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  • #16
    Originally posted by OneRound View Post

    Hi Herlock,

    Small point maybe but certainly a fair point.

    Whilst it lends some support to claims of innocence on the part of Bamber, it though doesn't rule out him having planned and arranged the murders as I speculated earlier.

    I appreciate you are more raising (serious) doubts about Bamber's convictions than asserting innocence on his part but, if he wasn't responsible in some way, I would be interested to learn who you think was. Could it really have been Sheila who pulverised her father and shot her family with no forensic evidence against her? If not, how do you explain the phone call that Bamber claimed to have received from his father?

    Best regards,
    OneRound
    Hi OneRound,

    I know that there are certain to be questions on how Sheila could have done it I can’t help thinking that events occurred as first believed. A schizophrenic women, very recently released from hospital, on reduced medication but smoking marijuana (which science tells us can have a serious effect on sufferers) had that night had it suggested to her by her family that her children should be put into foster care (confirmed by an independent witness) simply cracked. I haven’t got far into my second reading but I’m sure that I read somewhere that Sheila had accused her 2 small children of trying to raper her. Sadly this was a very seriously disturbed women. Bamber on the other hand has no psychiatric or psychological issues. Of course he wasn’t exactly Gandhi when it came to his behaviour but it’s a huge step for someone to butcher a whole family including his own parents an to shoot to very young children (his own nephews) 3 and 5 times. I’m no expert but wouldn’t we expect psychiatrists and psychologists to have found something? I can’t help wondering how many others of the 30+ whole life tariff prisoners in the UK got a clean bill of mental health?
    Regards

    Herlock



    “All conspiracy theories are the product of the subconscious attempt of an ignorant yet creative mind to counteract the fear of the unknown with the tales of fantasy.” Abhijit Naskar.

    “Conspiracy theorists, she knew, were paranoid by definition, and usually with good reason - they were indeed being watched, largely because they were standing on an upturned bucket, haranguing the sheeple with their wingnut delusions.” Mick Herron.

    ”The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and spirit of something your mind knows is a lie.” Shannon L. Alder.

    Comment


    • #17
      If this was all arranged by Bamber, could he not have got the killer to call him from the house, pretending to be Nevill putting the blame on Sheila? He'd know that the police would check any calls made. Could it have been established that the voice was definitely Nevill's? Or was it a process of elimination?

      If a third party could have been involved, it might open up some fresh possibilities to explain the order of events.

      Love,

      Caz
      X
      "Comedy is simply a funny way of being serious." Peter Ustinov


      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by caz View Post

        Hi Herlock,

        I actually think it's a little bit suspicious that Bamber was able to go into commendable detail about what he watched on tv, immediately before the shi* hit the fan and he learned he had lost his family. I wonder if the police checked the TV Times for that day, to see if he could have got everything he 'remembered' from that. "I never knew there was so much in it." It would make more sense to me if he had arranged the whole thing, because he'd also be gearing up to give as solid an alibi as possible, knowing he would be facing a great deal of scrutiny from the police, especially given the doubts anyone would reasonably have had that Sheila could have done it all herself, and left no forensic evidence. If she was in such a bad state of mind that she did this thing and then killed herself, why would she have taken any care at all to avoid leaving forensic evidence?

        I've always felt there was something very wrong with Bamber, psychologically, and his recall of what was on tv only makes him seem more cold and calculating to me. Obviously, if others were involved in the crime, they have escaped punishment and that is very wrong too, and frankly, the police are still not exactly covering themselves with glory over murder investigations, so if they screwed up over the Bamber case, and it results in a retrial, I just hope the truth of the matter will finally be established one way or the other beyond doubt.

        Love,

        Caz
        X
        Hi Caz,

        I’m certainly no expert on the case and I’m just in the process of re-reading the eBook but I can’t help thinking “how the hell can’t there be a reasonable doubt?” How can a man spend 35 years in prison based on a witness (Mugford) who lied and a police investigation where they withheld evidence, hid information and evidence and blatantly lied. Not once or twice but numerous times. Another example is of the Bible and the note.

