Mile End Vigilance Committee

[Tom_Wescott]

There have been suspicions issued that the Lusk letter cum kidney might have been a hoax organized by Joseph Aarons and his sidekicks. For Aarons' sidekicks there is plenty of evidence of a criminal past. Aarons himself needs to be researched better.

Le Grand was certainly not a 'sidekick' of Aarons. Not to be nitpicky, but...

As for Aarons, he was forced to sell his pub in 1889. Damn shame he didn't get that reward money!

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[mariab]

Le Grand was certainly not a 'sidekick' of Aarons. Not to be nitpicky, but...

I know, Tom. I just said “sidekick“ instead of Le Grand as I didn't know if you wanted me to mention all of this on the boards yet...

Motivation aside, forming a vigilance committee was a very civic idea. But the end result of their efforts are three (or more) of the biggest hoaxes in Ripperology that succeeded in sending police off on the wrong track - Packer, the Batty Street Lodger, and the From hell kidney.

Completely agree. It was a very civic idea which became a financial venture. And, as criminals were involved (Le Grand and his sidekicks), it degenerated into deception.

[YankeeSergeant]

Aarons

I know, Tom. I just said “sidekick“ instead of Le Grand as I didn't know if you wanted me to mention all of this on the boards yet...


Completely agree. It was a very civic idea which became a financial venture. And, as criminals were involved (Le Grand and his sidekicks), it degenerated into deception.

Didn't Aarons end up as landlord for another pub later on? Is there basis for the Lusk postcard, letter and kidney being a hoax and if so being perpetrated by Aarons? I would thnik that being somewhat prominant in the area as a landlord of a pub that he would keep a low profile especially as the Jewish community was worried about anti-Semitic riots and such. And Monty, I WILL be picking your brain and may send you the rough of the chapter on Lusk if that is alright.

[mariab]

Is there basis for the Lusk postcard, letter and kidney being a hoax and if so being perpetrated by Aarons?

The “box of toys“ postcard has not survived. There is circumstantial evidence which allows to suspect that Aarons and the criminally inclined Le Grand could have orchestrated the Lusk letter/kidney as a hoax, although Joseph Aarons needs more researching. What's suspicious is also that they immediately run to The Evening News with the kidney, instead of the police. Incidentally, The Evening News was the newspaper where Le Grand had planted his stories about Packer's (false) testimony, the grapestalk supposedly collected by Le Grand after Stride's murder, and the Batty Street Lodger. (Actually the Batty Street Lodger was first mentioned in The Northern Eastern Gazette, but also in The Evening News.)

And Monty, I WILL be picking your brain and may send you the rough of the chapter on Lusk if that is alright.

Might I inquire what kind of chapter? Are you writing a book?
At least it's cool that Monty can be reached per PM.

[Tom_Wescott]

Is there basis for the Lusk postcard, letter and kidney being a hoax and if so being perpetrated by Aarons?

Yes, of course there is. And pub owners were not considered prominent or respectable citizens, which is why Lusk was the 'president' and Aarons only the 'treasurer'. That and Lusk was a talented writer, which was necessary for all the plea letters being written.

Monty's essay 'Defenceless Whitechapel', which covers not only the WVC but the other committees around that time is a great read and quite valuable for sources not available elsewhere. But his write-up on what occurred after Lusk received the kidney/letter is all wrong. Just an FYI since this might be a primary source for your work.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[mariab]

Tom, do you recall in which Rip did Monty's essay Defenseless Whitechapel come out? Was it an electronic issue?
Also, where from do we know that Lusk was a talented writer?

[Monty]

Yes, of course there is. And pub owners were not considered prominent or respectable citizens, which is why Lusk was the 'president' and Aarons only the 'treasurer'. That and Lusk was a talented writer, which was necessary for all the plea letters being written.

Monty's essay 'Defenceless Whitechapel', which covers not only the WVC but the other committees around that time is a great read and quite valuable for sources not available elsewhere. But his write-up on what occurred after Lusk received the kidney/letter is all wrong. Just an FYI since this might be a primary source for your work.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

In what way?

Monty

[Monty]

Hi Maria,

While I'm clearly not the expert on the WVC that Monty is, I believe I can state that the WVC did not use the Berner Street club as a 'meeting place', but instead would have taken the stage to speak to the attendees about becoming patrolmen for the WVC. As Monty could no doubt confirm, the Berner Street club would often hold open air speeches on the Mile End Road and lead marches that would terminate there. This is where Joseph Aarons' pub was located. Aarons would be quoted in anarchist newspapers, suggesting sympathy with the cause. All this and the fact that their respective premises were only a mile apart suggests the top brass of the IWEC and the WVC were well-known to each other.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

Ego Thomas.....ego.

Its slipping Son.

Whilst Dons word do flatter, Im afraid that I have to point out that there is no expert on any aspect within this field.

We are all learning as we proceed.

Monty

[mariab]

Hey, Monty's back! (Even if briefly.) Just so you know, we totally conspired for this, and you've bitten.

Quote Tom Wescott:
While I'm clearly not the expert on the WVC that Monty is, I believe I can state that the WVC did not use the Berner Street club as a 'meeting place', but instead would have taken the stage to speak to the attendees about becoming patrolmen for the WVC.
No worries, Monty, we might eventually figure it out, as there are also plans for translating a few issues of Der Arbeter Fraint. (Which will take forever.)

[The Grave Maurice]

We are all learning as we proceed.

I guess that's true of you guys. Me, I'm struggling to retain the scraps of knowledge that I already have.

[mariab]

And I'm struggling to acquire a modicum of motivation to do some work. I feel sooo lazy lately, I spent most of the weekend asleep. (I even cancelled going out.)

[Adam Went]

Chris:

Well said.

Maria:

I think you would be surprised at just how many people derive their beliefs on the JTR case from movies and fiction books. Don't get me wrong, the Michael Caine film is easily my favourite on the JTR case, but under no circumstances should it be used for factual accuracy, be it Lusk and the MEVC or anything else - no movie should be.

Tom:

Well everybody is in to make a quid where they can, that's hardly limited to the efforts of Lusk and his group in 1888. Their primary focus was to apprehend the killer. Remember, they weren't just thinking for themselves - most of them would have had wives, daughters, mothers, sisters, etc etc who were all at risk and in fear of death by the hand of Jack - that, I believe, would have been their major motivation. I can't imagine Lusk sitting down at their first meeting and saying "Right gentlemen, how can we make some money out of this?". A slightly cynical view, IMO.

Cheers,
Adam.

[mariab]

Adam,
as it happens, I haven't yet managed to see the JTR mini-series with Michael Caine, despite it being famous (even my mom has seen it!).
As for Lusk, it appears to me that he was the innocent in the equation. Joseph Aarons as a publican would have been aware of Le Grand's pimp activity. Obviously all of this requires more research, esp. details pertaining to Joseph Aarons.

[ChrisGeorge]

Didn't Aarons end up as landlord for another pub later on? Is there basis for the Lusk postcard, letter and kidney being a hoax and if so being perpetrated by Aarons? I would thnik that being somewhat prominant in the area as a landlord of a pub that he would keep a low profile especially as the Jewish community was worried about anti-Semitic riots and such. And Monty, I WILL be picking your brain and may send you the rough of the chapter on Lusk if that is alright.

Thank you, Maria, Adam, and Justin.

I actually think it might be an outrageous idea to suggest that Aarons was behind the Lusk postcard, letter and kidney. Just think about it: he was an officer of an organization that had been formed to stop the Ripper outrages. So do you really think that he would send such things to his friend and colleague who is the head of the organization? It's one thing to say a journalist might have sent Dear Boss or have hyped up the stories about Leather Apron... the newsmen were after all selling newspapers that carried the stories about the Ripper crimes, so it was good for their business. But the Vigilance Committee was trying to do the opposite, put an end to the Ripper and his crimes.

All the best

Chris

[Tom_Wescott]

Hi Chris and Adam. I completely understand your points of view. After all, I've read the same books you have and am used to the WVC being presented as beleagured heroes. But let's take a step back and put things in their proper perspective. The ONLY reason we know the WVC so well and the ONLY reason they occupy such an important position in Ripperology is because they received that kidney. Because of this, their importance in the case has been magnified significantly. In the old days, it was often asked why the Ripper or a hoaxer would send a kidney to Lusk. The group was not particularly respected or known and was certainly no threat to the Ripper. A hoaxer who worked to obtain a human kidney would surely get more milleage from it by mailing it to the press, Scotland Yard, or to a specific investigator. But to Lusk? It doesn't make sense until you ask yourself WHO gained from the kidney. The only answer is the WVC.

And what do you really know about Joseph Aarons? He owned and operated a pub in the slums. It was he who started the vigilance committee, chaired the first meeting, saw Lusk elected president, and himself treasurer, in charge of the money. It was he who played the press to elicit donations from the public, and it was he who lied to the press about the kidney undoubtedly coming from Eddowes. It was he who hired one of the most dastardly criminals in existence at the time who would later become a suspect for the murders themselves. THIS is what we know for certain about Joseph Aarons. If I were to lay out the evidence from the month of October, 1888, any rational mind would find it quite easy to believe that Aarons and Le Grand perpetrated the kidney hoax, and the motive would be quite obvious. This is no Phil Carter Fenian fantasy, this is real evidence.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott