Casebook: Jack the Ripper - Main
   

Introduction
Victims
Suspects
Witnesses
Ripper Letters
Police Officials
Official Documents
Press Reports
Victorian London
Message Boards
Ripper Media
Authors
Dissertations
Timelines
Games & Diversions
Photo Archive
Ripper Wiki
Casebook Examiner
Ripper Podcast
About the Casebook

Most Recent Posts:
Hutchinson, George: Possible reason for Hutch coming forward - by Robert St Devil 25 minutes ago.
Maybrick, James: Acquiring A Victorian Diary - by Graham 1 hour and 5 minutes ago.
Hutchinson, George: Possible reason for Hutch coming forward - by Wickerman 1 hour and 14 minutes ago.
Hutchinson, George: Possible reason for Hutch coming forward - by Wickerman 2 hours ago.
Hutchinson, George: Possible reason for Hutch coming forward - by Wickerman 2 hours ago.
Hutchinson, George: Possible reason for Hutch coming forward - by Michael W Richards 2 hours ago.

Most Popular Threads:
Hutchinson, George: Possible reason for Hutch coming forward - (19 posts)
Maybrick, James: Acquiring A Victorian Diary - (4 posts)
Shades of Whitechapel: Centenaries - whole and half - (1 posts)
Doctors and Coroners: Baxter's influence on Ripper lore - (1 posts)

Wiki Updates:
Robert Sagar
Edit: Chris
May 9, 2015, 12:32 am
Online newspaper archives
Edit: Chris
Nov 26, 2014, 10:25 am
Joseph Lawende
Edit: Chris
Mar 9, 2014, 10:12 am
Miscellaneous research resources
Edit: Chris
Feb 13, 2014, 9:28 am
Charles Cross
Edit: John Bennett
Sep 4, 2013, 8:20 pm

Most Recent Blogs:
Mike Covell: A DECADE IN THE MAKING.
February 19, 2016, 11:12 am.
Chris George: RipperCon in Baltimore, April 8-10, 2016
February 10, 2016, 2:55 pm.
Mike Covell: Hull Prison Visit
October 10, 2015, 8:04 am.
Mike Covell: NEW ADVENTURES IN RESEARCH
August 9, 2015, 3:10 am.
Mike Covell: UPDDATES FOR THE PAST 11 MONTHS
November 14, 2014, 10:02 am.
Mike Covell: Mike’s Book Releases
March 17, 2014, 3:18 am.

Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Victims > Mary Ann Nichols

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-15-2011, 03:44 AM
K-453 K-453 is offline
Detective
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Alpha Centaury
Posts: 210
Default 31st August = Bank Holiday?

I read somewhere, August 31st was a bank holiday, but that was a source which got several other things wrong.
Can somebody help me, please?
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 11-15-2011, 04:17 AM
Premium Member
The Grave Maurice The Grave Maurice is offline
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Western Canada
Posts: 1,674
Default

"Bank holiday" is a term that has always confused me too, K. One assumes that it's a day when the banks are closed, so it might well include days such as Christmas and New Year's Day. From what I've read, though, they seem to fall on Mondays and usually during the warmer months. So a bank holiday on a Friday in 1888 seems unlikely; but wait a bit and a knowledgeable UK poster will drop by with the definitive answer.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-15-2011, 05:49 AM
K-453 K-453 is offline
Detective
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Alpha Centaury
Posts: 210
Default

I found this piece of information:

Bank holidays were first introduced by the Bank Holidays Act of 1871, which designated four holidays in England, Wales and Northern Ireland, and five in Scotland. These were Easter Monday, the first Monday in August, the 26th December, and Whit Monday (England, Wales and Northern Ireland)
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.g...page18882.html

Did it happen for any other reason to be a day of significance?
Like Nov. 9th, which was no bank holiday, but the day of Lord Mayor's Show?
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11-15-2011, 06:44 AM
Tom_Wescott Tom_Wescott is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,676
Default

Interesting, because Dec. 26th is also Boxing Day.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-15-2011, 06:45 AM
Tom_Wescott Tom_Wescott is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,676
Default

Emma Smith and Tabram were both killed on a Bank holiday, so I'm guessing April 3rd, when Smith was killed, was the day after Easter. No clue what Whit Monday is.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-15-2011, 07:42 AM
Adam Went Adam Went is offline
Inactive
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 779
Default

I think it must be confused with Martha Tabram's death, as that was a Bank Holiday Monday - and, according to Sugden's "Complete History", the last holiday for the summer.

