Dear Boss

[lynn cates]

thanks

Hello Joe. Many thanks!

Hope you are well.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

wow

Hello Trade. Good grief! I had no idea that Hurlbert had anything to do with the Parnell Commission.

You may have saved me a good deal of work.

A hearty thanks!

Cheers.
LC

[sleekviper]

Excellent observation Lynn!

[TradeName]

Interestingly, there are reports that Hulbert could vouch for the Parnell letter, having allegedly seen a copy of it in the possession of PJ Sheridan.

The Irish Canadian, Feb 21, 1889, Page 8

Parnell Commission

Somes testimony: "Kirby was paid £250 to go to America to procure from Sheridan the original Parnell letter, a fac simile of which was published in the Times. Mr. Hurlburt [sic] saw this letter."

The Speaker, Volume 9, April 7, 1894, Page 384

This Morning's Paper
By A Mere Outsider

"The Times announces the death of 'Le Caron the spy.' The gentleman whose real name was Beach, was one of the heroes of the Parnell Commission. He may be said the to have shared its hounours with Pigott and Hurlbert. Hurlbert, indeed, was only a hero behind the scenes; his evidence--luckily for himself-- was never given in public; but I suppose his "proof" is still in the possession of the Times solicitor, and he might, as a mere matter of curiosity, let the public have a peep at it."

[lynn cates]

experiment

Hello Michael. A crack forger from this century certainly would.

But I am envisioning an amateur. LVP forgers/forgery detectors concentrated on how to form certain letters. (Eg, Piggott went into a good bit of detail concerning how he had forged the Parnell letters. There are also several examples from the Parnell Commission proceedings where forgery detection was attempted. In every case, individual letter formation is all that was regarded.)

Now, if one is aware of margin, slope and slant, of course one could take corrective measures (difficult though they be) to disguise them. But I am claiming that these three items in particular were little set by (if at all) by contemporary forgers AND in contemporary document examinations.

Here's a thought experiment. Look over some old paper documents you have written. Note the slope of each line (less pronounced on ruled paper) as well as the left margin migration, if any.

What do you notice? Were you consciously aware of this at the time it was written.

Cheers.
LC

[The Good Michael]

My whole point is that even a forger, whist carefully disguising individual letters, would be wholly oblivious to the direction of migration of the margin. It's like pouring coffee or tea and not being aware of which hand does what--we just pour. However, upon careful consideration, we discover we always use one hand to hold, another to pour.

Lynn, if you can observe these things, why couldn't a forger detect them? Assuming a person corresponded by letter often, wouldn't he/she be able to see such things coming from his correspondents and decide to change them?

Mike

[lynn cates]

Are you suggesting margins migrate?

Hello Tom. I see your point. But margins--as well as slope and slant--are little noticed by the writer. Unless I am being self conscious and making a determined effort, my left margin always migrates right.

It has been alleged that Piggott's forged "facsimile" letter of Parnell resembles the "Dear Boss." (That was a contemporary observation.) I have compared those two missives (the formerly graciously provided by Mr. Simon Wood). Some of the carefully crafted individual letters appear the same, but the left margins migrate in opposite directions. That tells me Piggott was not the culprit.

My whole point is that even a forger, whist carefully disguising individual letters, would be wholly oblivious to the direction of migration of the margin. It's like pouring coffee or tea and not being aware of which hand does what--we just pour. However, upon careful consideration, we discover we always use one hand to hold, another to pour.

Whoever wrote the "Dear Boss," carefully, deliberately chose individual letters and perhaps disguised his usual hand. But I think he would have been unaware of slope, slant and margin.

And if this is correct, I think we can rule out straight margins and rightward migrating ones since migration is to the left in the "Dear Boss."

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

thanks

Hello Trade. Thank you. That is very helpful.

Cheers.
LC

[Tom_Wescott]

Hi Lynn,

Dear boss was written slowly and deliberately, so you're not going to expect a flow. The hurridly written post script, however, likely represents the author's true handwriting, as does Saucy jack, which matchs the handwriting of th post script. Any handwriting comparison must be made wtih the post script or post card.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[TradeName]

There are some letters from WH Hurlbert in the Whistler collection at the University of Glascow, but I haven't seen any of them.

http://special.lib.gla.ac.uk/manuscripts/search/resultsn.cfm?NID=8976&RID=&Y1=&Y2=

[lynn cates]

margin-alia

Hello All. Whoever wrote the "Dear Boss" it seems not to be Moore. If you look closely at it, the margin moves slightly left as you go down page. Now if you compare that to the sample of Moore's writing graciously provided by Mr. Stewart Evans on the CNA thread, you'll notice Moore's left margin shifting a good deal to the right.

Individual letters (like y etc) can be made to look like someone else's; but, slope, slant and margin are much more difficult, not to say overlooked.

Do we have a sample of Hurlburt's hand writing?

Cheers.
LC

[YankeeSergeant]

Journalism in 1888

Hi Simon

Where's the journalistic integrity in perpetrating a hoax?

Exactly-great point!!


BTW-I have aquestion for you on the "modern day BS man..." thread.

A splendid point to my mind! I'm not terribly familiar with British journalistic practices of the time but herer in the states, news was determined by what would sell papers. Ten years later journalist and publisher William Randolph Hearst boasted that he "would provide the war if his reporters supplied the story" referring to Spanish "Attrocities" in Cuba Stories were more akion to the stuff put out in scandal sheets than actual news. Again, I'm not accusing the British papers or the CNA of yellow journalism but I am saying the possibility of it and the fact that there was no code of ethics for journalists in those days and journalitic integrity didn't really play into the situation. in my humble opinion,

[caz]

You're saying that no one would believe Le Grand is Stride's killer...

Am I? Then you know what I'm saying better than I do, Tom. So maybe you should just write my words for me. Oh wait, that's what you did.

What you said originally was that nobody should have any trouble accepting Le Grand as Stride's killer. Obviously you are having no such trouble, but you don't get to speak for me or anyone else and I don't see 'em lining up to agree with you that this murder has been solved. You have yet to show from the historical record why it's a done deal and therefore why we should all have no trouble accepting your solution, whether we believe this was a ripper murder or not.

By the way, Stewart is right. My first Casebook post was not until late December 1998, but I can see why it would seem longer to you.

Love,

Caz
X

[Abby Normal]

Hi Abby. The consensus at the time (and now) regarding the 1896 letter is that it was written by a different hand than 'Dear Boss', and of course, 'From Hell' is certainly by a different hand.

Regarding Sugden and Kosminsky, John Malcolm published a rather biting but nevertheless spot on article in the third issue of Casebook Examiner detailing the numerous inaccuracies and leaps of logic made by Sugden regarding Anderson and Kosminsky. As for Stride, not a single author to date has been able to give us an accurate write-up on the Stride murder, but Sugden's is certainly one of the better ones.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

Thank you, Tom

[Tom_Wescott]

LOL. Why would you think you'd have to prove it? I'm not Paul Begg, you know. You sure Caz didn't start in 1997?

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott