Where did the Ripper likely live?

[GregBaron]

Tight timeline...

I like Fleetwood’s scenario and agree with Ruby that it might be 50/50 that Lawende saw the murderer. The timeline is awfully tight and as Fleetwood says; they are having an amicable chat at 1:35. And didn’t Morris say he typically heard the footsteps of the cops on their beats, yet with the door open at 1:42 or 1:43 he neither hears nor sees anything……….perhaps the ripper and Eddowes came in from Mitre Street? Let’s face it, Victorian unfortunates probably looked a lot alike from behind. Maybe the police convinced Lawende he saw the murderer because they wanted him to have?

Ben may indeed be right that this isn’t the most likely scenario but I don’t think it can be ruled out.

Also, I think Jack attacked from the front as Chapman and Nichols seem to indicate. With the position of Eddowes, if they walked from Church passage Jack would have had to turn around, if they came from Mitre Street Eddowes would have had to turn around, which is more likely in this sort of transaction? I don’t know? Now some think Eddowes was attacked from behind which makes moot this argument.

By the way, I hope the thread barer isn't too displeased that we seemed to have veered off topic...

Greg

[Fleetwood Mac]

the timing is simply too tight for someone else to quickly sneak in.

It's the other way round.

If the couple seen by Lawende are Jack and Kate, then he has from 1.35(and a few seconds for the 3 fellas to leave) to 1.44 (less a few seconds before Watkins discovers the body and looks at his watch - to get her into the corner, kill, mutilate, gather up the organs, leave.

If the couple were not Kate and Jack, then he has the same as above except he has the possibility of an earlier start - 1.32.

It really does rest on Lawende's testimony.

[Fleetwood Mac]

And didn’t Morris say he typically heard the footsteps of the cops on their beats

Great point, Greg, which I hadn't thought of.

If the couple are Kate and Eddowes, they have to walk fairly close to the warehouse to get to the corner. So, why doesn't he hear them? Is it because the couple entered the square through Mitre Street? Mind you, I suppose typically leaves room for not every time.

[GregBaron]

Slip sliding away...

Well Fleetwood, the typically was mine. Here is what came from a press report given to police. Disregard the dangling modifier.

As a rule he could hear the footsteps of the policeman as he passed on his beat every quarter of an hour, so the it appeared impossible that the woman could have uttered any sound without his detecting it.

Perhaps as a rule and typically are the same thing? It does seem more likely to me he would hear a couple coming from Church passage than simply around the corner from Mitre Street. You would think that shoes, especially women's, would click on the cobblestones, yet, wasn't it raining that morning!, perhaps that's the solution?

Greg

[Rubyretro]

I feel really guilty about replying to this, as it is totally 'off thread'...nevertheless it is too tempting..

...but in the silence of the stillness of that night, enclosed by all those mineral hard surfaces, anybody crossing that square would of made one hell of a noise. And the nightwatchman could hardly have had his radio on.
How could he not hear people passing near his door ?

We might hazard a guess that Jack was particularly quiet, sneaky, and silent...but he couldn't have silenced Eddowes walking across that square :
even if she unwittingly colluded with her attacker by trying to keep quiet she may have said a word, rustled her skirt, clattered her boots, stumbled on the cobbles (she couldn't have been entirely well so soon after being so drunk). Arguably, it would be more difficult than manoeuvring Liz a few feet behind that gate.

I don't think that he wanted to get caught, otherwise he would have been.

It seems alot less dangerous to come into Mitre Square from the other end and turn straight away to the darkest place and kill Eddowes as quickly as possible. That minimised all the risks of being heard or seen. It's way more logical.

Infact the only thing that defies that logic (seemingly) is Lawende's Witness Statement coupled with the timing. But Lawende might never have seen JTR and Eddowes.

[Lechmere]

Yes - that does make more sense - entry via Mitre Street. I tend to be sceptical about all the wtnesses.

[Monty]

Morris stated he had duties within the counting house and offices. He only went near the door, to put in ajar, moments before Watkins arrived.

Are we serious expecting Morris to be on sentry?

Monty

[Trevor Marriott]

I have come to the conclusion that he lived in a house with a door with windows one two three and four ready to knock turn the lock its playschool.

Now as there were at least four murders one can assume that on the first he wemt out through the round window and then for the second the square window and so onn

[Phil Carter]

Hello Trevor,

Watch out for Big Ted (known for our sakes as Anderson) and Little Ted (Swanson), who may have been influenced by
Jemima, the ragdoll with long red and white striped legs. (Macnaughten)
However, Hamble (Warren) was a little doll and one of the original five toys replaced by Poppy (Monro). Hamble was chosen as representative of a more "downtrodden", humble background than the "middle-class" associations that the teddy bears had.
Humpty (a famous Ripperologist), a dark green large egg-shaped soft toy (known in the Sixties as a 'Gonk') with green trousers, to look like Humpty Dumpty from the nursery rhyme
Poppy, a black doll who replaced Hamble in the later years of the series in response to changing attitudes in society (the Hamble doll was also getting rather fragile at this point... not suprising after her constant to-do's with Big Ted and Little Ted)...

Sounds like the Ripper murders doesn't it. Complete with the Ripper investigation team.


kindly


Phil

[Ben]

If the couple seen by Lawende are Jack and Kate, then he has from 1.35(and a few seconds for the 3 fellas to leave) to 1.44 (less a few seconds before Watkins discovers the body and looks at his watch - to get her into the corner, kill, mutilate, gather up the organs, leave.

In other words, plenty of time, Fleets.

[Colin Roberts]

I have come to the conclusion that he lived in a house with a door with windows one two three and four ready to knock turn the lock its playschool.

Now as there were at least four murders one can assume that on the first he wemt out through the round window and then for the second the square window and so onn

I will ask again:

Just what sort of police department would actually condescend to having a moron such as yourself on its payroll?

[Trevor Marriott]

I will ask again:

Just what sort of police department would actually condescend to having a moron such as yourself on its payroll?

Only the very best

[Colin Roberts]

I will ask again:

Just what sort of police department would actually condescend to having a moron such as yourself on its payroll?

Only the very best

~~~

As this thread has been irretrievably hijacked:

For those that would actually care to stay on topic, and discuss the elusive 1888 residence of 'Jack the Ripper':

"Where did the Ripper likely live?" - Take Two

[Trevor Marriott]

~~~

As this thread has been irretrievably hijacked:



"Where did the Ripper likely live?" - Take Two

You sure you havent got my pic mixed up with Stewart Evans lol

[Malcolm X]

JTR has plenty of time to kill..... about 9 mins, but it's not much time for this suspect with Eddowes to leave and for someone else to quickly leap in/lead her away and mutilate her.....it can be done yes, but it's tight.

i'm much happier with this suspect being JTR.

JTR would not only hear the policeman walking, he'd also see his light and from quite a way off too.