The mind of "Jack The Ripper"`

[jonwilson]

Yeah, anything is possible. People just wanna believe that he was a psychopathic killer that hated women. This could very well be the case, but we will never truly know. I didn't know that Jack took anything from his victims. Do you know if Jack had to pay up front with the prostitutes? He took the money back from them after he killed them right? People are also quick to pin the 5 murders Jack supposedly did on him without any proof or evidence proving that he was the same killer who committed the 5 murders he is accused of doing. Although some of the murders had the same mo, this isn
't proof without a doubt that Jack was responsible for all of the murders. We don't even have proof of evidence to proof that there was only one killer who committed these crimes. Could have been a few different people. I don't think this is the case, but we should all have a open mind. I myself believe Jack was a lone serial killer who hated women. I have a open mind tho.

[lynn cates]

alternate scenario

Hello CD.

"Why are we operating on the assumption that everything had to go smoothly and like clockwork every single time for Jack? Perhaps his only real opportunity with Liz came as she had her back turned leaving the yard. That could also explain Jack's failure to pursue things further."

I make no such assumption. If you can work out the details about Jack and Liz going INTO the yard, the deal going sour, Liz leaving and stopping for the cachous and then being done to death, I'd be delighted to listen.

The best.
LC

[c.d.]

Hi Lynn,

Most likely I will regret this but I shall attempt a scenario.

1. I think the issue of whether Liz was soliciting that night it pretty much of a moot point. Regardless of what took place earlier in the evening, she is now standing by herself late at night. We know that she was a registered prostitute at one time so the idea of a prostitute plying her trade at any time is not too hard to accept.

2. There are just too many issues with the BS man for him to have killed Liz. I believe Schwartz's story although I take it with a grain of salt. I think the BS man simply cussed out Liz and went on his way after throwing her to the ground.

3. I think Jack approached Liz taking her for a prostitue or perhaps he had seen her before. Even if Liz was not actively soliciting and was somewhat reluctant, Jack could have sweetened the pot knowing that he would be taking back the money.

4. They go back into the yard. Liz, being aware of the deaths of Polly and Annie refuses to lift her skirt or turn her back on Jack. She offers oral sex.
The act is completed. Liz starts to leave or perhaps goes off to the privy.
As she is leaving the yard, she takes out the cachous (oral sex and all that - you get the picture). Jack is unsure of whether to stike or not. Things have never gone this way before. He makes a last minute decision to strike pulling Liz back from the entrance by her scarf. The attack is so swift Liz simply clutches the cachous. Jack, realizing that he is now so close to the club, and still somewhat paranoid from the deviation in plan, simply chooses to write this one off and goes off in pursuit of another victim.

How's that?

c.d.

[Mascara & Paranoia]

^ That scenario's a lot more plausible than most of the others (especially the interruption theory). If Jack did kill Stride, then that works for me.

I firmly beleve stride to be a victem of the ripper. The choice of knife in ky mind has no way to disregard the ripper and because of the change of his usual knife I belive it to be why the cut was superficial and differernt than the others.

The only gripe I have with that is that only forty-odd minutes after Stride is killed, the Ripper cuts Eddowes' throat and rips her open with one knife that most definitely did the job. Why would he carry two knives but only use one on one victim only? You could argue that he may have ditched the first one after it failed to do the job properly on Stride's throat, but I still don't see him having had two (or more) blades on him as plausible, as all the post-mortem stuff says that all the canonical victims fell victim to a single knife, not multiple ones. I think Tabram's killing would better fit the two-knife-theory.

Yet in the Hanbury backyard, since he would need a dead woman cut open to be able to extract the organ he takes, very little is done in the way of superfluous acts. He kills and cuts where he intends to take things from, and cuts the items free he wants to take.

True. But the Ripper's next victim had her face slashed and an additional organ removed. That and prior to Chapman, the 'only' post-mortem mutilations he performed on his first victim was ripping open her torso; her intestines weren't drawn out, no organs were taken. He could've been interrupted, but he also could've done what he set out to do with Nichols. We have no idea. What he do know is that from Nichols to Eddowes, there's a clear escalation in the mutilations and a change of interest in organs, so it's not too hard to deduce that the Ripper had killed Kelly, given that her murder wasn't on the streets like all the others.

Regarding spouses, I think you hit the nail on the head by saying that we know next to nothing about them. They can't realistically be suspected of anything in way of murder because we know nothing of what they were capable of aside from their c-wordish tendency to knock their missuses about (and not to stereotype, but I would've thought that would've been a lot more regular in those days than it is now).

[lynn cates]

reconstruction

Hello CD. Not bad, but it does leave a bad taste in one's mouth. (Ahem.)

This accounts for many of the loose threads but:

1. It relies on Jack's being able to function quasi-normally.

2. The possibility of Liz's (or any LVP prostitute) performing such an act.

3. Both their being willing to engage only 5 feet from an open door with light coming out and music being heard. (Of course, Russian folk songs may have a funny effect on the male libido.)

Thanks.

The best.
LC

[c.d.]

Hello CD. Not bad, but it does leave a bad taste in one's mouth. (Ahem.)

This accounts for many of the loose threads but:

1. It relies on Jack's being able to function quasi-normally.

2. The possibility of Liz's (or any LVP prostitute) performing such an act.

3. Both their being willing to engage only 5 feet from an open door with light coming out and music being heard. (Of course, Russian folk songs may have a funny effect on the male libido.)

Thanks.

The best.


