Before it's too late

[Mayerling]

Thanks Chava.

I do remember when Michael Caine was interviewed, while he was making the 1988 movie, he said that, when he was a kid in London in the 1940s, he and his friends feared that JtR might still be alive and living in their midst.

Hi Stan,

Long time no speak.

Caine, if he was living in or near the East End of London in the 1940s may have been aware (as were his schoolmates) of the four "brownout" murders of Gordon Frederick Cummings of women - that were compared to the Ripper killings at that time and since. Sort of like a complex historical reference point.

Jeff

[Mayerling]

Oh, I see what you mean now. Well . . . why would the person remain silent unless he had/has no idea he met the Ripper.

I mean this whole "Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon" thing, we may have all bumped into various killers in our lives and just not realized it.

--J.D.

Hello all,

There is some truth to that "Six Degrees of Seperation" theory. I will illustrate from my own life. As a baby my mother fed me baby food while I was on her knee. When she was six or seven, she had to accompany her mother when my grandmother was visiting Dr. William Hammond in Manhattan. Dr. Hammond, after talking to my grandmother, turned his attention to my mother and picked her up and placed her on his knee. He told he that in the 1860s, his father was Dr. Charles Hammond, Surgeon General of the U.S. Army, and he would sometimes accompany his father to see the Army of the Potomac on parade. When he did they rode in a carriage with President Abraham Lincoln, who would boost Dr. Hammond's young son on his knee so the little boy would see the soldiers on parade. This means (and I believe it is true) I am just two lives away from Lincoln.

Grandma and my mother saw Dr. Hammond about 1934 or 35. Dr. William Hammond died in 1941 in his 80s.

So you can see that such chains of connections and memory (for what they are worth) do exist - probably more frequently than we think.

Jeff

[Mayerling]

Stan,

The airplain wasn't invinted untill the early 1900's. So, I dont think there would be.

Also, I don't think they had yet invinted a camera that could withstand the elements of arial flight. It would have to be compatable with however many feet the plain flew in the air.

I think I have seen a drawing of Whitechapel drawn by an artist in a hot air ballon.

Not as good or preciese as a photo though.

I believe that the French aeronaut and photographer Nadar (the basis for the character of "Michel Ardan" in his friend's Jules Verne's novels "From the Earth to the Moon" and "Around the Moon") took aerial photographs of Paris from a balloon in the 1860s.

Jeff

[GUT]

G'day Jeff

I believe that the French aeronaut and photographer Nadar (the basis for the character of "Michel Ardan" in his friend's Jules Verne's novels "From the Earth to the Moon" and "Around the Moon") took aerial photographs of Paris from a balloon in the 1860s.

I'm not sure it was by Nadar but I have a glass plate from mid 1800's over France somewhere in my collection.

[Ginger]

I'm not sure it was by Nadar but I have a glass plate from mid 1800's over France somewhere in my collection.

There does exist a well-preserved photograph of Boston taken from a balloon in October of 1860. http://www.metmuseum.org/collections...ections/283189

[Brenda]

So you can see that such chains of connections and memory (for what they are worth) do exist - probably more frequently than we think.

Jeff

That was an awesome story! Thanks for telling it. Lincoln seemed to be such a kind man....one of a kind.

[GUT]

G'day Jeff

My Great Grandfather sat on the knee of the King.

[Mayerling]

My Great Grandfather sat on the knee of the King.

Now you have raised my curiosity. The posibilities (depending on life expectancies and generations) would be these:

George IV (regent - 1810 to 1820) (king - 1820 - 1830)
William IV (king - 1830 - 1837)

Both seem to distant in time, but still possible.

Edward VII (1901 - 1910)
George V (1910 - 1936)
Edward VIII (1936)
George VI (1936 - 1951)

My bet woud be Edward VII, but possibly William IV. William (the "Sailor King" liked children (he and his wife Queen Adelaide had no children, though William had a number by a mistress). George IV had one legitimate daughter (Charlotte) who predeceased him, dying in childbirth in 1814 (her baby died as well). George IV was not really known for his fondness for children. Edward VII did have children (his eldest son pops up on this board somewhat), and was a good grandfather. He also had a sense of fun, so I could see him playing with a child. George V had five children and strikes me as quite serious. But as this was a great grandfather Edward VII would be the last more recent monarch to have been the choice. I'd go with King William.

