that's interesting about Richard Lawrence is that he was 40 years old at the time of the Whitehall Mystery (Scotland Yard Torso), so he would have been 25 at the time of the Battersea Torso, 1873. He also admitted to retrieving his tools from the recess where the parcel with the torso was found the same day, but claimed he saw nothing. However, it should be noted that although Winborn found the parcel that day- he left his tools in the same recess- he didn't immediately act upon his discovery. It was only when it was still there the next day that he reported the matter to his foreman and the parcel was opened, revealing the torso.

Hmm....was the powder used on the 1884 torso used for any construction purposes?

[John G]

Hmm....was the powder used on the 1884 torso used for any construction purposes?

Hi Rocky,

Not sure. It appears that the lime was used to aid decomposition: In the case of the Putney Torso, for example, Dr Barnes opined that a covering of lime had been used for this purpose.

Actually, I've just realized you're not referring to the lime! Sorry, just checked Trow and he hardly mentions the powder, so still not sure. I'll leave in the "lime" paragraph for additional info!

[RockySullivan]

Hi Rocky,

Not sure. It appears that the lime was used to aid decomposition: In the case of the Putney Torso, for example, Dr Barnes opined that a covering of lime had been used for this purpose.

Actually, I've just realized you're not referring to the lime! Sorry, just checked Trow and he hardly mentions the powder, so still not sure. I'll leave in the "lime" paragraph for additional info!

John I am referring to the lime powder or chlorinated bleach. From what I've read it was used in copious amount to the point where one body part was thrown over a railing into some spikes the powder left residue all over the spikes. But from what I understand it was sanitizing/bleaching powder. Yes it was used to decompose the bodies and I guess construction workers wouldn't be using this type of powder?

[Errata]

John I am referring to the lime powder or chlorinated bleach. From what I've read it was used in copious amount to the point where one body part was thrown over a railing into some spikes the powder left residue all over the spikes. But from what I understand it was sanitizing/bleaching powder. Yes it was used to decompose the bodies and I guess construction workers wouldn't be using this type of powder?

They would. It's a primary ingredient in making cement, it was used as plaster, and it was usually spread over trash piles if the content was organic. And sometimes organic stuff comes up when digging foundations.

it was also a sanitizing and bleaching powder, source of heat, illumination, used in purification and stabilization.

And is caustic enough to strip a body quickly and minimize the smell of decay.

I think anytime you see a body with lime on it, it was used to speed up decay. And it's very good at it's job. But if it was the torso killer, why only use it once?

[RockySullivan]

They would. It's a primary ingredient in making cement, it was used as plaster, and it was usually spread over trash piles if the content was organic. And sometimes organic stuff comes up when digging foundations.

it was also a sanitizing and bleaching powder, source of heat, illumination, used in purification and stabilization.

And is caustic enough to strip a body quickly and minimize the smell of decay.

I think anytime you see a body with lime on it, it was used to speed up decay. And it's very good at it's job. But if it was the torso killer, why only use it once?

Perhaps he felt it could be traced to him or it's use might point to his profession

[Errata]

Perhaps he felt it could be traced to him or it's use might point to his profession

It was about as prevalent as gasoline is today on a construction site. Even if he didn't want to buy it its easy to steal. It's pretty cheap to replace. The only things that could make it insurmountable for him to get it would rule him out as a killer. Like, not having arms. Probably the only chemical compound more prevalent in Victorian London than lime was gin. And it was used in the home, in the garden, in construction, in chemistry... it was more dangerous than cyanide or arsenic, sent more people to the hospital than any trauma. And eventually it was regulated, but that was a WWI thing. And even then mostly because they were saving it for chemical weapons.

It's possible that he preferred his victims to be more identifiable, or to not be bare bones. This was a game so in theory he has to make it possible for the cops to win. So he tried it but it didn't work for him. It may be that particular victim had nothing to do with his other victims. Like he killed a witness, but that's not part of the game so that person gets erased. Or someone is framing this killer by dumping a body and aging the corpse by hyper accelerating decay. It looks like it was there for months, but it might have just been days.

But the most likely explanation is that it was a different killer. I mean, he clearly had arms. So that's not it. And the timing doesn't really fit for an experiment. And if he did have to get rid of an unexpected corpse, he wouldn't do it where he had left an intended corpse. I mean, lime the body in a barrel and then dump it in the river. Or don't lime it and dump it in the river. Or leave the body in the street secure in the knowledge that there are no forensics at that time that can link you to a corpse if nobody sees you dump it. There are easier options. And lime is very dangerous to work with, which becomes very clear once you open the bag if you didn't know before that moment. I mean it physically hurts to open a bag of quicklime. And tossing a limed corpse into a pit is the dumbest thing ever, because once lime hits moisture it will take the flesh off the arms of anyone grabbing that body. So the killer tossed it, and then poured lime over it. There's no other way unless you got like four guys and a barrel. I mean, picture pouring hydrochloric acid onto a body and THEN trying to lift it. Same effect.

I think it's possible that the part stuck on the spikes was too visible, and should not have gotten stuck there, so whoever killed her limed that part so it wouldn't immediately draw attention. But that doesn't fit the Torso killer. The other option is that it was the Torso killer, and someone found this part of the body, and really really didn't want cops around for unrelated reasons and limed what they found. Or perhaps they recognized the victim, and did not want the victim recognized. Which happens a lot really. A guy finds his ex girlfriend, he knows he's going to be a suspect, he gets rid of the body as best he can. It's why interference with a corpse has such a steep punishment. It's the only thing they can typically charge a necrophile with, and scared people have been doing it for centuries so they aren't suspected, and ensure that the real killer is never caught.

But I don't think Torso killer did this. He was quite proud of his work.

[RockySullivan]

It was about as prevalent as gasoline is today on a construction site. Even if he didn't want to buy it its easy to steal. It's pretty cheap to replace. The only things that could make it insurmountable for him to get it would rule him out as a killer. Like, not having arms. Probably the only chemical compound more prevalent in Victorian London than lime was gin. And it was used in the home, in the garden, in construction, in chemistry... it was more dangerous than cyanide or arsenic, sent more people to the hospital than any trauma. And eventually it was regulated, but that was a WWI thing. And even then mostly because they were saving it for chemical weapons.

It's possible that he preferred his victims to be more identifiable, or to not be bare bones. This was a game so in theory he has to make it possible for the cops to win. So he tried it but it didn't work for him. It may be that particular victim had nothing to do with his other victims. Like he killed a witness, but that's not part of the game so that person gets erased. Or someone is framing this killer by dumping a body and aging the corpse by hyper accelerating decay. It looks like it was there for months, but it might have just been days.

But the most likely explanation is that it was a different killer. I mean, he clearly had arms. So that's not it. And the timing doesn't really fit for an experiment. And if he did have to get rid of an unexpected corpse, he wouldn't do it where he had left an intended corpse. I mean, lime the body in a barrel and then dump it in the river. Or don't lime it and dump it in the river. Or leave the body in the street secure in the knowledge that there are no forensics at that time that can link you to a corpse if nobody sees you dump it. There are easier options. And lime is very dangerous to work with, which becomes very clear once you open the bag if you didn't know before that moment. I mean it physically hurts to open a bag of quicklime. And tossing a limed corpse into a pit is the dumbest thing ever, because once lime hits moisture it will take the flesh off the arms of anyone grabbing that body. So the killer tossed it, and then poured lime over it. There's no other way unless you got like four guys and a barrel. I mean, picture pouring hydrochloric acid onto a body and THEN trying to lift it. Same effect.

I think it's possible that the part stuck on the spikes was too visible, and should not have gotten stuck there, so whoever killed her limed that part so it wouldn't immediately draw attention. But that doesn't fit the Torso killer. The other option is that it was the Torso killer, and someone found this part of the body, and really really didn't want cops around for unrelated reasons and limed what they found. Or perhaps they recognized the victim, and did not want the victim recognized. Which happens a lot really. A guy finds his ex girlfriend, he knows he's going to be a suspect, he gets rid of the body as best he can. It's why interference with a corpse has such a steep punishment. It's the only thing they can typically charge a necrophile with, and scared people have been doing it for centuries so they aren't suspected, and ensure that the real killer is never caught.

But I don't think Torso killer did this. He was quite proud of his work.

Articles with info about the torso I found on some German forum



The Times (London)
24 October 1884
SHOCKING DISCOVERY IN TOTTENHAM-COURT-ROAD.- Yesterday considerable excitement was caused in the neighbourhood of Tottenham-court-road by the discovery of human remains, supposed to be those of a woman, under circumstances suggesting foul play. It appears that a carman named Rawlinson, along with a sweeper named Threader, went to Alfred-mews, Tottenham-court-road, for the purpose of clearing a dustbin. While doing this they noticed near the entrance a heap of dirt upon which was a parcel. Thinking it might contain the dead body of some cat or dog it was conveyed with the rest of the rubbish in a van to the yard of the Great Northern Railway. The workman of the railway company while at their work of distributing the refuse in the railway truck were surprised to find that the parcel contained a human skull, and that there was flesh adhering to it, but no hair, and, further, that there was some kind of lime attached to it. Upon this they turned it into they van and told the carman Rawlinson to take it back and then to call a policeman's attention to it. Rawlinson did so, and the policeman took him and the skull to the Tottenham-court-road. previously, in a garden at Bedford-square the gardener had discovered lying under some shrubs a parcel which upon being opened was found to contain a human arm also having lime upon it, for the purpose, apparently, of destroying the flesh. Chief Inspector Richard Willams and Inspector Hollis, of the Police Department of the Great Northern Railway Company, on learning these facts made further examination and found other portions of a human body. The police of the Division at Tottenham-court-road at once called in their divisional police surgeon, and the remains were removed to the St. Giles's mortuary pending further inquiries, and to see if any further remains were to be found about in the neighbourhood.

The Times (London)
31 October 1884
THE DISCOVERY OF HUMAN REMAINS. - Dr Danford Thomas held an inquest yesterday at the St. Giles's Coroner's Court on the human remains which were recently discovered in Bedford-square, Alfred-mews, Fitzroy-square, and at King's-cross Railway Station. George William Peck said he was employed as gardener in the Bedfors-square inclosure. On the morning of Oct. 23 he noticed some pieces of flesh on the ground. He was going to throw them from the garden into the road when he found a human arm. He then went to the Tottenham-court-road Police Station, and a constable returned with him and removed the remains in a basket. By the coroner.- They had been packed up in brown paper and had been thrown over the railings. There was lime on the spikes and on the flesh. William Meager, scavenger to the St. Giles Board of Works, stated that on the morning of Oct. 23 he was sweeping Alfred-mews, Tottenham-court-road, when he saw a newspaper parcel about 15 yards away from Thexton's dust bin. He scooped it up and afterwards heard that it contained a human head. Inspector Summers stated that on searching a truck at the Great Northern railway Station into which rubbish had been put he found a quantity of woman's hair. Police-constable John Watts, 305 E, said, early on the morning of October 29 as he was passing through Fitzroy-square on the south-west side he noticed in the area of No. 33 a quantity of human flesh. He asked the caretaker to let him go down and found the lower parts spread about at a distance of a foot from each other. They were covered with a white powder which smelt very strong. Dr Samuel Lloyd, divisional surgeon, stated that he had examined the several pieces, and, from their appearance, should say they had belonged to the body of a gentlewoman; the arm was beautifully shaped, with delicate hands and filbert nails; the face was smooth, and the hair long and fair. The parts had been divided by some one skilled, but certainly not for the purposes of anatomy. The body was not complete. He should think the age between 25 and 50. The coroner remarks that on Sept. 25 a parcel was found in the Mornington-crescent inclosure consisting of a right arm, a right and left foot, and a right forearm. Dr Jakins, the divisional surgeon of the S Division, had seen them, and thought they were those of a young person. They had remained in the St. Peneras mortuary for some time, and had since been buried. Dr Lloyd said the parts would be required to complete the present body. Inspector Langrish said the police were still proceeding with their investigation, and if an adjournment were made they might perhaps be able to find a clue. The coroner said he would communicate with the Home Secretary with a view to getting the other parts exhumed, and to urge the advisability of offering a reward. The inquiry was adjourned.

