My profile of the ripper

[Craig H]

Hi john
I think we do have credible witnesses
Both PC Smith and Lawende saw a similar man with each of the victims 15 minutes before the body was found.
In each situation, the woman was comfortable with the man.
The most likely scenario is this was the Ripper
Craig

[TomTomKent]

I agree with most of Abby’s profile as there is supporting evidence.

There are credible witness descriptions on his age, height and build.

Lawende and PC Smith saw the victim with a man 15 minutes before the body was found. It’s highly likely this was the killer.

Lawende’s description (Catherine Eddowes) : Aged 30, 5’7″, fair complexion, brown moustache, medium build

PC William Smith (Elizabeth Stride) : Aged 28, cleanshaven and respectable appearance, 5’7″.

I think William Marshall’s description of the man he saw with Elizabeth Stride an hour and a quarter before her body was found is too similar to have been a different person to the man described by PC Smith. Marshall’s description was middle aged, round cap with a small sailor-like peak. 5’6″, stout, appearance of a clerk, no moustache.

Marshall heard the man say “You would say anything but your prayers.” Spoken mildly, with an English accent, and in an educated manner.

These three witness descriptions suggest Jack was 28 – 35 years, 5’7”, fair complexion, no beard, medium / stout build, respectable, educated (Elizabeth Long – who likely saw the Ripper but didn’t see his face – said “shabby genteel”)

I don't get the feeling anybody is dismissing it out of hand. I think that people are asking questions is a good sign that people are interested (I know I am) to see how she reached her conclusions. At this point, I don't have enough information to agree or disagree, but either way... it is interesting.

[John Wheat]

I agree with most of Abby’s profile as there is supporting evidence.

There are credible witness descriptions on his age, height and build.

Lawende and PC Smith saw the victim with a man 15 minutes before the body was found. It’s highly likely this was the killer.

Lawende’s description (Catherine Eddowes) : Aged 30, 5’7″, fair complexion, brown moustache, medium build

PC William Smith (Elizabeth Stride) : Aged 28, cleanshaven and respectable appearance, 5’7″.

I think William Marshall’s description of the man he saw with Elizabeth Stride an hour and a quarter before her body was found is too similar to have been a different person to the man described by PC Smith. Marshall’s description was middle aged, round cap with a small sailor-like peak. 5’6″, stout, appearance of a clerk, no moustache.

Marshall heard the man say “You would say anything but your prayers.” Spoken mildly, with an English accent, and in an educated manner.

These three witness descriptions suggest Jack was 28 – 35 years, 5’7”, fair complexion, no beard, medium / stout build, respectable, educated (Elizabeth Long – who likely saw the Ripper but didn’t see his face – said “shabby genteel”)

We don't know which witnesses did and didn't see Jack. Also witness descriptions are not always that accurate.

[Craig H]

I agree with most of Abby’s profile as there is supporting evidence.

There are credible witness descriptions on his age, height and build.

Lawende and PC Smith saw the victim with a man 15 minutes before the body was found. It’s highly likely this was the killer.

Lawende’s description (Catherine Eddowes) : Aged 30, 5’7″, fair complexion, brown moustache, medium build

PC William Smith (Elizabeth Stride) : Aged 28, cleanshaven and respectable appearance, 5’7″.

I think William Marshall’s description of the man he saw with Elizabeth Stride an hour and a quarter before her body was found is too similar to have been a different person to the man described by PC Smith. Marshall’s description was middle aged, round cap with a small sailor-like peak. 5’6″, stout, appearance of a clerk, no moustache.

Marshall heard the man say “You would say anything but your prayers.” Spoken mildly, with an English accent, and in an educated manner.

These three witness descriptions suggest Jack was 28 – 35 years, 5’7”, fair complexion, no beard, medium / stout build, respectable, educated (Elizabeth Long – who likely saw the Ripper but didn’t see his face – said “shabby genteel”)

[MrBarnett]

Hi gary
I should have posted that i dont think its rock solid everthing i listed he must have, but i think most of them probably he would. And some of them i feel stronger about and would be more of a dealbreaker, and of course some suspects are missing more of these than others.

But you got me thinking now alomg these lines. If i did hold strictly to this list and rule suspects out if even if they are missing even just one, is anyone left?
Hutch would be out, because he dosnt have his own place, as would barnett and flemimg. That would leave bury, lech amd kelly?

Anything on my list rule them out also?

Did i just rule out my favored suspect hutch? Lol

Did Bury, Lech or Kelly have experience of cutting up animals?

(Controversial!)

[John Wheat]

Of course absolutely.

Interestingly i think bury is one of the few suspects who still fits most if not all of these (that we know of course). Except former military navy/ sailor?

Do we know?

Hi Abby

I don't think we can be 100 per cent certain Bury was not former military but knowing what we do about Bury i find it unlikely.

Cheers John

[Elamarna]

Hi el and others
Due to popular demand, i will when i have time, break down my reasons for each point of profile.

I look forward to it Abby, seeing how others think is the only real way to progress debate.


Steve

[Abby Normal]

Hi Abby,

Can I ask what leads you to conclude he was gentile?

