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  • Most crucial points

    What single point, if you could chose one, is the most difficult theme in Ripperology to sort out? Here, I ask for a specific point, not a generalisation (i.e. What Jacks identity was).. I have put a few examples on the poll, but by all means come with others.

    Thank you for your considerations.

    best wishes

    Phil
    26
    Sir Robert Anderson
    0.00%
    0
    Authentication of "newly discovered" material
    3.85%
    1
    A serial killer/ more than one killer/various killers
    19.23%
    5
    A cover-up or not by one or more officials
    11.54%
    3
    Differences in case conclusions between authors
    3.85%
    1
    Medical knowledge or not
    3.85%
    1
    The missing files/the SD Files
    38.46%
    10
    The differing opinions of the police as to who Jack was
    7.69%
    2
    The letters supposedly from "Jack"
    0.00%
    0
    Your own choice of sticking point
    11.54%
    3
    Chelsea FC. TRUE BLUE. 💙


    Justice for the 96 = achieved
    Accountability? ....

  • #2
    I voted serial killer or not because most of the others aren't rellevant without it or are skewed one way or the other because of it.

    P. S. Hang in there Phil. People are listening to you.
    Best Wishes,
    Hunter
    ____________________________________________

    When evidence is not to be had, theories abound. Even the most plausible of them do not carry conviction- London Times Nov. 10.1888

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi Phil,

      you know what ?

      I voted "cover up or not"...not that I believe in any cover-up (sorry!) but because I've just come across an interview of Warren (in the French press) about Toff-the-Ripper...
      I'm still shocked!

      Amitiés,
      David

      Comment


      • #4
        David,

        I can't wait to see it! If it is anything like the last one David, we are in for a treat!

        Hunter, just hanging loose...just hanging loose!

        best wishes

        Phil
        Chelsea FC. TRUE BLUE. 💙


        Justice for the 96 = achieved
        Accountability? ....

        Comment


        • #5
          Hi Phil,

          I'll post it tonight...you'll see...incredible!

          Amitiés,
          David

          Comment


          • #6
            David, Phil,

            I put Serial killer, multi.

            Becuase there are so many opinions. So little to make one by. So much arguing about it.

            I agree with Hunter.

            I are Pro-Jack serial killer!!!!.

            David,

            Wounderful article, just read it. Amazing.
            Washington Irving:

            "To a homeless man, who has no spot on this wide world which he can truly call his own, there is a momentary feeling of something like independence and territorial consequence, when, after a weary day's travel, he kicks off his boots, thrusts his feet into slippers, and stretches himself before an inn fire. Let the world without go as it may; let kingdoms rise and fall, so long as he has the wherewithal to pay his bills, he is, for the time being, the very monarch of all he surveys. The arm chair in his throne; the poker his sceptre, and the little parlour of some twelve feet square, his undisputed empire. "

            Stratford-on-Avon

            Comment


            • #7
              I chose the missing files. If we had all of those, most of the other 'sticking points' would cease to stick.

              Yours truly,

              Tom Wescott

              Comment


              • #8
                Hello Tom,

                Yup, I'm with you on this one.

                best wishes

                Phil
                Chelsea FC. TRUE BLUE. 💙


                Justice for the 96 = achieved
                Accountability? ....

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hello all,

                  Just to give an intermediate rapport of things, it seems some things interesting are occuring with the voting in this poll, which is exactly what I had hoped for.

                  So far, according to this poll, at this moment in time, 18 votes have been cast.
                  NONE for Sir Robert Anderson, who's mere mention on other threads shows a very large "two camp" situation, a for and against his comments about Jack being taken seriously or not..yet here, not so important at all. That tells us that Anderson's opinions are not, atm, the most important factor in sorting out the whole case.
                  The letters, a few of which are regarded by some as being a vital clue to Jack's identity and personality, are again not deemed important enough for the case.
                  Likewise, differences of opinion between authors as to Jack's identity causes no major problems with Ripperologists.

                  Overwhelmingly, the missing files /SD files are deemed the greatest importance so far, with double the amount of votes cast over the next most voted for, (the serial killer/more than one killer/various killers).

                  It will be interesting to see the progression of this poll.
                  Many thanks for all those who have cast their vote, and for the opinions so far raised.

                  best wishes

                  Phil
                  Chelsea FC. TRUE BLUE. 💙


                  Justice for the 96 = achieved
                  Accountability? ....

