Before Jack started his killing spree

[DVV]

Well, that's rather obvious for the torsos, no need to discuss that...
McKenzie? Stride ?
Certainly not!
Mutilation means something has been removed or excised.
If you don't believe me, check a dictionary.

Amitiés,
David

[Pontius2000]

Well, that's rather obvious for the torsos, no need to discuss that...
McKenzie? Stride ?
Certainly not!
Mutilation means something has been removed or excised.
If you don't believe me, check a dictionary.

Amitiés,
David

yes, you're correct, I forgot about Stride. if she indeed WAS a Ripper victim. she was not mutilated.

the basic point is that we disagree about McKenzie. I say she was mutilated. though to a much lesser degree than MOST of the Ripper victims.

[Hunter]

mutilation

Hello everyone,

I think "savagery" would be the correct word over mutilation. The press on reporting about the Tabram murder stated that nothing like it had been seen for many years. What linked the 1888 murders, in the minds of contemporaries was how furious these attacks were compared to what came before. There were the "High Rip Gangs" that beat and sometimes stabbed unfortunate women and , indeed, through the Nichols murder these gangs were suspected to some degree. After Chapman, however, it was obvious to all that they were dealing with a different sort- a lone "maniac" - with no rhyme or reason for the killings.

The furiousness and the fact that they occurred in quick order led them to believe that one "maniac" had done them all- including Stride, who was not mutilated.

Best Wishes,
Hunter

[claire]

I think you're right, Hunter. It's not so much the definition of the term mutilation, but the signature of the murders that help to link them together. For me, the torso murders (as far as I know) involved dismemberment, for reason unknown, but not the sort of savage attack to the torso itself that we associate with 4 of the C5 and, indeed, with Tabram.

Personally, I'm dubious about including Emma Smith in the analysis, since that sort of knife savagery was not part of the attack on her, along with the fact that she stated she'd been assaulted by a number of assailants.

[ditlew]

Wikipedia says: 'Mutilation or maiming is an act or physical injury that degrades the appearance or function of any living body, usually without causing death.'

Personally I find that any deliberate damage done to the victim after death can be called mutilation. But I'm sure we all can guess the idea behind the thread and hence there should be no need to be discussing the definition of a word.

Where can one read more about those torso murders?

Best Regards,
Ditlew

[Uncle Jack]

The word 'mutilate' can also mean "To disfigure by damaging" which would apply to all the victims save Emma Smith. A cut throat is "disfiguring by damaging" surely

Jon, as to mutulation murders before Jack the only ones I can point you in the direction of is that of Emma Jackson in 1863, Harriet Buswell in 1872 and Catherine Mellows. All three had hallmarks of the C5 and beyond murders and have been linked to the Ripper by a couple of people (including Trevor Marriot ) though it has got to be said that most people, myself included, dismiss them as being Jack related.

[Uncle Jack]

Where can one read more about those torso murders?

Best Regards,
Ditlew

Hi Ditlew. There is an excellent dissertation on the link below

http://www.casebook.org/dissertations/thames-torso-murders.html

[ditlew]

Hi Uncle Jack,

Thank you very much!

Best Regards,
Ditlew

[DVV]

The word 'mutilate' can also mean "To disfigure by damaging" which would apply to all the victims save Emma Smith. A cut throat is "disfiguring by damaging" surely

Maybe so, Uncle Jack,

but in our case we have to deal with the literal sense.

Amitiés,
David

[Uncle Jack]

I agree with that view David

[Mascara & Paranoia]

Was Ada Wilson the one who got stabbed in the throat by the money demander? I always thought she was a better candidate as one of Jack's warm-up acts, as opposed to Emma Smith et cetera.

[Uncle Jack]

Was Ada Wilson the one who got stabbed in the throat by the money demander? I always thought she was a better candidate as one of Jack's warm-up acts, as opposed to Emma Smith et cetera.

Yes Wilson claimed that the man demanded money from her before stabbing her throat but statements from her neighbour Rose Bierman strongly suggest that this story was created to hide the fact that she was a prostitute and that she was attacked by one of her clients.