        The photograph of the Bible next to Sheila’s body was not disclosed until 2002!. In 1986 Bamber’s Solicitor had seen a photograph of the Bible next to the body whilst he was at Witham Police Station. He asked the Police for a photograph of the Bible taken in isolation but the Police told him that the Bible had been destroyed and that there was no photograph of it in isolation. Despite saying this they produced close up photographs of the Bible at the 2002 Appeal when an official request was put in for them.

        From material received in 2002 that were previously under Public Interest Immunity show that at the time of the trial the Bible had not been destroyed and that the Police knew this. And because it existed and was actually available for use at the trial, but wasn’t used, it couldn’t be used at the Appeal. From the book:

        “Appeal judges stated that the Bible was a material exhibit and was available at the time of Jeremy’s trial. In effect, Jeremy explains, he was told “Bad luck, Jeremy - you had your chance at trial and blew it.” The Bible was not exhibited at trial because the material exhibits list shows that it was never brought into the court and it was not assigned a court exhibit number. Curiously though, disparity in the material disclosed to the defence from the 1991 City of London Police enquiry shows that the Bible was assigned the police exhibit reference DRH/44 and handed to the relatives in one document, yet in another it is listed as destroyed. [4] Curiously again, the same reference of DRH/44 was originally assigned to the hand swabs taken from Sheila Caffell at the mortuary on the 7th August 1985 and which were then examined at Huntingdon Laboratory on the 9th September 1985. [5]”

        Bamber’s team later found hat Forensic tests for prints were done on the Bible with ‘positive results.’ This means that they matched ‘someone’ but the Police never disclosed who this ‘someone’ was. It wasn’t until 1999 that the existence of these prints became known after they talked to an ex-Police Inspector on the case. In 1999 Bamber’s Defence requested the results from the CCRC but no tests or results ever appeared. These fingerprint results remain undisclosed but clearly they weren’t Bamber’s or it would have presented the Police with an open and shut case.

        Again from the book:

        “The deception by police in this instance went further. The Defence’s forensic scientist wrote to Paul Terzeon a few weeks before the trial. He stated: “a wealth of good quality fingerprints are now regularly being found by use of chemical treatments on paper - that the Holy Bible was not examined was incomprehensible.” So not only did Essex Police state to Paul Terzeon that the Bible had been destroyed, but they also told the defence fingerprint expert that nobody at all, even the prosecution, had tested the Bible for fingerprints.”

        Finally, again from the book:

        “Police attempts to manipulate what would have been the cornerstone of a case to prove Jeremy’s innocence at trial went even further. Clearly seen protruding from the pages of the Bible in more than one photograph is a handwritten note, which overwhelmingly supports the notion of a murder-suicide. It is reasonable to suggest this could be a suicide note from Sheila. This issue should have been fully explored at trial yet, along with the photographs of the Bible, police inexplicably never revealed finding this note, neither logging it or making mention of it in any witness statements or any other documents. This again unknowingly drew the Defence’s attention away from the Bible as an exhibit when, to constitute a fair and proper trial, all facts, detail and evidence relating to the Bible and the note should have been made fully transparent in court.”


        Regards

        Herlock



        “All conspiracy theories are the product of the subconscious attempt of an ignorant yet creative mind to counteract the fear of the unknown with the tales of fantasy.” Abhijit Naskar.

        “Conspiracy theorists, she knew, were paranoid by definition, and usually with good reason - they were indeed being watched, largely because they were standing on an upturned bucket, haranguing the sheeple with their wingnut delusions.” Mick Herron.

        ”The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and spirit of something your mind knows is a lie.” Shannon L. Alder.

        Comment


        • #19
          Apologies for the flood of info but it’s just as I come across excerpts in the eBook:

          “The drug analysis came back negative, apart from the tests showing a reduced dose of Haloperidol, a treatment for Schizophrenia and a trace of cannabis taken some four days earlier. Sheila had not been sedated. In support of Dr Vanezis views, Jeremy Bamber had no history of violence, has never had any mental illness and does not have any psychopathic traits as shown in 27 different assessments.

          Sheila Caffell on the other hand was delusional, volatile, suicidal and “could use physical aggression directed to property, herself or others” As detailed by her psychologist, her boyfriend and other witnesses who gave police statements.”
          Regards

          Herlock



          “All conspiracy theories are the product of the subconscious attempt of an ignorant yet creative mind to counteract the fear of the unknown with the tales of fantasy.” Abhijit Naskar.

          “Conspiracy theorists, she knew, were paranoid by definition, and usually with good reason - they were indeed being watched, largely because they were standing on an upturned bucket, haranguing the sheeple with their wingnut delusions.” Mick Herron.

          ”The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and spirit of something your mind knows is a lie.” Shannon L. Alder.

          Comment


          • #20
            “Dr Vanezis also stated that SOCO officers took hand swabs from both Sheila Caffell and Nevill Bamber, but none of the SOCO officers admitted to taking swabs from Nevill. Later, the hand swabs taken from Sheila Caffell were rejected by the lab. When they were returned to the lab a second time, they bore a different exhibit reference number, and only very low levels of lead were detected suggesting that Sheila had possibly handled the weapon but not fired it. This became key prosecution evidence. Why were the exhibit reference numbers for the swabs altered and what became of the hand swabs from Nevill Bamber which were never allocated an exhibit reference? Many of the key exhibits had altered reference numbers including the sound moderator and hacksaw blade.”
            Regards

            Herlock



            “All conspiracy theories are the product of the subconscious attempt of an ignorant yet creative mind to counteract the fear of the unknown with the tales of fantasy.” Abhijit Naskar.

            “Conspiracy theorists, she knew, were paranoid by definition, and usually with good reason - they were indeed being watched, largely because they were standing on an upturned bucket, haranguing the sheeple with their wingnut delusions.” Mick Herron.

            ”The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and spirit of something your mind knows is a lie.” Shannon L. Alder.

            Comment


            • #21
              “All DNA exhibits, apart from the sound moderator but including Sheila’s nightdress, were destroyed in 1996 and dumped at an incineration site off the North Circular Road in London, despite a court order to preserve them. [5] No one has been investigated or charged for this wholly illegal act in the destruction of valuable exhibits in a case where a whole life tariff prisoner maintains innocence.”

              Regards

              Herlock



              “All conspiracy theories are the product of the subconscious attempt of an ignorant yet creative mind to counteract the fear of the unknown with the tales of fantasy.” Abhijit Naskar.

              “Conspiracy theorists, she knew, were paranoid by definition, and usually with good reason - they were indeed being watched, largely because they were standing on an upturned bucket, haranguing the sheeple with their wingnut delusions.” Mick Herron.

              ”The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and spirit of something your mind knows is a lie.” Shannon L. Alder.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by caz View Post
                If this was all arranged by Bamber, could he not have got the killer to call him from the house, pretending to be Nevill putting the blame on Sheila? He'd know that the police would check any calls made. Could it have been established that the voice was definitely Nevill's? Or was it a process of elimination?

                If a third party could have been involved, it might open up some fresh possibilities to explain the order of events.

                Love,

                Caz
                X
                There’s no way of identifying the voice on the phone as the tapes of the calls are ‘missing.’ Originally the Police had said that they were destroyed but there’s evidence that copies were made.

                I can’t see any reason to eliminate the possibility of a third party Caz unless the question is dealt with later in the book satisfactorily. I still find it difficult to dismiss - schizophrenic / recently released/ reduced meds/ cannabis use/ family argument that night/ history of volatility and violence/ husband concerned about her…etc.
                Regards

                Herlock



                “All conspiracy theories are the product of the subconscious attempt of an ignorant yet creative mind to counteract the fear of the unknown with the tales of fantasy.” Abhijit Naskar.

                “Conspiracy theorists, she knew, were paranoid by definition, and usually with good reason - they were indeed being watched, largely because they were standing on an upturned bucket, haranguing the sheeple with their wingnut delusions.” Mick Herron.

                ”The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and spirit of something your mind knows is a lie.” Shannon L. Alder.

                Comment


                • #23
                  the son did it and framed his sister. its pretty obvious
                  but even the slim chance she did it, who cares. what an effed up family, and he deserves prison for his behavior anyway. probably saving future people from his BS. I have zero sympathy for criminals whos crimes hurt other people-violent or other. ef him

                  he earlier had broken into his dads other property and stole and made it look like a random burglary. he did it.
                  Last edited by Abby Normal; 06-16-2021, 08:45 PM.
                  "Is all that we see or seem
                  but a dream within a dream?"

