Psycholanalysis

[Blackkat]

Pilgrim:

Danse Macabre - LOVE IT.

"The dance of death unites all "

[Sam Flynn]

Pilgrim:

Danse Macabre - LOVE IT.

"The dance of death unites all "

Don't encourage him! I'm convinced that it was Pilgrim's megabytemongous "art galleries" that brought the servers down the first time round

Only kidding, Pilgrim. Well, half-kidding...

[Blackkat]

LOL! Nah - it was planned. Conspiracy or part of something larger? Hmmmm??

[paul emmett]

I don't think a baby recognizes mom as a seperate entity at first. During the toddler years they learn that mother is seperate. So the first months of life, the baby and mother are "one" fused together pyschologically. The baby isn't and can't be independent.

But ultimately the baby must be independent. Mother moves away from "him" as she must. It's something--and someone--he can't cotrol. So is this where the two concepts Caz introduced earlier, rage and the need to control, meet? The angry infant who can't control his mother's abscences? Now he can!!

The women get less maternal as he goes, right. Yet I think that they also paradoxically look younger--more likely to be actually pregnant. And I do think Jack wants to see if they are.

[Sam Flynn]

they also paradoxically look younger--more likely to be actually pregnant. And I do think Jack wants to see if they are...

...so he takes a kidney

[paul emmett]

Ah, but, Sam, don't forget BlackKat's readings on the associations of kidneys--to say nothing of them uteri. I would have gone for bladder.

[Sam Flynn]

Ah, but, Sam, don't forget BlackKat's readings on the associations of kidneys

Well... personally, and with no disrespect to BK, that's looking for meaning that just isn't there except in the most tenuous sense. In accepting such tenuous links, one must then account for the "maternal symbolism" inherent in a 2-foot length of intestine.

[paul emmett]

No one must not. You and I both know--and I do recall you saying so--that we all, JTR included, are driven by complex motivations which work both consciously and un. So, noone ever suggested that JTR was driven EXCLUSIVELY by, let's say, desires/needs associated with mother. That would be ludicrous. Not everything is going to fit into one pattern on one hand, and on the other some see certian things associated with the maternal in the killings. The intestine, I think is a good question, but the answer doen't have to be mommy--or toilet training.

Finally, who's to say where meaning is? That is "personally."

[Sam Flynn]

Finally, who's to say where meaning is?

Indeed, Paul - mea culpa. However, the discernment of meaning from observation and experiment is surely to be preferred over speculation based on entirely subjective frameworks.

[Blackkat]

In renaissance times, anatomists moralized the digestive system. They associated the stomach and intestines with the impurities of the body, devoid of innate spirituality.

In astrology all body parts are linked to a specific zodiac sign. The intestines are linked to the sign of Virgo.

One of the reasons that the Jewish religion doesn't eat pork and considers it unclean? Tapeworms can implant themselves in the intestines. Same goes for fish - although not a kosher no no.

In the book "An introduction to the critical studay and knowledge of Holy Scriptures" - The disease of Jehoram King of Israel, his bowels are said to have finally fallen out after two years of disease - they were referring to dysentery, thus some people seeing the intestines as unclean.

There is a bit of writing about the ancients cutting out organs that were unclean, or diseased, etc etc.

Not necessarily the mother thing - or pregnancy there, but I'll think on it some more. The above are things that have been around for a long long time.

Also - one could see the intestine as representing the umbillical cord. Stretching I know but it could be.

[paul emmett]

Thanks, BlackKat. Do we know why intestines are Virgo? I liked intestines=umbilical=stretching!

Indeed, Paul - mea culpa. However, the discernment of meaning from observation and experiment is surely to be preferred over speculation based on entirely subjective frameworks.

Sam, it's been quite a while since my altarboy days, but is the next line "mea maxima culpa"? You know that ALL frameworks are subjective and that deductive and inductive reasoning are intricately intertwined with each other, and ,hence, with subjectivity.

[Blackkat]

In medical astrology Virgo governs the intestines and digestion, also spleen and nervous system.

Every sign rules a part of the body- This provides a vital clue as to the function of Virgo within the whole of humanity. Think of what the intestines do. They take in energy in the form of food, and break it down into its constituent parts. Then they analyse the components and see how they can be made to be useful. Perhaps some will be combined with others, some will be stored for later use, and some will be eliminated as being useless. Virgo takes in substance and discriminates between what is useful and what isn’t, and works with it so that it may be more useful still, and thus be of service to humanity. That is the key to it all - service.

I'm certain that the intestines aren't the first image that pops into your head when you contemplate beauty, but Virgo works below ground, behind the curtain, busily focused on the details and instantly deciding what stays and what must go.

Traits of a Virgo:

Analyst
Purist
Plays safe
Worrier
Has mood swings
Perfectionist
Easily learns mastery
Demands respect
Fair judgement
Pessimistic
Frequently depressed
Destructive at times

Anyhoo probably doesn't have anything to do with Jack but it's interesting to see the symobolism of the intestines throughtout history- just something kinda neat to think about.

[The Good Michael]

Shouldn't astrology be in Pub Talk, or in the Useless thread?

Mike

[Blackkat]

Mike,

NO it shouldn't because I was making a point connected to this thread. So therefore it doesn't belong in the pub talk section. Did you even read the last few posts to be able to understand that it wasn't some off the wall " HEY let's talk about zodiac signs here!" If you're going to post a rude ass comment like that then I might add "Don't you have something better to do, like go post in the pub area, because your rude comment shows your true colors of being mean spirited."

COME ON! You feel better for being an ass? Good now try being nice it works much better with people.

[Pilgrim]

Borne Out By Experiment.

You know that ALL frameworks are subjective and that deductive and inductive reasoning are intricately intertwined with each other, and ,hence, with subjectivity.

~~~

Originally posted by Sam Flynn, 25th June 2007, 01:37 AM.

I'm not ambidextrous - although, oddly enough, my sister is - in fact, I'm quite unusually right-handed, as borne out by experiments in which I took part as a guinea-pig when in college. However, I reckon even I could clutch at a straw as well with my left hand as I could with my right.