The Times (London)
11 November 1884
THE DISCOVERY OF HUMAN REMAINS.- Acting under the personal direction of Inspector Langrish, chief of the Detective Department at Bow-street, the police are engaged in making the strictest inquiries with reference to the discovery of human remains at King's-cross Station, Bedford-square, and Fitzroy-square. The circumstances under which various portions of a human body were found in the above places have been made public, but up to the present the affair is surrounded in mystery. It will be remembered that almost simultaneously with the discovery of a thigh and some human flesh in Bedford-square, it was reported that a skull and another portion of the body were found at King's-cross Station. Subsequently, further remains were found in the area of 33, Fitzroy-square. The different portions were submitted to Dr Samuel Lloyd for examination, and at first it was thought by that gentleman that it was possible that the different portions might belong to separate bodies. A closer examination, however, has convinced the doctor that the remains submitted to his inspection are portions of the body of a woman. In each case the remains were covered with the same kind of disinfectant. It is conclusively proved that death must have taken place between four and six months since. On the arm found in Bedford-square there is a tattoo mark about two inches above the wrist, apparently representing half a bracelet, the marks being in a bright red colour.

Lloyd's Weekly Newspaper
Sunday, 14 December 1884
THE FINDING OF HUMAN REMAINS
The inquest on the body of the woman whose mutilated remains were picked up in Alfred-mews, Bedford-square, and Fitzroy-square, was resumed on Monday, having last being adjourned from the 10th of November, for the purpose of enabling the police to see whether they could gain any further information, but more especially for the purpose of having an application made to the Home Secretary for the permission to exhume some other remains which several weeks before had been picked up in Mornington-crescent, St. Pancras. Dr Jakins, who saw those remains, expressed his conviction that they had been used for anatomical purposes, and then were thrown away. No inquest was then considered necessary, and they were ordered to be buried. These remains consisted of an arm and a foot, and other portions of the body, which were wrapped up in what appeared a part of an old towel. Instead of burying them in a small coffin by themselves, the remains were put at the foot of one of the coffins which contained the body of a pauper who had died in the workhouse. As fra as can be recollected it was the body of an old man who was known to have any friends, and the coffin was buried with other paupers in St. Pancras cemetery, Finchley, in September. Since then upwards of 50 paupers had been buried in layers two or three feet deep, and it was finally decided not to exhume the remains, as a number of coffins might have to be opened before the right one could be found.
The medical evidence on the first day of the inquiry was to the effect that the various parts were portions of the body of a woman, whose age was probably 25 or over. The parts had been separated by some blunt instrument, and not for the purpose of dissection. The coroner said that since the last occasion on which they met Drs Jakins and Lloyd had consulted, with the result that it was quite clear that the two sets of remains had nothing to do with each other.
Inspector John Langrish, Criminal Investigation department, Bow-street, in examination stated that he had charge of this case, and had been prosecuting inquiries, but had failed to obtain any further information. Several persons had been reported as missing, but they had all been traced and found alive. Up to the present he had been able to prove the identity of the body. Men had been placed to keep observation on various parts of the district, but no further remains had been discovered.
Dr Winter Blyth, medical officer and analyst for Marylebone, said that he had examined some portions of the body sent to him, and found it covered with chloride of lime, or common bleaching powder. This would have a deodorising effect, and also a preservative action. No analysis had been made to detect poison. He Thought the value of such an analysis now would be only small, but a mineral poison like arsenic might be traced in the muscular tissues. Alkaloids would only be found in the internal organs, which were missing.
Dr Samuel Lloyd, the divisional surgeon of the district. said he had made further examination of the remains, and had found that the ears were pierced for earrings. He had been in consultation with Dr Jakins, who had examined some remains found in Mornington-crescent in September, and the conclusion he had come to was that the remains must have been those of two different bodies. In the pieces of a human body on which they were holding the inquiry there were some signs of skill in the disarticulation of the joints, the removal of the internal organs, and the separation of the lower part of the body. A theory for the removal of the internal organs was that it might be either to attempt to hide the sex, or to disguise the actual cause of death. It was quite impossible to state what that actual cause was.
Dr Jakins, Osnaburg-street, said that on Sept. 25 he was sent for to Albany-street Police-station to examine some remains, which proved to be a left arm, fore arm and hand, and two feet, all of which had been properly dissected. They had undoubtedly been used for anatomical purposes. There was no chloride of lime on them.
The coroner said that he himself saw the remains and on finding that they had undoubtedly been used anatomical, he, in exercise of his discretion, gave orders for their burial.
Dr Lloayd, recalled, in reply to the jury, said that he was utterly unable, from the appearance of the remains, to assign any cause of death. The way in which the joints had been disarticulated showed that whoever did it knew where to find them properly. He did not think that they were placed in the positions they were found by medical students for the purpose of creating a scare.
The coroner pointed out that under the present regulations at hospitals and other public institutions it was practically impossible for students, even if they felt so inclined, to carry away portions of a body and strew them about in this manner without detection.
There being no further evidence, the jury consulted in private for half an hour, and eventually returned the following verdict:- "The jury having viewed the remains of a woman, whose age is believed to be from 25 to 40 years, the said remains having been found in various places in the parishes of St. Giles and St. Pancras, are strongly of opinion, that although the medical witnesses are unable to assign the cause of death, owing to the advanced state of decomposition and the absence of viscera and other internal organs, from the character of the evidence generally, death did not arise from natural causes, but they believe an abortion had been, previous to death, either attempted or completed, and that some persons or persons unknown are thereby chargeable with the cause of death. Further, the jury call the special attention of the Home Secretary to the case, and suggest that a substantial reward be offered with a view to procuring evidence with regard to the identity of the deceased, and to the circumstances attending her