Of course, if this is really far back it might be George III before 1810 (when his last bout of insanity began).

Jeff

[GUT]

G'day Jeff

Just checked my post and it should have been Great Great Grandfather sorry I was told about it by my Great Grandfather.

So do you want to guess again.

[Mayerling]

G'day Jeff

Just checked my post and it should have been Great Great Grandfather sorry I was told about it by my Great Grandfather.

So do you want to guess again.

Well if it is a great, great, grandfather, that would be five generations from that party to you. Let us be generous and say 25 years per generation so we have 125 years here. But you appear to be (if I can guess without offence) over 50. We are talking 175 years at least. From 2014 that would be in the early 19th Century (1839?). But that is two years after King William IV died so I am guessing now you have to be at least my age (I just turned 60). It would still seem to be King William IV more than likely.

How close was I?

I can't boast of any really well known ancestors, but oddly enough King George IV had a private secretary named "Sir Benjamin Bloomfield". Since my last name was originally "Blumenfeld" I question any connection. This (of course) is through my father's side of the family (through his father).

Jeff

[GUT]

G'day Jeff

Actually George III my 3xG Grandfather was chaplain to one of his sons [The last King of Hanover] and after becoming well acquainted with George III in Weymouth and His Majesty appointed him to an additional living .

[Mayerling]

G'day Jeff

Actually George III my 3xG Grandfather was chaplain to one of his sons [The last King of Hanover] and after becoming well acquainted with George III in Weymouth and His Majesty appointed him to an additional living .

Hi Gut,

Ernest, Duke of Cumberland (and ancestor of the present Cumberland line - the only son of George III to leave a direct legitimate male line to that monarch) was King Ernest I of Hanover from 1837-1851 when he died. Hanover did not allow female rulers like England did, so Victoria lost her potential fifth royal throne there. But Ernest was not the last King of Hanover. His son George ruled as George V of Hanover (1851-1866), when Bismarck had Prussia seize and annex Hanover as part of Prussia (due to Hanovarian support for Austria in the Seven Weeks War). King George V was blind and known as the "Blind King of Hanover".

Despite protests from Victoria Prussia went ahead with the seizure. The ex-royal house of Hanover was still recognized as the de facto royal family, but that was about it. They still had the title of Dukes of Cumberland, but that ended in 1914 when they supported Germany against England in the Great War. Relations between the cousin Hanovarians and the Windsors (ex-Saxe Coburg; ex-Hanovarians) remained bad as the Cumberlands also supported Germany in the Second World War. It was not until the 1950s that reconciliation efforts began - although the Cumberland title was not restored the German Cumberlands are welcomed back at the British court. The present head of the German family married one of the Princesses of Monaco a decade back - thus linking the family to film star Grace Kelly as well.

Jeff

[GUT]

Spot on Jeff.

Year of Birth Relation

1809 2x Great Grandfather

1853 Great Grandfather was the 6th child

1883 Grandfather was 4th child

1929 Father was 4th child

So you can see they were all rather old when the next generation was born.

[Mayerling]

Spot on Jeff.

Year of Birth Relation

1809 2x Great Grandfather

1853 Great Grandfather was the 6th child

1883 Grandfather was 4th child

1929 Father was 4th child

So you can see they were all rather old when the next generation was born.

Thanks for putting it strait Gut. Actually your father was born only three years after mine and only one year after my mother.

I made a slight error in describing Ernest, Duke of Cumberland and King of Hanover's family. His younger brother, Adolphus, Duke of Cambridge, had one legitimate son too, who succeeded to the title of Duke of Cambridge and was the General-in-chief of the British Army during much of his cousin Victoria's reign. But George, Duke of Cambridge, survived his only legitimate son, and his title died with him in 1904.

I once knew a lady who claimed her husband was descended from the Tudors.

Jeff

[sdreid]

There does exist a well-preserved photograph of Boston taken from a balloon in October of 1860. http://www.metmuseum.org/collections...ections/283189

That picture is remarkably clear considering the balloon was moving and exposure times in 1860 were long compared to a few years later.