Originally posted by Iconoclast
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Originally posted by Iconoclast View Post
There is every possibility that he knew he'd been seen on the evening of the 'double event'. A sketch - purportedly - of the Whitechapel killer was published by the Daily Telegraph on October 6 based almost certainly on the evidence of Matthew Packer which suggested that he had seen Jack's face - so well that Jack wrote a threatening letter to him warning him off continuing to help the police in their enquiries:
You though yourself very clever I reckon when you informed the police. But you made a mistake if you though I dident see you Now I know you know me and I see your little game, and I mean to finish you and send your ears to your wife if you show this to the police or help them if you do I will finish you. It no use your trying to get out of my way Because I have you when you don’t expect it and I keep my word as you soon see and rip you up. Yours truly
Jack the Ripper
The letter could obviously have been a hoax, but it's interesting that the writer claimed "Now I know you know me".
Ike
On checking the dates, I see that the threatening letter was dated October 6, and the Star interview with Schwartz was published five days earlier, on October 1.
The wording of the letter tends to suggest the author was referring to what Schwartz told the Star man:
'Information which may be important was given to the Leman Street police yesterday by an Hungarian concerning this murder... It seems that he had gone out for the day and his wife had expected to move, during his absence, from their lodgings in Berner Street, to others in Backchurch Lane.'
'6 Oct 1888
You though your-self very clever I reckon
when you informed the police But you
made a mistake if you though I dident
see you now I know you know me and
I see your little game, and I mean
to finish you and send your ears to
your wife if you show this to the police
or help them if you do I will finish
you. It no use your trying to get out
of my way Because I have you when
you don't expect it and I keep my
word as you soon see and rip you
up Yours truly
Jack the Ripper'
[vertically down left side] 'You see I know your
address.'
Assuming Schwartz was indeed the intended recipient of this nastiness, he'd have needed someone to translate it for him if he was ever shown it, as he had no English. But if that happened I could see how frightened he'd have been for himself and his wife. If the author had read the early inquest reports in The Times, he would not have found the 'Hungarian' telling his story there. Would this have reassured him, if he was indeed the killer, or made him angry that the police appeared to be protecting a vital witness from being publicly identified, provoking him into firing off that letter?
If it was a hoax, it was a particularly insightful one, but a rotten joke to play on this witness to Stride's assault.
Love,
Caz
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Originally posted by caz View PostHi Ike,
I'm thinking fondly of Nobby's Piles.
Love,
Caz
X
Ike
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Originally posted by caz View Post
Didn't Schwartz flee incontinently from Berner Street? Maybe he ate some grapes too and they loosened him up!
Pip pip.
Love,
Caz
X
Pip pip - I love it! (And yet I don't know why!)
Ike
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Originally posted by Mark J D View Post
Thanks everso! This one is great! :-)
Bests,
M.
Check out Jack the Ripper | Karen T. Taylor, Facial Images (kttfacialimages.com)
Ike
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Originally posted by Iconoclast View Post
Hi Caz,
Yes, quite possibly. I'm sure I've read elsewhere that the letter may have gone to Joseph Lawende.
Personally, I'd have developed chronic double incontinence if I got such a missive, so perhaps we should look for any witness who did not testify?
Ike
Pip pip.
Love,
Caz
X
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Hi Ike,
Of course, if the killer did use the paper bag containing black grapes to transport Eddowes's apron piece and organs safely away from Mitre Square, Trev could add more conjecture to his sanitary napkin theory.
I'm thinking fondly of Nobby's Piles.
Love,
Caz
X
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Originally posted by caz View PostHi Ike,
I wondered if the threatening letter was aimed at the 'Hungarian' [Schwartz], whose story appeared in the Star and described the man he saw assaulting Stride.
Packer may have sold grapes to Stride's killer, but he didn't witness this man mistreating her in any way - quite the opposite if he was treating her to the grapes.
Love,
Caz
X
Yes, quite possibly. I'm sure I've read elsewhere that the letter may have gone to Joseph Lawende.
Personally, I'd have developed chronic double incontinence if I got such a missive, so perhaps we should look for any witness who did not testify?
Ike
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Originally posted by Mark J D View Post
Thanks for this!
My point, though, is still that in the absence of any motivation for killing a specific woman at a specific time, all our man has to do upon 'being seen' is *walk away*, and the need, inter alia, to write threatening letters to nosey greengrocers simply *evaporates*... Nothing happens; no-one sees anything; there's nothing to remember; and he simply tries again with a different woman five blocks away...
-- Anyone got a copy of that sketch published by the Daily Telegraph on October 6?? I'd still like to see it! :-)
Bests,
M.
I'll see if I can find a photograph of the twin sketches (one with and one without a moustache).
Cheers,
Ike
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Hi Ike,
I wondered if the threatening letter was aimed at the 'Hungarian' [Schwartz], whose story appeared in the Star and described the man he saw assaulting Stride.
Packer may have sold grapes to Stride's killer, but he didn't witness this man mistreating her in any way - quite the opposite if he was treating her to the grapes.
Love,
Caz
X
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Originally posted by Iconoclast View Post... There is every possibility that he knew he'd been seen on the evening of the 'double event'. A sketch - purportedly - of the Whitechapel killer was published by the Daily Telegraph on October 6 ... [etc]...
My point, though, is still that in the absence of any motivation for killing a specific woman at a specific time, all our man has to do upon 'being seen' is *walk away* -- whereupon the need, inter alia, to write threatening letters to nosey greengrocers simply *evaporates*... Nothing happens; no-one sees anything; there's nothing to remember; and he simply tries again with a different woman five blocks away...
-- Anyone got a copy of that sketch published by the Daily Telegraph on October 6?? I'd still like to see it! :-)
Bests,
M.Last edited by Mark J D; 05-09-2022, 03:39 PM.
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Originally posted by Mark J D View Post
I'm finding it increasingly difficult to conceive of our man as someone who knows he's been seen and then kills anyway.
I can't make it work, Miller's Court aside (possibly)...
M.
You though yourself very clever I reckon when you informed the police. But you made a mistake if you though I dident see you Now I know you know me and I see your little game, and I mean to finish you and send your ears to your wife if you show this to the police or help them if you do I will finish you. It no use your trying to get out of my way Because I have you when you don’t expect it and I keep my word as you soon see and rip you up. Yours truly
Jack the Ripper
The letter could obviously have been a hoax, but it's interesting that the writer claimed "Now I know you know me".
Ike
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