                  -Edgar Allan Poe


                  "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
                  quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

                  -Frederick G. Abberline

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by caz View Post

                    I’ve always felt there was something very wrong with Bamber, psychologically, and his recall of what was on tv only makes him seem more cold and calculating to me.
                    X
                    Hi Caz.

                    Out of interest i’ve checked the listings for Bambers choice of viewing for the evening of the 6th of August, going into the early hours of the 7th.
                    Bear in mind that there were only four channels in 1985 and tv shut down not long after midnight.

                    On ITV the last show of the evening was a repeat of the detective show Travelling Man starting at 11:30 for an hour.

                    On CH4 was Ready Steady Go- finishing just after Midnight.

                    BBC1’s last programme was ‘Recovery, followed by The Weather at 11:35

                    And BBC2 had highlights of the day’s cricket, starting at 11:45.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post
                      the son did it and framed his sister. its pretty obvious
                      but even the slim chance she did it, who cares. what an effed up family, and he deserves prison for his behavior anyway. probably saving future people from his BS. I have zero sympathy for criminals whos crimes hurt other people-violent or other. ef him

                      he earlier had broken into his dads other property and stole and made it look like a random burglary. he did it.
                      There’s way to much against that verdict for me. The police have been proven to have lied and lied. They illegally destroyed evidence. They withheld evidence that pointed away from their preferred version of events and look at those that provided evidence against him. A girlfriend that he split with and who completely made up a story about a hit man then changed her mind. And family members who stood to profit big-time from Bamber’s imprisonment mysteriously found a silencer that the police somehow missed.

                      It’s difficult to see how breaking into a caravan park justifies spending the rest of your life in prison. Especially when there’s real evidence that Shiela had previously harmed her own children.
                      Regards

                      Herlock



                      “All conspiracy theories are the product of the subconscious attempt of an ignorant yet creative mind to counteract the fear of the unknown with the tales of fantasy.” Abhijit Naskar.

                      “Conspiracy theorists, she knew, were paranoid by definition, and usually with good reason - they were indeed being watched, largely because they were standing on an upturned bucket, haranguing the sheeple with their wingnut delusions.” Mick Herron.

                      ”The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and spirit of something your mind knows is a lie.” Shannon L. Alder.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post

                        There’s way to much against that verdict for me. The police have been proven to have lied and lied. They illegally destroyed evidence. They withheld evidence that pointed away from their preferred version of events and look at those that provided evidence against him. A girlfriend that he split with and who completely made up a story about a hit man then changed her mind. And family members who stood to profit big-time from Bamber’s imprisonment mysteriously found a silencer that the police somehow missed.

                        It’s difficult to see how breaking into a caravan park justifies spending the rest of your life in prison. Especially when there’s real evidence that Shiela had previously harmed her own children.
                        well the polices first preferred version of events were that sheila did it, but changed as new evidence came in. so they might have been confused and somewhat inept, perhaps even lied to cover up mistakes, but of actually committing some sort of conspiracy/ cover up goes a little too far imho.

                        and its a little too conveniant for me that the only one who was still alive was the one who profitted the most from the murders including hers, and then went on to enjoy the fruits of the murders. his behavior before of targeting his dad and staging it and then afterward profitting in their deaths point to him as being guilty as sin in my eyes. the police and court got it right in the end. theres no mystery in this one for me.
                        Last edited by Abby Normal; 06-16-2021, 09:24 PM.
                        "Is all that we see or seem
                        but a dream within a dream?"

                        -Edgar Allan Poe


                        "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
                        quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

                        -Frederick G. Abberline

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Just a final post of the evening on Sheila. We know that Bamber had zero history of violence and absolutely no psychopathic traits after a huge amount of testing. It’s also worth stating that he and his team fought to get a Lie Detector test which he finally got a passed easily.

                          So can we have confidence that Sheila wouldn’t have harmed her children and her family and yet Bamber would?

