Dear Boss P.S.

Bravo Sir. Imagine that, a killer reacting to more than 1 stimuli? We are dangerously close to making our killer human!

Well spotted Protohistorian. Somehow i can't see good enough reason why a guy would shout out ' Lipski ' if he were JTR to get attention, JTR was sure that no one was around when he was with one of his Victims, he was in need to mutilate and that's what he did, however with Nicholls he may well have been disturbed, so an attempt at mutilating, but it was some time before he struck again with Chapman, so the same night of Stride & Eddowes doesn't exactly tally up to my mind. I'll have to remember that word ' Stimuli ', it's quite correct. It's possible that gang members also didn't like older women doing part time prostitution, i think they may well have been trying to keep order on thier patch so to speak.

[protohistorian]

You paint with bold strokes Shelley, but I would very much doubt myself that this "killer" would only kill by choice. I think the only real argument for him being at Berner must involve some gratification that he never got...because the actual kills themselves seem to be not much more than vehicles for him to facilitate his actual goals, which had to involve cutting and mutilating fresh corpses.

All the best.

Bravo Sir. Imagine that, a killer reacting to more than 1 stimuli? We are dangerously close to making our killer human!

[Mascara & Paranoia]

If he didnt have the time at Berner Street...which is about the only sound argument to use when portraying that crime as a "Ripper" kill, ....then how is it he has time to cut and rip an apron, and not to cut an ear off...or take the nose he almost severed completely.

Not that I think any of these letters are written by the killer, but pretending for a moment that they were, he might've gotten too carried away with mutilating Eddowes and simply forgot to 'clip' her ears off until he was later reminded when writing his little update of his latest 'work' in the Saucy Jacky (wicked name BTW) postcard.

You paint with bold strokes Shelley, but I would very much doubt myself that this "killer" would only kill by choice. I think the only real argument for him being at Berner must involve some gratification that he never got...because the actual kills themselves seem to be not much more than vehicles for him to facilitate his actual goals, which had to involve cutting and mutilating fresh corpses.

All the best.

Well, i have ben called opinionated and i guess that's a fair assumption, learned behaviour from my mother...Drats!
Another reason that i don't think that Stride was a Ripper Killing is because the description of the man that was given who cried ' Lipski ' i don't think he's the right age group, i don't think he was a young man, also i don't think he would have shouted out to get attention either, on the other victims faces, Nichols, Chapman and Eddowes they all had a thumb mark/bruising on thier cheek or jaw, he wasn't going to allow his victims a small squeal, so why would he shout out ' Lipski ' ?

You paint with bold strokes Shelley, but I would very much doubt myself that this "killer" would only kill by choice. I think the only real argument for him being at Berner must involve some gratification that he never got...because the actual kills themselves seem to be not much more than vehicles for him to facilitate his actual goals, which had to involve cutting and mutilating fresh corpses.

All the best.

If the killer they nicknamed "Jack" the Ripper, based on this letter sent to Central News, wrote Dear Boss and Saucy Jack, why werent one of or both of Kates ears taken.

If he didnt have the time at Berner Street...which is about the only sound argument to use when portraying that crime as a "Ripper" kill, ....then how is it he has time to cut and rip an apron, and not to cut an ear off...or take the nose he almost severed completely.

Why would he write suggesting some acts, then commit two murders right after that without them? Yet refer to the act in Saucy Jack as incomplete with only the first kill. I think what these two letters say to me is that whomever wrote Saucy Jack knew some of the Dear Boss content when he did.

Best regards all.

That's a very good point, we only have central news to say that they recieved the postcard on Oct 1st. However, the journalists would get news very quickly and note the injuries and make some of thier own stuff up in so called JTR letters and postcards, still not to miss that once a name has been publicised any hoaxer would latch on to it with what was milling around in his mind anyway. With Eddowes killing he made sure he got what he needed, that's why i don't think that Stride was a ripper killing at all, she was used as just a warning from a gang around the area, it was far better that gangs would use the older ones as warnings, as they couldn't reap in much money with the older ones, the younger ones would have brought in the money & they didn't want to lose that plus younger ones were 13 to a dozen in availability, it's just that the women didn't know that, but fear would work just as well with them to get them to toe the line. Especially when you see that Stride only did it on a part time basis as did others and tried to keep away and solitary from gangs, Stride would have made a good target and warning in this case, my guess is he cried ' Lipski ' because he had every intention of killing her, nothing more and nothing less.

If the killer they nicknamed "Jack" the Ripper, based on this letter sent to Central News, wrote Dear Boss and Saucy Jack, why werent one of or both of Kates ears taken.

If he didnt have the time at Berner Street...which is about the only sound argument to use when portraying that crime as a "Ripper" kill, ....then how is it he has time to cut and rip an apron, and not to cut an ear off...or take the nose he almost severed completely.

Why would he write suggesting some acts, then commit two murders right after that without them? Yet refer to the act in Saucy Jack as incomplete with only the first kill. I think what these two letters say to me is that whomever wrote Saucy Jack knew some of the Dear Boss content when he did.

Best regards all.

I see, so it's the scanning that gives the optical illusion! of the red ink writing, ha. So Tumbelty died a good while after the Ripper killings then, to my mind Tumbelty wasn't suffering with regression as i think that JTR was possibly, i'm certain that JTR would have died soon after, being very ill or committing suicide. I don't think that JTR would have written any letters or postcards, so i'm still convinced that the Dear Boss letter was fabricated likely by Bulling, as someone else pointed out on the boards that the handwriting would have shown a degree of anger, in which i agree as memory would spark off anger, as with the Killing of Eddowes the killer showed a lot of anger, likely triggered by her smell of stale alcohol about her, a memory of his mother perhaps? In any case i think alcohol would have been an issue with many a household, not just the poorer classes.

[Stewart P Evans]

Thanks Stewart,
Ah, yes of course i'd forgotten that it was compiled on a single sheet of paper, so it's only the writing bled through from the otherside ( i've got so used to writing letters on single sheets myself, so my letters end up in two papers or more). However what's the writing that seems to be written on the edge? Is it just blurred and bled through? Or anything else? I'm still convinced that it was written for sensationalism and by the Journalist ' Bulling ' i think his name was. By the way when did Tumbelty die eventually?

The writing isn't written on the edge, it appears to be because I scanned only the half of the letter with postscript on it. Tumblety died on Thursday 28 May 1903 in St Louis.

Thanks Stewart,
Ah, yes of course i'd forgotten that it was compiled on a single sheet of paper, so it's only the writing bled through from the otherside ( i've got so used to writing letters on single sheets myself, so my letters end up in two papers or more). However what's the writing that seems to be written on the edge? Is it just blurred and bled through? Or anything else? I'm still convinced that it was written for sensationalism and by the Journalist ' Bulling ' i think his name was. By the way when did Tumbelty die eventually?

[Stewart P Evans]

One Sheet

I can see on the black & white copy that there is some faint writing under the letter as it is read, is this possibly just some kind of copy smudging at the bottom from the actual letter Stewart?
I can see what you mean about the white tape, however there seems to be faint red ink writing on the far side, just on the edge, but this doesn't seem to show up on the black and white copy, is it possible to get a blown up version of it to see what it may or may not be Stewart?

The 'Dear Boss' letter is written on a single sheet of letter paper and is thus written on both sides, the postscript being at right angles to the actual letter text and written on the bottom half of the second page. Thus all the 'faint writing' that you refer to is actually the script from the first page showing through the paper, nothing more. It has 'bled' through slightly and this shows up a bit more obviously in the colour photo.

Two things that are obvious on the above photo's are the markings made on the actual document by the PRO and the attempt to remove the piece of white repair tape on the fold, which tape also seems to indicate that the letter has been folded after its initial return.

I can see on the black & white copy that there is some faint writing under the letter as it is read, is this possibly just some kind of copy smudging at the bottom from the actual letter Stewart?
I can see what you mean about the white tape, however there seems to be faint red ink writing on the far side, just on the edge, but this doesn't seem to show up on the black and white copy, is it possible to get a blown up version of it to see what it may or may not be Stewart?

I wonder why nobody wants to analyse the stamp on the envelope... It could contain the DNA of Jack. I'm sure they could find a gentle way for doing it, without harming the stamp/envelope.

Many people are able to write several ways. JTR was an intelligent man, I have no doubts. I'm sure he could change his handwriting-style.

The Victorians did not have the type of technology we have today, i think that the DNA issue can be a bit of a loss Chris, as for one we would have to have a good enough validation of a suspect, also DNA is lost over time and maybe non-existent in any of the bits from the JTR case. There has to be a good amount to get a reasonable DNA sample to make a match, then the awful question is what would this DNA sample ( If any possible to draw on) would be matched to, to whom? I think that there may be much too much privacy in consideration towards suspects in testing DNA, then also any body of Government or council would make allowances for such costs to a case that is so old, it would have to be drawn from private funding, however the ' Privacy ' question would not allow for such a substantial search. Besides i do not think that the Dear Boss letter was anything to do with Jack at all, i am sure that this was the sensational work of a Journalist, as i checked years ago it matched the handwriting of ' Bulling ' ( i think that's his name).
There was another case similar to the ripper killings in Victoria London, i believe it was around 1830's of a woman that was found under a cart, so this type of killing had not been unheard of before 1888 ( And in England....i recall it only vaguely).
What i did find interesting in my amatuer handbook of ' Handwriting ' was a letter that was written by Frederick Abberline himself, it sparked an intelligent man with a christian/religious background and also a hand at music, so i wonder if it could ever be found that Abberline played an instrument?

[Stewart P Evans]

Obvious

Two things that are obvious on the above photo's are the markings made on the actual document by the PRO and the attempt to remove the piece of white repair tape on the fold, which tape also seems to indicate that the letter has been folded after its initial return.

[Stewart P Evans]

Significant

Just an observation, but the facsimiles allow us to see the P.S. before the ravages of ageing took hold.
The photos of the Dear Boss letter in Stewart and Keith's book (and my own personal experience at the PRO) reveal that the postscript is virtually unreadable now...
JB

Picking up on this rather significant observation of John's I thought it would be interesting for readers to see the the below images, the first a black and white photograph of the postscript taken in 1988 before the letter was sent to the PRO and the second a colour shot of it in 2000 after the PRO had treated it -