Demographics show that the local population was vastly non gentle, and if a local man, surely the odds/probability must be along the same lines?

Steve

Hi el and others
Due to popular demand, i will when i have time, break down my reasons for each point of profile.

[Elamarna]

Hi gut, well that will be quite a task to do it individually but when i have the time ill try it.

Hi Abby,

Can I ask what leads you to conclude he was gentile?

Demographics show that the local population was vastly non gentle, and if a local man, surely the odds/probability must be along the same lines?

Steve

[TomTomKent]

Aged 28-43
Below average height
Stout, powerfully built
Light brown/ ginger hair
mustache

These I assume were all from your interpretation of the witnesses?

Local, lived in immediate area

This I suspect was playing the odds.

Walked when committing murders, possible use of cart


I'm sure this reasonable, but I'm not sure what it tells us that is useful, other than the suspect was a Londoner.

English
Gentile

Sorry, but on what basis are either of these reached, as conclusions?

Steady work, probably involving manuel labor
Lower class but not poor
Had own place, though modest

These seem to be stacked assumptions. Why do we consider these over, for example, the possibility of a small private place of work, lock up, etc, that he could use to change or wash, without risk of being disturbed? A job away from manual labour, or access to a simple yard, could afford much the same advantage.

Frequented pubs and drinker

Based on anything other than his encountering prostitutes?

Single or dominated wife

Why? Other killers have maintained lives without spouses or others suspecting them.

Knew prostitues and socialized with
Had problems having sex

Is the latter of these part of a standard serial killer profile, or is there some reason in the evidence for it?

Former military and or navy/ sailor

Sorry, but...again, why?

Very familiar with knife
Accustomed to carrying knife before murder spree

Sorry, not trying to be rude by asking this over and again, but what is the evidence for this? What is it, about the wounds, that makes you think he was any more adept than a layperson?


Appears very cocky to people
Thinks he is smarter than anyone else
Self assured
Cunning
Experience cutting up animals

Is this based on the pattern of serial killers, or is there something in the evidence to suggest this?

Probable anatomical knowledge, possible medical/surgical experience


May I ask what this would explain, that experience and experimentation cutting up animals would not explain?

NO or very light criminal record
No overt mental illness

How did you reach these conclusions?

Read newspapers

This would be interesting. How did you discern this? Was he an usually literate labourer? Or could he have been in a lower level position where one would be expected to be more literate, for the age, like a foreman or clerk?

Main motivation-Fascinated with the female body and what his knife could do to it
Possible masterbation and or cannibalism with trophies/ parts
Secondary motivation-Enjoyed shocking / toying with the public

What, about the crimes, suggests he was toying with, or even aware of, public reaction?

Looked down on police
No interest in torture, all interest post mortem
Curiosity big factor in motivation

Why does this not suggest a LACK of anatomical knowledge, or access to any training or job (butchery or whatever) that might have offered more harmless means of satisfying the curiosity? In short, that he took to these acts of butchery, does not suggest a lack of previous knowledge, or training?

[Abby Normal]

I agree with “How did you reach those conclusions”

Hi gut, well that will be quite a task to do it individually but when i have the time ill try it.

[Abby Normal]

Interesting profile Abby. Of course profiles are just a guide and the unsub is unlikely to fit the whole profile.

Of course absolutely.

Interestingly i think bury is one of the few suspects who still fits most if not all of these (that we know of course). Except former military navy/ sailor?

Do we know?

[Abby Normal]

Abby,

How does ‘own place’ work for Hutch? Or ‘steady work’ for that matter?

And if Hutch was Toppy, the age is out and he would have to have fitted a lot of work experience into his short life: groom, soldier/sailor, slaughterman.

We know a fair bit about Lech and it seems extremely unlikely that he was in the military or the merchant navy. So surely that’s him out too?

Gary

Hi gary
I should have posted that i dont think its rock solid everthing i listed he must have, but i think most of them probably he would. And some of them i feel stronger about and would be more of a dealbreaker, and of course some suspects are missing more of these than others.

But you got me thinking now alomg these lines. If i did hold strictly to this list and rule suspects out if even if they are missing even just one, is anyone left?
Hutch would be out, because he dosnt have his own place, as would barnett and flemimg. That would leave bury, lech amd kelly?

Anything on my list rule them out also?

Did i just rule out my favored suspect hutch? Lol

[John Wheat]

Interesting profile Abby. Of course profiles are just a guide and the unsub is unlikely to fit the whole profile.

[MrBarnett]

Well we could start by seeing who it dosnt eliminate:


Hutch
Barnett
Flemming
Bury
Lech
Kelly

It pretty much eliminates all the other major suspects like:
Chapman
Druitt
Tumblety
Koz

Abby,

How does ‘own place’ work for Hutch? Or ‘steady work’ for that matter?

And if Hutch was Toppy, the age is out and he would have to have fitted a lot of work experience into his short life: groom, soldier/sailor, slaughterman.

We know a fair bit about Lech and it seems extremely unlikely that he was in the military or the merchant navy. So surely that’s him out too?

Gary