Jack the Ripper was NOT a sailor because...

[Fisherman]

Hi Natalie!

What I meant when I said that the Ripper may well have had sex with the victims in a fashion of his own, was that he did not need to take his pants of to penetrate, so to speak.
In all probability he did not engage vith his victims in the physical kind of sex that most of us do - save that what Dan Norder brought up some months ago (that he may have ejaculated but not in/on the body) is a suggestion that cannot be dismissed, I feel.

The best, Natalie!

Fisherman

[Natalie Severn]

[QUOTE=Fisherman;30861]Hi Natalie!

What I meant when I said that the Ripper may well have had sex with the victims in a fashion of his own, was that he did not need to take his pants of to penetrate, so to speak.
In all probability he did not engage vith his victims in the physical kind of sex that most of us do - save that what Dan Norder brought up some months ago (that he may have ejaculated but not in/on the body) is a suggestion that cannot be dismissed, I feel.







Yes Fisherman.I think thats a fair statement on it.I dont think its "definite" that he was engaged in some strange sublimation of sexual activity, because its just as possible he could have been trying to deal with his"demons" who he thought were instructing him to cut women up that way,but certainly its one possible scenario ,that he was a sexual serial killer.
Cheers

[Fisherman]

I would actually take it as far as to state that it is the most probable thing to suggest, since the historical comparisons that can be made more often contain serialists who have received sexual gratification with the help of a knife, than serialists who have heard voices.
Moreover, the latter category have a tendency of getting caught before they reach the serial killer status. Not all, though, leaving us with the possibility of the Ripper belonging to this particular character.

The best, Natalie!

Fisherman

[Billy Bulger]

Hi Everyone thanks for your posts, the more I think about it, I think there are a great many flaws in my 'he was'nt a sailor' theory. That's not to say he was, I still harbor feelings that the Ripper was likely to have been an educated man. Feldman wrote about how he always felt Jack the Ripper was a gentleman (at least in appearance-obviously not in action) and while I disagree with Paul Feldman's overall view of the case (believes the diary to be true) this is something I can certainly subscribe to, for at the very least it seems highly unlikely that Mary Jane would have so willingly envited a man back to Dorset Street if he had appeared in any way threatening.

[Ben]

Hi Billy,

for at the very least it seems highly unlikely that Mary Jane would have so willingly envited a man back to Dorset Street if he had appeared in any way threatening.

...Or conspicuously out-of-place for the locality. A well-dressed gentlemanly type of the order suggested by the "medical knowledge" hypotheses doing the rounds at the time might well have elicited suspicion from prostitutes, whereas a tried and tested, blend-into-the crowd local type would have been the least "threatening" prospect available.

Best regards,
Ben

[Celesta]

Your remind me my old Italian teacher saying she used to make love with her husband playing chess...

Amitiés,
David

Hello David,

She had extremely long and supple toes, did she?

I don't seeing him having sex with them either, but that doesn't mean he didn't have sex with other women. If he was a pimp, like that guy Silver in South Africa, he may have. Too many unknowns.

Best,

Celesta

[Celesta]

Hi Natalie!

What I meant when I said that the Ripper may well have had sex with the victims in a fashion of his own, was that he did not need to take his pants of to penetrate, so to speak.
In all probability he did not engage vith his victims in the physical kind of sex that most of us do - save that what Dan Norder brought up some months ago (that he may have ejaculated but not in/on the body) is a suggestion that cannot be dismissed, I feel.

The best, Natalie!

Fisherman

Yes, I think that this is what the situation was, Fisherman. Sheesh.

[Celesta]

Hello Billy,

This is an interesting post. I don't have feelings in favour or against the killer being a sailor. However, your assertion that if the killer was a sailor he would have probably felt the urge to have sex with the victimes due to his absence from woman away at sea has two flaws for me. Firsly, it assumes that the killer had an appetite for normal sexual intercourse and I don';t think this can be fully established. Killers of this sort often get sexually arroused by the acts of violence and killing itself. On the other hand, some of them are unable to have 'normal' sex with a woman or are afraid or repulsed by sex with women (but this does not mean they are gay).

Secondly, not all sailors went off on long trips involving prolonged periods away from women. Some of the boats travelled to and from the continent, to places such as Holland and were out of port for only a day or two -and even then there would be opportunities for sex in ports that they visited to pick up cargo.

Hi Julie and Billy B.,

Still, normally, if the voyage was of some length, what Billy describes is not inaccurate. Think about Sadler and the way Tully describes him. However JTR was not a normal sailor, as you point out.

The image of the well-dressed JTR, with his black bag, top hat, & cape, is still very much in the public's imagination and Billy is right to hone in on that. The perceived atmosphere of Victorian Whitechapel & environs, with Jack as the gentleman murderer, is still much alive.

Best to you both,

Cel

[Limehouse]

Hi Celesta,

Yes, you are right, if the voyage was long, many sailors would be out looking for a girl. Of course, we don't know for sure that some sort of sexual contact did not take place do we?

As for whether the girls/women would feel 'safe' with a gentleman, I feel that whoever Jack was, he must have been very similar to most of the clients they were used to as they had risked that type of client many times and been safe. After the first few murders, surely no woman would have risked going with a clinet who was 'different' from the norm, gentleman or rough?

[Gabrielle]

Maybe the women felt safe with 'Jack' because they had already "served" him previously?

After all I've read, here and in books, the sailor theory shouldn't be excluded but I personally don't feel for it though.

[DVV]

[QUOTE=Gabrielle;31086]Maybe the women felt safe with 'Jack' because they had already "served" him previously?

/QUOTE]

That's a possibility I have always entertained, though the victims were more plausibly random. (Remember the real panic started only after Chapman's murder. Afterwards, we have only, after a 3 weeks gap, Stride quickly dispached in a place where prostitutes were not known to solicit, Eddowes wandering penniless after hours in custody...then a murder indoors on 9 november).

Amitiés,
David

[Gabrielle]

And still...
Ever since the first good book I read about the Ripper with objectively written facts I believed they had known him some way or the other.
I cannot quite put my finger on it, but...

It all seems randomly, even to me but I don't think it is that odd to believe they might have known him.
Even today there are some strange people you know, would it be so far fetched they (murderers) become friends with you one way or another, follow you, even for hours without you knowing it and then suddenly show up.
Because you know; even like them you wouldn't see something weird in it.
People with bad intentions can be enormeously patient you know and then suddenly let go..
And if you take into consideration that the murderer was just a normal guy, he would not stand out and nobody would notice him.
But just my humble thoughts you know...nothing more

[DVV]

And still...
Ever since the first good book I read about the Ripper with objectively written facts I believed they had known him some way or the other.
I cannot quite put my finger on it, but...

What's that book, Gabrielle?
Does every "good" book about the case entertain this view (which is obviously a speculation, though not a far fetched one)?

Amitiés,
David

[Gabrielle]

What's that book, Gabrielle?
Does every "good" book about the case entertain this view

No on the contrary. It doesn't state the killer knew them. It was my opinion, don't know why exactly and it's not like I can't be convinced otherwise.
A good book to me is one who just gives the evidence and facts and proof and doesn't come with all kinds of theories. I'll always keep my own opinion and respect others' because at the end, those who surely know are not here to tell us.

[DVV]

Gabrielle,
on the matter, it's probably safe to forget "opinion" and be able to change one's mind, no?
Opinion is a curse!

Amitiés,
David