                          “Sheila’s contact with social services can only be traced back in documents as far as the 1st of August 1981. There were concerns by social workers at this point about her ability to seek medical advice promptly when the twins were ill, and there are references to Daniel sustaining scalds and a burn to parts of his body, including his torso and face, and having an ear infection that had been left unattended.”

                          ……

                          “The next conference on file was during March 1982 where it is stated that the children were being fostered by day foster parents. This is contrary to what the relatives had told police, although there are no notes as to the specific reason for fostering, and again there are no details as to why Sheila was admitted twice to hospital up until this point.”

                          …..

                          “On the 4th May 1983, Nicholas sustained a head injury which was caused, “it was thought by him falling from a taxi.” [10] The police were involved and confirmed this had happened. Sue Ford, then girlfriend of Jeremy Bamber, stated that Jeremy had told her that Nicholas had been injured when Sheila had pushed [Nicholas] from the taxi. Sue Ford also details in her statements that Farhad “Freddie” Emami had told her that Sheila used to punch the boys in the face, and that Jeremy was concerned that Sheila was unable to cope and had expressed a wish to help look after the children,”

                          …..

                          “Sheila Caffell was then referred to a private psychologist at St Andrews Hospital in Northampton during August 1983. Dr Hugh Ferguson stated that this was the first time he had seen her and diagnosed her “as in a state of acute psychosis.

                          …..

                          “The Bamber family, like many others, suffered in silence with little knowledge and understanding. Because of Doctor-Patient confidentiality, Nevill, June and Jeremy (and social services) had no idea that Sheila had thoughts about harming herself or of harming her children - but these thoughts were very real and are documented.”

                          …..

                          “Sheila had met Freddie, a mature 41 year old, back in 1981. Although he is often described as Sheila’s boyfriend, Freddie was married and called himself Sheila’s confidant and friend to whom she turned to for help and advice. Freddie said that Sheila had a “deep dislike” for her mother, June. [13] He described Sheila as having “a very quick and violent temper which she would lose over the simplest things.”

                          ….

                          “Whenever she returned from staying at White House Farm, she would be even more depressed because of June preaching to her about her lifestyle. Colin Caffell also said that Sheila had a quick temper and that Sheila’s condition always deteriorated rapidly after visiting her parents.”

                          ….

                          “During the call the phone went dead. Sheila suddenly became hysterical, mumbling about the phone being bugged. She became like someone possessed ranting and raving. She was striking herself and beating the wall with her fists. I tried to calm her but she did not seem to hear me. I became extremely frightened not only for her but for myself. She kept talking about the Devil and God and stated that God was sitting opposite her and, unlike what her step mother said, he in fact loved her.“

                          ….

                          “Whilst the first doctor was there Tara’s husband called to collect his daughter who was staying with Sheila. I had arranged for this as I felt something nasty might happen. I was extremely scared for everyone’s safety. At that time I felt that Sheila may use violence towards someone.”

                          ….

                          “Dr Ferguson had first diagnosed acute psychosis and later confirmed Schizophrenia. He described her as “a difficult patient to treat but once on medication and mending well became a completely different person.” Dr Ferguson also said that he was not happy about her leaving the hospital so soon and felt she needed follow up visits from a psychiatric nurse.”

                          …..

                          “In his statement of the 8th August 1985, he describes her treatment at St Andrews during 1983: “I found that Sheila had bizarre delusions about possession by the Devil and complex ideas about having sex with her twin sons. She thought the sons would seduce her and saw evil in both of them. In particular she thought Nicholas (her own son) was a woman hater and potential murderer. These feelings expressed were clear symptoms of paranoid schizophrenia.”

                          ….

                          “I have been shown and have read the statement made by Helen Grimster in which Sheila is described on 30th March as having been “very strange,” talking of having contemplated suicide on more than one occasion and of her belief that she was a white witch and had to get rid of evil in the world.“

                          ….

                          “By 2002, Dr Ferguson had made a statement to the Defence, which included the issue of a letter written by Colin Caffell to Nevill Bamber prior to the tragedies in which he presented the scenario that he take over care of the children. Dr Ferguson said that if Nevill had pleaded Colin Caffell’s case to Sheila, this may have had a catastrophic effect, and that she “may have projected on her father a concept of evil.” Dr Ferguson also told the trial that Sheila had told him that she was afraid she would murder her children.

