In the name of honesty...

[Archaic]

UK National Archives Website

I just looked at the Kew National Archives website and I'm surprised, because I didn't see any mention at all of missing, lost or stolen documents.

Of course I haven't been able to read the entire website, but there does not appear to be a special section relating to missing documents,
nor does there appear to be a special link for contacting the Archives if one has information about missing or stolen documents.

In fact, I can't find any mention of the subject, much less an appeal for public assistance in achieving the return of missing documents- am I just not seeing it? I checked the indexes, FAQs, and did some searches.

I find it very hard to believe that items are stolen from the US National Archives but not the UK National Archives!

(Maybe the British Archives keep a stiff upper lip??)

I'd appreciate it if anybody can shed some light on this subject. Thanks.

UK NATIONAL ARCHIVES:

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Best regards, Archaic

[Phil Carter]

reptillian pot luck

Hello Archaic,

Indeed I am aware of this Icke stuff. And yes, I am spared it, thank heavens.

I have enough trouble over here burying the Royal /J K Stephen gospel according to David Abrahamsen... he being born and lived in Norway until he was 37. I still get people calling it the answer.. period.

best wishes

Phil

[Archaic]

Hi, Phil.
As you live in Norway, perhaps you have been spared the plethora of "Reptilian Royals" videos and websites put out by crack-pots like David Icke-
if so you are truly fortunate!

I was just making a joke about the so-called 'Reptilian Conspiracy' and how it supposedly controls our lives and our governments.
It's a wildly popular & utterly asinine conspiracy theory that frequently pops up if you do an online search for "Jack the Ripper".

There are loads of videos about it on YouTube, and even online forums devoted to the subject.

> Apparently the Ripper, the Royals, the Reptilians, the Freemasons, the Shapeshifters, the Satanists & Godzilla are all out to destroy us!

Pass the popcorn, please...

(Darn; too bad there isn't a reptilian 'smiley' yet.)
Archaic

[Phil Carter]

Reptillian connection

Hello Archaic,

Doers this mean we are looking for a man in a deerstalker hat, gold chain and crocodile shoes?

I know what conclusion that gives me...

WANTED, unknown male with no sense of fashion brandishing knife.

And this guy AVOIDED being noticed? hahahhaha

best wishes

Phil

[Archaic]

But what if it's really all about protecting... the Reptilian Connection?


Cheers, Archaic

[Phil Carter]

the visit to No.13

Hello Mike,

Yes, that is an excellent point...intriguing. WHY visit... the Irish connection.

best wishes

Phil

[Phil Carter]

Hello Archaic,

I mentioned that earlier too...but if what you now assume is correct... that's just a cop-out! No one wants the responsibility.

I cannot believe that after all the speculation as to why these things are kept secret, they dont want to actually admit that as the entire reason.. surely?

I am very very baffled.

(which is nothing new...this IS the Jack the Ripper case isnt it?) hahahha

best wishes

Phil

It's so long ago now that I can't remember exactly, but I think Stewart said that the files are kept confidential if they relate to Fenianism, informers, counter-terrorism...I must say, it's difficult to imagine a situation where info from 1888 could compromise anyone's safety or any important operation.

Thats the interesting thing Robert, at one point a senior man in the investigation believed that the Ripper was also a Fenian, one that was working on the plot to assassinate Lord Balfour that year. We have what was believed to be a fairly sizable take of some 1500L at the post Office Robbery thought to be conducted by Fenians, and we have Fenian sympathizers and money launderers visiting in town at the time. We have the Parnell Commission that winter, and very likely due to the fact that they foiled the plot on Balfour, investigations into Fenian activities at the same time as the Ripper investigations.

And what of the make up of the senior Ripper investigators, how many had broad experience in solving local murders... rather than the infiltrating and arresting Fenian parties experiences that they did bring to the table.

If at any time the Ripper investigation dipped into the Fenian one, and Special Branch got involved, how would we ever know about it?

The story on the Tuesday I believe after Mary murder is interesting to me in that context....a Senior Post Office Official, Members of Parliament which had just re-convened the week previous, and members of The Royal Irish Constabulary visited room 13 in Millers Court.

An interesting mix.

Best regards Robert.

[Phil Carter]

Hello Robert,
Which is exactly the point I made earlier... on the basis of protection of TODAY's relatives, it's at least 4 generations ago...

SO WHY is it totally a rigid rule?

Trevor, you have obviously been there, and obviously know about this situation. There must be a better explanation than protection of the names of yesteryear's informers etc, in relation to today's generation? How in heavens name can their actions be of some problem for a generation 121 years later?

I am baffled.

IT's either antiquated as a rule, or there are reasons that have NOTHING to do with the reasons that I have been presented with here.
Because it doesnt make sense. As Robert said.

best wishes

Phil

[Archaic]

Is it true then that no info held by Special Branch is EVER divulged?
If it is too old to be useful do they just destroy it?

In the U.S. even the FBI & CIA and other agencies cull their files and release information on a regular basis. They just "black out" the parts that are still considered sensitive- which is admittedly sometimes the majority of the page, as with documents related to the Kennedy Assassination.

Sometimes mistakes are made where either too much or too little information is blacked out; it sounds like Special Branch's blanket "No Disclosure" policy seeks to avoid that problem.

Best regards, Archaic

[Robert]

It's so long ago now that I can't remember exactly, but I think Stewart said that the files are kept confidential if they relate to Fenianism, informers, counter-terrorism...I must say, it's difficult to imagine a situation where info from 1888 could compromise anyone's safety or any important operation.

[Chris]

Just wanted to say anyone thinking of going to Kew save yourself a journey and unnecessary expense there is nothing there of interest

I'm afraid I must take issue with that. I'm sure people have been over the MEPO files, but nothing of interest at Kew ...?

[Archaic]

Just wanted to say anyone thinking of going to Kew save yourself a journey and unnecessary expense there is nothing there of interest

Trevor, how can you say that??? I would KILL to go to Kew!

Well, maybe not really kill, maybe just maim or something...

I still wanna go, sounds better than Disneyland to me!

Best regards, Archaic

[Trevor Marriott]

Just wanted to say anyone thinking of going to Kew save yourself a journey and unnecessary expense there is nothing there of interest

[Chris]

"Metropolitan Police Special Branch records are subjected to a review process, during which those of no historical importance or continued administrative use are routinely destroyed. The earliest surviving records of the Metropolitan Police Special Branch date from 1888. Many of the records which have survived, as well as more recent records, contain information which remains sensitive long after the files have passed out of active use and, as a result, are the subject of retention within the department."

So...who's got a day off and wants to go to Kew?

I would assume the Special Branch records at Kew will have been checked, though perhaps it's safer not to make assumptions. The records in the online catalogue are not very informative even regarding dates. It might be a question of having to order the documents up and leaf through them to see what's there.

In previous discussions it has definitely been stated that some Special Branch records referring to the Whitechapel Murders have been retained rather than being sent to the National Archives.

PS to Tom. I think you're being a bit unfair. I quite often attempt to make jokes. It's just that most of the time people don't seem to realise they're meant to be funny.