The meaning of the GSG wording

[mariab]

Actually, Chris George would prefer to be paid for it, but such is the curse of the poet. And thanks for reminding me to go catch up on his poems. I imagine there’s a ton I haven’t read yet.

The ones I've read over at the JTRForums are from old threads, I'm afraid. What saddens me is that I had to miss his conference presentation (on theatrical depictions of the Ripper), as he spoke early in the morning and I only managed to arrive in London in the evening.

There's also the possibility that the GSG might have said IWES, which eerily ressembles “JEWES“/“JUWES“. This is a fascinating idea originated by another Ripperologist.

I should have mentioned that this is a contribution by Tom Wescott.

The layout with the capital letters at the beginning of each line is also reminiscent of verse.

Which makes me wonder: Are the police renditions of the GSG in capital letters or not?

[Tom_Wescott]

the only reason why we are discussing the writing is because of its proximity to the apron piece.

Well, that might be why you discuss it, but within the framework of the other known evidence, the conclusion that must be reached is ‘The Ripper almost certainly wrote the graffiti’.

As for the police, while some individuals may have been convinced beyond any doubt that the Ripper wrote (as Hainsworth states Macnaghten was, and as Hainsworth himself is), the police as a whole were certainly not. How could they be? How can WE be? We can’t. But operating on probabilities, the probability is certainly that the Ripper wrote it.

I've read some of your poetry over at JTRForums and have noticed your preferance for free verse.

Actually, Chris George would prefer to be paid for it, but such is the curse of the poet. And thanks for reminding me to go catch up on his poems. I imagine there’s a ton I haven’t read yet.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[mariab]

And then there was the controversy about whether the word "Juwes" or "Jewes" referred to the Jews.

There's also the possibility that the GSG might have said IWES, which eerily ressembles “JEWES“/“JUWES“. This is a fascinating idea originated by another Ripperologist. Interestingly enough, I was talking about this with some members of the Whitechapel Society a couple weeks ago, and it's an idea several people have come up with, independently from each other.


I've seen bits and pieces of Trapeze, but don't recall a quote for a triple negative. Ah, “the triple“. Totally get Lancaster/Curtis on this, as I'm working on triple jumps (Toeloop, then Lutz) in ice skating. Will do anything to get there. :-)

[Varqm]

The writer most likely was not well educated . I lean towards the graffito's meaning as either the jews as a people/men won't be blamed and do nothing-they would strike back or the jews are the type of people/men that are blamed for a reason... a reaction about something. No escape .. there is just that small chance the ripper wrote it.

[Steven Russell]

You must have seen Trapeze? It's a great movie where B. Lancaster plays a former trapeze star who takes a young Tony Curtis under his wing. Anyway, he's always on about "The triple".

[mariab]

To Wickerman:
Even the piece of apron is a relatively subtle/obscure piece of evidence. Truly brazen and disturbing would have been to deposit the organs there.

Much has been said about double negatives. What about "not unimpossible"? It's the triple! Burt Lancaster would be proud.

Why Burt Lancaster? I'm getting a headache trying to seize the meaning of "not unimpossible". ;-)

[Steven Russell]

Much has been said about double negatives. What about "not unimpossible"? It's the triple! Burt Lancaster would be proud.

Best wishes,
Steve.

[Wickerman]

So the killer could have been making a statement with the graffito plus the bloodied apron...

Hi Chris.
If you think the apron conveyed the message "hey, look here", with the intent of drawing attention to the graffiti, then I would expect the graffiti to also have this "look at me" quality, large, bold & brazen.
But what we have in the graffiti is a small, insignificant but poetic slur.
The intent doesn't seem to match.

They seem to eminate from two different worlds.

One is brazen and disturbing (apron), while the other is timid & innocuous almost apologetic by it's size (graffiti).

Regards, Jon S.

[mariab]

Hi Maria
Yes I did catch your post that the GSG is written in iambic verse. I am a poet but not a poet who generally writes in meter so I don't judge myself totally qualified to comment on the iambs.

Thank you so much for commenting, Mr. George.
I've read some of your poetry over at JTRForums and have noticed your preferance for free verse.

People back then did often quote poetry in their writings so it's not unimpossible that the metrical pattern is meant. Although, if so, it would indicate, I think, that the writer was educated, doesn't it? Hmmmm.

What I know is that even uneducated Victorians were partly familiar with the “greatest hits“ of theater and opera. It's documented that the Marseillaise and the “revolution duet“ from Auber's opera La muette de Portici {The mute girl from Portici} were frequently sung in Spitalfields, esp. in political intent. I'm also reminded that scenes from Shakespeare's plays were frequently (mis)performed in market fairs, as hilariously depicted by Dickens and in Huckleberry Finn, to cite 2 examples.

The layout with the capital letters at the beginning of each line is also reminiscent of verse.

Wow, this had totally escaped my attention! There is something here...

[ChrisGeorge]

If I'm not mistaken, a Shakespearean pentameter counts as 10 syllables because the last (11th syllable) doesn't count.
To-be-or-not-to-be,-that-is-the-ques-tion. (iambic, technically 11 syllables)
The-Ju-wes-are-the-men-that-won't-be-blamed-for-no-thing. (iambic, technically 13 syllables, in French known as a 12-syllable aléxandrin)
Iambic, 13 syllables is a meter used by Homer (in the original), by the by! Insert a very big LOL here.

The problem with reading it that way is that it can be read the opposite way. "I did it. Blame the Jews for making me do it -- there's a lot to blame the Jews for." Or similar.

Hey, this is how I read it! I wonder what Chris George thinks about the fact that the GSG is a 13 syllable iambic verse and that, in my opinion, the length of the phrase and the double negative might be the result of this fact?

Hi Maria

Yes I did catch your post that the GSG is written in iambic verse. I am a poet but not a poet who generally writes in meter so I don't judge myself totally qualified to comment on the iambs. People back then did often quote poetry in their writings so it's not unimpossible that the metrical pattern is meant. Although, if so, it would indicate, I think, that the writer was educated, doesn't it? Hmmmm.

The layout with the capital letters at the beginning of each line is also reminiscent of verse.

All the best

Chris

[mariab]

"I did it. Blame the Jews for making me do it -- there's a lot to blame the Jews for." Or similar.

Hey, this is how I read it! I wonder what Chris George thinks about the fact that the GSG is a 13 syllable iambic verse and that, in my opinion, the length of the phrase and the double negative might be the result of this fact?

[ChrisGeorge]

In other words, "Stop blaming the Jews for this. I did it... See sample below."

The problem with reading it that way is that it can be read the opposite way. "I did it. Blame the Jews for making me do it -- there's a lot to blame the Jews for." Or similar.

[Hunter]

Hi everyone, Phil.H asked me what message was ment by the graffito, very differcult question to answer, as the graffito could mean so many thing's. One could be the following - Something had ocurred in the East End or was presently happening. The person who wrote the graffito (who could of been many) wanted the blame to be directed to "him" doing the happening's in the East End and not to throw blame on the (whole) Jewish community. All the best, Agur.

In other words, "Stop blaming the Jews for this. I did it... See sample below."

[ChrisGeorge]

True Chris,

The aprons location brings the writing into play, its the reason why it was taken as evidence.

I'm at the football just now, freezing my monkeys off, but if I suggest you read Warrens 6th Oct report, I think Arnolds views are contained in an attachment.

As for Dew, I could have only got it from Connells re work of Dews book I caught Crippen.

I could be wrong but I think Insp Reid held a similar view. Don't hold me to that.

Monty

Thanks, Monty, I'll follow up those leads.

I have long said that the police initially took Dear Boss as the real McCoy, from the killer, despite what some of them later wrote -- because why else would they have put it on a poster asking the public if they recognized the handwriting?

For me, one thing followed from the other: the concensus among the police was that the graffito was by the killer, and that he also wrote the letters. Yes, that might have been a mistake to think that way but nonetheless, it appears to me that's the way their thinking went, at least at first when they saw both the inscription and Dear Boss.

All the best

Chris

[Monty]

True Chris,

The aprons location brings the writing into play, its the reason why it was taken as evidence.

I'm at the football just now, freezing my monkeys off, but if I suggest you read Warrens 6th Oct report, I think Arnolds views are contained in an attachment.

As for Dew, I could have only got it from Connells re work of Dews book I caught Crippen.

I could be wrong but I think Insp Reid held a similar view. Don't hold me to that.

Monty