It's always been an interesting, and I believe under-rated, point that all the canonical killings and even a couple of the attacks outside the canon, including that of Tabram, occurred on holidays or weekends.

One could call this a coincidence a couple of times, but when it gets into the region of 6 or 7, surely it's a bit more than that - IMO, it indicates that Jack was occupied during the working week, perhaps indicating he held down some sort of regular employment, as opposed to the popular image of him being an insane vagabond who did nothing but roam the streets searching for his next victim.

Cheers,
Adam.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11-15-2011, 08:02 AM
Tom_Wescott Tom_Wescott is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,676
Default

Hi Adam. The seamen theory derives almost exclusively from the fact that so many of the murders were on holidays and weekends, so I wouldn't say it's overlooked. However, these would also be prime times for a killer such as the Ripper, because he'd have a much easier time finding a woman, as they'd be out in droves. But it might indeed be work related on the part of the killer. With that in mind, how many hardpressed east enders would actually have had the weekends off? Not many.

Also of interest is that all the murders, from Smith to Kelly, occurred either in the first part or last part of the month, none in the middle. Not sure how or why that would be significant, just thought I'd mention it.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 11-15-2011, 09:05 AM
mariab mariab is offline
Superintendent
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Berlin
Posts: 2,977
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Went View Post
IMO, it indicates that Jack was occupied during the working week, perhaps indicating he held down some sort of regular employment, as opposed to the popular image of him being an insane vagabond who did nothing but roam the streets searching for his next victim.
Agree that the crime dates could be seen as an indication that the killer might have been holding a job during the week.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom_Wescott View Post
With that in mind, how many hardpressed east enders would actually have had the weekends off? Not many.
If not completely having hitted bottom, the Victorian low classes were notorious for celebrating on the weekends by getting seriously hammered. Maybe not for the likes of Nichols and Chapman, but Eddowes and MJK did party when they could afford it. Plus almost everyone was an alcoholic in Victorian Whitechapel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom_Wescott View Post
Also of interest is that all the murders, from Smith to Kelly, occurred either in the first part or last part of the month, none in the middle. Not sure how or why that would be significant, just thought I'd mention it.
Actually, I've noticed this myself and I was thinking that it might be related to
- the killer getting payed in the end or in the beginning of the month
- the simple fact that he started killing on the end of the month and his urges for another go growed accordingly.
Noticeable is the longer gap after Chapman, which led to the Double Event, and the longer gap between the Double Event and MJK vs. the minimal waiting time between Nichols and Chapman. The latter can be understood as “newbie enthusiasm“ while it can be argued that after Chapman and the huge attention this crime got, he became more careful. There's also a huge gap between Emma Smith and Tabram, which can be explained by the fact that he hadn't started doing this solo yet.
__________________
Best regards,
Maria
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 11-15-2011, 10:38 AM
Monty Monty is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Leicestershire
Posts: 5,177
Default

Maybe this will help.

http://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/...1888&country=9

Bank holidays all stemmed from the numerous holidays and festivals celerbarted throughout the years which were consolidated into 4 handy holidays where the Banks closed for those days.

With the banks closed, the majority of trading ceased, though pubs have a bumper day.

It must be remembered that Saturdays and Sundays are religious days for the two predominant religions in the area, some traded, some did not. However the timing of the crimes, I feel, is more victim orientated.

Monty
__________________




Author of Capturing Jack the Ripper.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/1445621622
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 11-15-2011, 10:47 AM
Monty Monty is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Leicestershire
Posts: 5,177
Default Re pay

The average Victorian either got paid weekly or daily, I do not recall seeing any reference to monthly payments.

That is a more modern thing tied in with computer banking.

Monty
__________________




Author of Capturing Jack the Ripper.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/1445621622
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 03:14 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.