Key question regarding the BBC 1973 series and the graffito

[drstrange169]

>>Stephen Knight’s involvement with Joseph Sickert commenced a month after the BBC had aired the episode in which Joseph appeared – as Knight makes clear in his book. He had nothing to do with the BBC programme.<<

Thank you Simon, I wasn't sure, the 70's was a loooong time ago.

[jmenges]

I was going from memory, Simon. That's what I called him on our old 'Royal Conspiracy A Go-Go' show (minus the 'senior' bit, my memory conflated the two).
Now that I've had time to look you're of course correct that he's referred to as a "senior Yard man" in Knight's book. In Paul Williams' Suspects: Definitive Guide and Encyclopedia he's called a "Scotland Yard detective" citing Howell & Skinner's Ripper Legacy (a book I don't have handy) and again as a Scotland Yard detective in the 1992 article Good Knight: an Examination of the Final Solution.

JM

[Simon Wood]

Hi Jonathan,

Don't remind me. Hard to believe, I know, but it's over forty years ago, and the memory can play funny tricks.

Thanks for your reply. Hope you're well.

Regards,

Simon

[jmenges]

Thanks, Simon.
I’m doing ok. I hope you are well, too.

JM

[mpriestnall]

Hi drstrange169

Stephen Knight’s involvement with Joseph Sickert commenced a month after the BBC had aired the episode in which Joseph appeared – as Knight makes clear in his book. He had nothing to do with the BBC programme.

Regards,

Simon

I'm not 100% sure, but I thought Stephen Knight was a researcher on the BBC Barlow and Watts show?

Or am I making this up. Anyone?

Martyn

[Sam Flynn]

I'm not 100% sure, but I thought Stephen Knight was a researcher on the BBC Barlow and Watts show?

Or am I making this up. Anyone?

Martyn

Hello Martyn

Can't see anything about that in his IMDB entry, nor in the obit written for him by Richard Whittington-Egan, which suggests that he would have been working as chief writer for the Hornchurch Echo at around the time that the Barlow and Watt programme was being made. Most of the research for the programme was done by experienced screenwriter Elwyn Jones, who also authored the excellent book The Ripper File, which was based on the series.

Obituary here: www.casebook.org/authors/obituaries/knight.html

[FISHY1118]

i think you could be right there

[mpriestnall]

Thanks a lot Sam.

I'm out and about and have no books to check.

OK, I think he may have interviewed for his paper someone associated with the B&W documentary and that was how he got onto it.
He recognized that the newspaper interview/article had more legs and that's what got him started. I think that's it.

Dont' quote me though.

So like Simon said(!) he had no actual connection to the show.

Martyn

[Simon Wood]

Stephen Knight describes in his book how he became involved – and also in an article he wrote for the East London Advertiser, December 7th 1973. Plus the production file for the BBC 1973 documentary series makes it abundantly clear that Ian Sharp and Wendy Sturgess were the lead researchers on the programme.

Hope this sorts it out.

[mpriestnall]

Thanks, Simon.

[Simon Wood]

Hi Herlock,

Joseph Gorman changed his name to Gorman-Sickert in 1970.

Any idea why, at the age of 45, Joseph might have begun thinking he was the son of Walter Sickert?

Regards,

Simon

[GUT]

Jubela, Jubelo and Jubelum would have been known as the "Jubes", not the "Juwes", if anything. The whole "Juwes" thing is utter nonsense.

A work colleague (and friend) was for a few years the highest Mason in the country, I asked him about Jules he said he had never come across it in Masonry, I had no cause to doubt his word.

[APerno]

Hi Herlock,

Joseph Gorman changed his name to Gorman-Sickert in 1970.

Any idea why, at the age of 45, Joseph might have begun thinking he was the son of Walter Sickert?

Regards,

Simon

Hope I am not too obnoxious stepping in; the answer may be money!

1970 was just one year after the files were opened; maybe Knight was already beginning his investigation/conspiracy theory and the two hooked up. Makes the whole show much better if Gorman is legally named Sickert. Maybe the royal conspiracy theory was a Knight-Gorman conspiracy right from the get go! Just speculation.

[PaulB]

Hope I am not too obnoxious stepping in; the answer may be money!

1970 was just one year after the files were opened; maybe Knight was already beginning his investigation/conspiracy theory and the two hooked up. Makes the whole show much better if Gorman is legally named Sickert. Maybe the royal conspiracy theory was a Knight-Gorman conspiracy right from the get go! Just speculation.

I'm not aware of any evidence that Knight and Sickert knew each other prior to Knight interviewing Sickert at the time of the BBC Television series, and having been through Knight's personal papers, I found no suggestion that the two knew each other prior to that time (or that Knight was creating a conspiracy theory, for that matter). The question is a fair one, why did Joseph believe he was the son of Walter Sickert? Why did his family accept that he was the son of Walter Sickert? Why did his wife and children accept their surname being changed by deed poll? When you stop to think about it, changing one's name, one's family's name, doesn't seem something you do lightly or that your family would lightly accept. Did Joseph just wake up one morning and decide he was the son or Walter Sickert? Did he just tell his wife, Edna, 'Oh, by the way, your surname is now Gorman-Sickert'? Or was it a belief of long-standing? If so, what encouraged Joseph to do something about t in 1970? Lots of questions...

[FISHY1118]

Or maybe Joseph Sickert was indeed Walter Sickert son , which if true poses a interesting question , Walter died in 1942 ,Joseph maintained he was told the story by he father Walter when he was 13/14 . Joseph being born in 1925 would make it 1938/9.

Now again, if this is true it means Joseph Sickert, a man nobody ever heard of who lived a life of a virtual recluse, who by Walters account was told an incredible story about who the whitechapel murderer was , then decided to wait 35 years to tell knight so they could both make a few bucks ?

Add to this Jean Overton Fullers mother Violet Fullers life long companion Florence Pash, who claimed Walter Sickert who she associated and spent time with and was a painter in her own right , told her the same story he told Joseph.

So another question beckons , why on earth would Jean Overton Fuller go to all the trouble of researching and publishing her 1991 book based on a story which by that time was being debunked as a made up fantasy by every ripperoligist on the planet ?. One wonders her motives as to why she would expose herself to the same ridicule that both joseph and knight came under....... just for a few bucks

Finally , lets take Joseph out of the picture altogether and go with the theory he lied and made the whole thing up. How then do we explain Florence Pashs exact same lie she told to violet fuller in 1948? according to Jean Overton Fuller.

So now, do we have two people who most likely never met, never knew the other existed ,who were told the same lie from the same source in Walter Sickert 50 years apart?

Im sure ill come under some criticism for even mentioning this topic , it seems to be a taboo subject these days on this forum, where just having a different opinon gets you labeled a crazy conspiracy theory nut . Ah well so be it.