Casebook: Jack the Ripper - Main
   

Introduction
Victims
Suspects
Witnesses
Ripper Letters
Police Officials
Official Documents
Press Reports
Victorian London
Message Boards
Ripper Media
Authors
Dissertations
Timelines
Games & Diversions
Photo Archive
Ripper Wiki
Casebook Examiner
Ripper Podcast
About the Casebook

Most Recent Posts:
Witnesses: Sarah and Maurice Lewis - by Sam Flynn 45 minutes ago.
Witnesses: Sarah and Maurice Lewis - by Debra A 2 hours ago.
Lechmere/Cross, Charles: Lechmere was Jack the Ripper - by Herlock Sholmes 4 hours ago.
Scene of the Crimes: Mitre square, very upsetting! - by Rob1n 4 hours ago.
Lechmere/Cross, Charles: Lechmere was Jack the Ripper - by Rob1n 5 hours ago.
Lechmere/Cross, Charles: Lechmere was Jack the Ripper - by Rob1n 5 hours ago.

Most Popular Threads:
Witnesses: Sarah and Maurice Lewis - (10 posts)
Torso Killings: torso maps - (9 posts)
Lechmere/Cross, Charles: Lechmere was Jack the Ripper - (5 posts)
A6 Murders: A6 Rebooted - (2 posts)
Scene of the Crimes: Mitre square, very upsetting! - (1 posts)
Motive, Method and Madness: Was the ripper and also the torsomans crimes totally non sexual in nature? - (1 posts)

Wiki Updates:
Robert Sagar
Edit: Chris
May 9, 2015, 12:32 am
Online newspaper archives
Edit: Chris
Nov 26, 2014, 10:25 am
Joseph Lawende
Edit: Chris
Mar 9, 2014, 10:12 am
Miscellaneous research resources
Edit: Chris
Feb 13, 2014, 9:28 am
Charles Cross
Edit: John Bennett
Sep 4, 2013, 8:20 pm

Most Recent Blogs:
Mike Covell: A DECADE IN THE MAKING.
February 19, 2016, 11:12 am.
Chris George: RipperCon in Baltimore, April 8-10, 2016
February 10, 2016, 2:55 pm.
Mike Covell: Hull Prison Visit
October 10, 2015, 8:04 am.
Mike Covell: NEW ADVENTURES IN RESEARCH
August 9, 2015, 3:10 am.
Mike Covell: UPDDATES FOR THE PAST 11 MONTHS
November 14, 2014, 10:02 am.
Mike Covell: Mike’s Book Releases
March 17, 2014, 3:18 am.

Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > General Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #21  
Old 02-23-2015, 06:12 AM
Ausgirl Ausgirl is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 556
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Patterson View Post
These saints were found in books on Catholic saints. Did you notice that they are all saints who lived in the East, while Thompson lived in the East End?

You cannot be serious.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 02-23-2015, 06:32 AM
Richard Patterson Richard Patterson is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 530
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ausgirl View Post
You cannot be serious.
Francis Thompson was:

'With burnt mouth, red like a lion's, it drank
The blood of the sun as he slaughtered sank,
And dipped its cup in purpurate shine [pupurate-crimson]
When the Eastern conduits ran with wine...
I hang 'mid men my needless head
And my fruit is dreams, as theirs is bread,
The goodly men and the sun-hazed sleeper
Time shall reap, but after the reaper
The world shall glean of me, me the sleeper.'
---
See how there
The cowled Night [cowled-hooded, like a priest’s robes]
Kneels on the Eastern sanctuary-stair
---
‘Lo, in the sancturied East
Day, a dedicated priest...
His sacredotal stoles unvest-


Using the pseudonym of Tancred, Thompson wrote a notice in the January 1891, edition of "Merry England", called "Catholics in Darkest England". The name of Tancred was taken from that an Eastern crusading knight who lived from 1076 to 1112 AD. This Catholic warrior helped capture the eastern city of Jerusalem from the Muslims and was for a short time Prince of Galilee. In his article he told how the unborn poor were prostitutes waiting to happen and suggested throwing their children into the Thames.