LC

Hi Lynn,

I certainly don't see a prostitute (LVP or otherwise) balking at such an act.

I would suspect that they would have engaged in the deepest, darkest corner of the yard. Liz not being killed till she starts to leave and has already taken steps in the direction of the gate.

As for number one, don't we have ample evidence of other serial killers doing exactly that?

c.d.

[lynn cates]

hay

Hello CD. It is possible. But wouldn't the stable at the end of the yard be the best place for a roll in the hay? (Forgive me, the urge was overwhelming.)

The best.
LC

[c.d.]

Hi Lynn,

The stable doesn't seem the most romantic place to conduct one's business but hey that's just me. And since it takes two to tango, Dutfield's Yard would have been a better choice for Liz -- a privy where she could clean up afterwords and people close by should she need to yell for help.

c.d.

"Roll in the Hay" -- that was a good one.

c.d.

[Mascara & Paranoia]

The only thing that might be a bit of an issue with the scenario is the timing of things, I can't remember how long it was between the broad-shouldered man roughing Liz up till the time that the pony rounded the corner.

Regarding the Ripper funtioning properly, I don't see why he wouldn't, or why he wouldn't want a bit of the old, y'know. I doubt he had erectile dysfunction of any sort and so he probably was interest in sex; his crimes certainly seem to point towards that being the case in a really odd sort of way.

[lynn cates]

Schwartz

Hello M & P.

"I can't remember how long it was between the broad-shouldered man roughing Liz up till the time that the pony rounded the corner."

I suppose one could just ignore the Schwartz story?

"I don't see why . . . he wouldn't want a bit of the old, y'know"

You mean lip service? Hold your tongue!

The best.
LC

[corey123]

Befor I continue I must state my basis`

I truly belive the murders of Martha Tabran, Mary ann Nichols, Annie Chapman, Elizebeth Stride,Catherine Eddowes, and Mary Jane Kelly to be the work of the serial killer known as "jack the ripper". I am going to state my over all theory once, not mutiple times.

In my mind "jack the ripper" was a disturbed man. He had a profound hatred towards the femal race and prostitues in general. All his life pent up anger built up inside the ripper and he relased that anger first by killing Martha. She was the first of a series of murders to release all that pent up anger.

The M.O doesnt matter, only the ritual. The weapon doesnt matter, only the ritual does. He likes to de-feminize and de-humanize these women. He kills for joy and enjoys his feeling of domanice over life whilst doing so, which compells him to kill again and again. The reason JTR used the M.O associated with these murders(C5) is because he was comfortable with it, it played out well with him. I belive the degree of mutilation increase to the scale of Kellys was caused by the location of the crime and how much time was availiable, and also because of the learnt experiance he got with each kill.

In the case of Kelly he took full advantage of the location, fully stripping the flesh off the bones and removing the viscera from the body. He liked the publicly displaying the victems. I also belive he enjoyed the public attention he was recieving, but liked to watch from the sidelines, not throwing himself into the investigation. I dont belive he wished to be caught and I think he carefully exicuted his murders. I even view Kellys murder as public even though it was indoors, which I think he knew that there would be several people who would veiw the body and would creat an uproar in Millers Court, in which it did. My opinion is that those six murders, and maybe more, are connected without a dout. I belive the ripper first killed to relieve himself of that pent up anger then realized that he enjoyed killing which is why he went above and beyond overkill.

He prefered a quick, struggless death by knife but wasnt as rigid as many may think. He killed with a passion to harm these women as much as was physically and mentally possible to him. I know he was a skilled linguistic who led a mostly normal life. He held a weekly job and want suspected.

Im not asking you to belive or go by my theory I just need to state it befor I continue.

yours truly

[perrymason]

I think I can envision a scenario that includes Jack and also explains the cachous, but it would require that Dutfields Yard was not empty as it was noted to be at 12:40am by both Eagle returning and and Lave going back indoors to his cottage.

You could use either Brown or Schwartz with it as well.

The issue would be that the man would almost certainly have been intent on Liz Strides murder but nothing more than that. And for that reason I feel it doesnt work....I dont see any reason to assign a misfire or an anomaly within any series he might have committed without some evidence that such a thing occurred. We dont have either physical or circumstantial evidence that marries well with the other more probable Ripper victims in the murder of Liz.

I feel fairly certain that the killer we look for only killed so he could "rip", and therefore I see no value for him in the murder of Liz Stride. The idea that a misfire caused him to do even more terrible damage to Kate who was next doesnt work either, there are only a few things in that murder that suggest an "escalation" of the mutilations that he performed on Polly and Annie, and he takes what is likely his least amount of time with any victim to accomplish them. If anything, it appears he increased his efficiency if he first kills Liz....hes not demonstrably pissed off and sloppy.

Best regards all.

[corey123]

My senerio

May be that(as I do belive liz to be a ripper victem) that jack(who had only killed three people before her)May have just wanted to try something new,and as you said , the style of kates murder isnt nescicerily sloopy and doesnt show the signs of a enraged assalent.

yours truly

[The Grave Maurice]

I truly belive the murders of Martha Tabran, Mary ann Nichols, Annie Chapman, Elizebeth Stride, and Mary Jane Kelly to be the work of the serial killer known as "jack the ripper"

This is interesting. I don't believe I've ever heard a theory that rules out Eddowes, of all people. Pray continue.

[corey123]

oops

My mistake, I didnt mean to rule out eddowes. Didnt realize I didnt add her, sorry.
I fixed it.

yours truly