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I wanted to agree with all those who voted for the missing files. I think that if they are ever recovered we will put to bed alot of our questions and debates. My isssue with voting them the most crucial is that if they where ever recovered they would then need to be authenticated which is why I voted "Authentication of "newly discovered" material", both catagories would go hand in hand IMHO anything "newly discovered" would most likely be from the missing files and any recovered files would have to be authenticated.
                    'Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - beer in one hand - chocolate in the other - body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming 'WOO HOO, What a Ride!'

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Hello smezenen,

                      Logical and rational point you make. The SD files however, at Kew, are those that we must suppose to be genuine whatever, because they have never been seen, as far as we know, by any living researcher. With regards to the missing files, purloined, then all those files are stamped, officially I believe. I do not know, however, when this stamping occured, and perhaps someone else could help with this point. I presume that it was done a long time before anyone ever saw the files i the 1970's. (With exception to Douglas Browne, who had access to the files in or around 1956)

                      best wishes

                      Phil
                      Chelsea FC. TRUE BLUE. 💙


                      Justice for the 96 = achieved
                      Accountability? ....

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I believe a crucial reason why the case was unsolved,was the reluctance of witnesses to come forward.BS,Pipeman,for example.I am sure the innocent party in Berner street could have given valuable information.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Phil Carter View Post
                          Hello smezenen,

                          Logical and rational point you make. The SD files however, at Kew, are those that we must suppose to be genuine whatever, because they have never been seen, as far as we know, by any living researcher. With regards to the missing files, purloined, then all those files are stamped, officially I believe. I do not know, however, when this stamping occured, and perhaps someone else could help with this point. I presume that it was done a long time before anyone ever saw the files i the 1970's. (With exception to Douglas Browne, who had access to the files in or around 1956)

                          best wishes

                          Phil
                          Phil,
                          Thanks for your post. I haven’t been privileged enough to see any of the actual files only what is available online so I wasn’t sure how the police departments back then marked evidence but If the files are stamped then yes I would agree that authentication is not an issue.
                          Can anyone comment on the methods used in LVP London to mark evidence? Was it marked immediately or after the inquest was completed.
                          In the department I currently work in we receive the evidence in a bags or envelopes that have been sealed at the crime scene. The policy is to not mark the evidence but rather the bag or envelope; it has to do with preserving microscopic evidence and not altering the material when possible. I haven’t been in the business long so I don’t know the procedures used by other departments farther up the chain, but I do believe the evidence itself is given a more permanent mark after it has been fully processed and is going to either long term storage (cold cases) or to court as trial evidence.
                          Last edited by smezenen; 02-01-2010, 02:30 PM.
                          'Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - beer in one hand - chocolate in the other - body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming 'WOO HOO, What a Ride!'

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Hello smezenen!

                            This case took place so long time ago, that one cannot avoid the missing files!

                            All the best
                            Jukka
                            "When I know all about everything, I am old. And it's a very, very long way to go!"

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hello smezenen,

                              Thank you for your reply.
                              It is a sad reflection of the times I fear, that the handling of the papers and the files in the LVP, naturally, leave much to be desired, compared to today's standards..

                              If one also combines the police at the time taking things out, and over the years just about every Tom, Dick and Harry pouring all over them, it is no wonder that their condition is as it is.
                              That is why I have consistently asked, publically, for ALL the papers to be returned to the files, anonymously, before they get completely destroyed and are of no historical value to anyone.

                              There are people out there that do read these forums, that either know of the whereabouts of the missing papers, or have them tucked away themselves. Unfortunately, there seems to be a total disregard to the word honesty for some. Keeping them serves no purpose any more... except to sell them "underground", because they can never come on the "legal market" to be sold. And those who have bought them from others, have spent much money for them, and are unwilling to hand them in without a return on their outlay, I guess.
                              That only leaves concience.
                              I am convinced that part of the reason these files were taken in the first place, is NOT because the name of JTR is in there, but would actually explain all the holes in the case, and would help us find the reason for the whole thing.
                              What I call the revealing of The mystery of the myth.

                              I can only keep calling out and hope that someone hears.

                              best wishes

                              Phil
                              Chelsea FC. TRUE BLUE. 💙


                              Justice for the 96 = achieved
                              Accountability? ....

                              Comment

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