[John G]

John I am referring to the lime powder or chlorinated bleach. From what I've read it was used in copious amount to the point where one body part was thrown over a railing into some spikes the powder left residue all over the spikes. But from what I understand it was sanitizing/bleaching powder. Yes it was used to decompose the bodies and I guess construction workers wouldn't be using this type of powder?

Hello Rocky,

Yes, a quantity of human flesh was discovered by a police officer outside a property in Fitzroy Square. As the officer investigated further, towards the buildings lower basement, he found the lower parts of the body, which were covered in a strong smelling white powder.

I think that this body dump fits perfectly with the Torso Murderer's signature. As I noted, the disposal required a great deal of daring as the side walk in front of the house was constantly patrolled by the police, giving the killer just a five minute window of opportunity during which the relief took place. And, of course, there was no obvious reason why he would have decided on such a risky disposal site, as he could have dumped the body parts anywhere.

I would speculate that the killer expected a police officer to find the body parts and, by making the disposal during the relief, he was effectively taunting the police and playing some macabre game. I think shock value was also part of the killer's intention. This gels perfectly with the Whitehall mystery, where of course body parts were left within the construction of the new Scotland Yard building.

[RockySullivan]

Hello Rocky,

Yes, a quantity of human flesh was discovered by a police officer outside a property in Fitzroy Square. As the officer investigated further, towards the buildings lower basement, he found the lower parts of the body, which were covered in a strong smelling white powder.

I think that this body dump fits perfectly with the Torso Murderer's signature. As I noted, the disposal required a great deal of daring as the side walk in front of the house was constantly patrolled by the police, giving the killer just a five minute window of opportunity during which the relief took place. And, of course, there was no obvious reason why he would have decided on such a risky disposal site, as he could have dumped the body parts anywhere.

I would speculate that the killer expected a police officer to find the body parts and, by making the disposal during the relief, he was effectively taunting the police and playing some macabre game. I think shock value was also part of the killer's intention. This gels perfectly with the Whitehall mystery, where of course body parts were left within the construction of the new Scotland Yard building.

John this is an interesting bit about the killer expecting a police to find it. Do you think torso would watch at a distance to see the reaction? Here is a quote from pc Bennett who discovered the pinchin torso which could fit with the killer approaching the person who finds the body under the guise as a helpful passerbyer:
Knowing it was a lifeless body I waited a minute or two. A man came along with a broom on his shoulder. I said to him, "You might go and fetch my mate at the corner." He replied, "What's on, governor?" I answered, "Tell him I have got a job on. Make haste." The man then went up Backchurch-lane towards the adjoining beat. I next saw two constables running towards me
....


[Coroner]Did you see any one with a bundle? - No, Sir. I did not see a costermonger's cart about. I saw a barrow in Spildts-street. It had a board on it, and had been there the whole time I was on duty. I saw no other cart or vehicle about, with the exception of those coming out of Christian-street, which belonged to Messrs. Fairclough. These started soon after 4 o'clock in the morning. I did not see any of these come down Pinchin-street. These vans went in all directions, and I can't say if any of them went into Cable-street.