'I see upon my right hand a land of lanes and hedgerows, I look upon my left hand and I see another region-is it not rather another universe? A region whose hedgerows have set to brick, whose soil is chilled to stone; where flowers are sold and women, where the men wither and the stars; whose streets to me on the most glittering day are black. For I unveil their secret meanings. I read their human hieroglyphs. I diagnose from a hundred occult signs the disease which perturbs their populous pulses. Misery cries out to me from the kerb-stone, despair passes me by in the ways; I discern limbs laden with fetters impalpable, but not imponderable; I hear the shaking of invisible lashes, I see men dabbled with their own oozing life. ... they are brought up in sin from their cradles,... the boys are ruffians and profligates, the girls harlots in the mother's womb. ... Here, too, has the Assassin left us a weapon which but needs a little practice to adapt it to the necessity of the day? Even so our army is in the midst of us, enrolled under the banner of the Stigmata, For better your children were cast from the bridges of London than they should become as one of those little ones.
__________________
Author of

"Jack the Ripper, The Works of Francis Thompson"

http://www.francisjthompson.com/
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 02-23-2015, 07:05 AM
Ally Ally is offline
WWotW
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,178
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Patterson View Post
These saints were found in books on Catholic saints. Did you notice that they are all saints who lived in the East, while Thompson lived in the East End?
Really and what book was that?
__________________

Let all Oz be agreed;
I'm Wicked through and through.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 02-23-2015, 12:56 PM
GUT GUT is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: I come from a land Down Under
Posts: 7,334
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Patterson View Post
These saints were found in books on Catholic saints. Did you notice that they are all saints who lived in the East, while Thompson lived in the East End?
__________________
G U T

There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 02-24-2015, 01:49 AM
Sally Sally is offline
Superintendent
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Badgers Drift
Posts: 2,094
Default

Richard Patterson,

You should realise, of course, that every day is a saint's day [or more accurately a saints' day] and as such a relationship between murder dates and saint's days is likely to be casual, not causal.

http://medievalist.net/calendar/months.htm
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 02-24-2015, 02:08 AM
Robert Robert is offline
Casebook Supporter
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,828
Default

For this theory to even start to work, the Ripper would have to succeed every time. Nights when he missed out are not allowed for, because he would be trying to kill on the 'wrong' day. So the Ripper may have known it was the correct day - but if the prostitutes didn't know, he may have had problems.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 02-24-2015, 02:13 AM
Richard Patterson Richard Patterson is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 530
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sally View Post
Richard Patterson,

You should realise, of course, that every day is a saint's day [or more accurately a saints' day] and as such a relationship between murder dates and saint's days is likely to be casual, not causal.

http://medievalist.net/calendar/months.htm
I do realise, and thanks for the link. You should realise, from the 1st post in this thread, that I'm referring to only patron saints and saints that were soldiers and doctors of the church. Not the dozen or so saints that might be on any day.
__________________
Author of

"Jack the Ripper, The Works of Francis Thompson"

http://www.francisjthompson.com/
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 02-24-2015, 02:19 AM
Richard Patterson Richard Patterson is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 530
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
For this theory to even start to work, the Ripper would have to succeed every time. Nights when he missed out are not allowed for, because he would be trying to kill on the 'wrong' day. So the Ripper may have known it was the correct day - but if the prostitutes didn't know, he may have had problems.
The Ripper did succeed every time. so the theory even starts to work.
__________________
Author of

"Jack the Ripper, The Works of Francis Thompson"

http://www.francisjthompson.com/
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 02-24-2015, 02:29 AM
GUT GUT is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: I come from a land Down Under
Posts: 7,334
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Patterson View Post
The Ripper did succeed every time. so the theory even starts to work.
And we know that how?
__________________
G U T

There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 02-24-2015, 02:35 AM
Richard Patterson Richard Patterson is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 530
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GUT View Post
And we know that how?
And we don't know that how?
__________________
Author of

"Jack the Ripper, The Works of Francis Thompson"

http://www.francisjthompson.com/
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 01:13 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.