                          …..

                          And finally, a sum up paragraph:

                          “Tragically, mentally ill women do kill their children and their families, and it has become more prevalent over the last three decades, particularly in the United States where a large portion of citizens own guns. This is a large area of research which I won’t develop any further here. Moreover, there are recent cases of mothers killing their children in the news in the UK, including mentally ill Sonia Bellfield, 29, who stabbed her two year old toddler to death having been seen two days previously by social workers. Paranoid schizophrenic Aisling Murray, 23, stabbed her daughter 52 times. In this case it was believed that Social Services were under-resourced and her social worker was inadequately supervised. 29-year-old Vivian Gamor killed her children in a psychotic episode and also had delusions about religion very similar to Sheila. Vivian thought that Jesus was her twin, but Social Services had granted her unsupervised access to her children when she killed them. It is apparent in all cases, including that of Sheila Caffell, that Social Services inadequately assessed the risk that these women posed to their children.”

                          ……

                          It’s one of the things that I find difficult about the case. We have no problem believing that Jeremy Bamber did this horrific act for money despite the fact that he had no history of violence and had no psychopathy although he gave the appearance of being a bit arrogant and had once broken in to a caravan park (also there was zero forensic evidence to connect him to the crime) and yet we think it unbelievable or even worse, reprehensible, that this very deeply disturbed young woman might indeed have done it. Deeply disturbed would be exactly how I’d describe the perpetrator of this crime.
                          Regards

                          Herlock



                          “All conspiracy theories are the product of the subconscious attempt of an ignorant yet creative mind to counteract the fear of the unknown with the tales of fantasy.” Abhijit Naskar.

                          “Conspiracy theorists, she knew, were paranoid by definition, and usually with good reason - they were indeed being watched, largely because they were standing on an upturned bucket, haranguing the sheeple with their wingnut delusions.” Mick Herron.

                          ”The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and spirit of something your mind knows is a lie.” Shannon L. Alder.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post

                            well the polices first preferred version of events were that sheila did it, but changed as new evidence came in. so they might have been confused and somewhat inept, perhaps even lied to cover up mistakes, but of actually committing some sort of conspiracy/ cover up goes a little too far imho.

                            and its a little too conveniant for me that the only one who was still alive was the one who profitted the most from the murders including hers, and then went on to enjoy the fruits of the murders. his behavior before of targeting his dad and staging it and then afterward profitting in their deaths point to him as being guilty as sin in my eyes. the police and court got it right in the end. theres no mystery in this one for me.
                            The new evidence was from Bamber’s jilted girlfriend who initially told a story about a hitman then changed it. And remember if we judge Bamber down for breaking into the caravan park then we should judge her down too as she was involved. When the verdict came in she was in a posh hotel room paid for by the News Of The World waiting for a big pay out for her story.

                            He wasn’t the only person to profit Abby, the family members who mysteriously found the silencer (which appears to be a red herring anyway) also stood to benefit hugely. One of them even ended up living at the farm.

                            I think that this might be the biggest miscarriage of justice in the history of the British Justice system.
                            Regards

                            Herlock



                            “All conspiracy theories are the product of the subconscious attempt of an ignorant yet creative mind to counteract the fear of the unknown with the tales of fantasy.” Abhijit Naskar.

                            “Conspiracy theorists, she knew, were paranoid by definition, and usually with good reason - they were indeed being watched, largely because they were standing on an upturned bucket, haranguing the sheeple with their wingnut delusions.” Mick Herron.

                            ”The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and spirit of something your mind knows is a lie.” Shannon L. Alder.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Ok I lied. This is my last post of the evening. This is the witness that basically got Bamber convicted. Why wouldn’t anyone believe her?

                              “In her 17th December 1985 statement, she states that by the 1st September she had said about Jeremy: “I would really love to hurt him and told him that I tried to stab the teddy bear that he had given me as a present.” Julie goes on to state that during that night, “We didn’t sleep well and at one point I got a pillow and put it over his head, I took it off and he asked me why I did it, and I said if he were dead he would always be with me.”

                              I wouldn’t have asked her the time never mind trusted her evidence.
                              Regards

                              Herlock



                              “All conspiracy theories are the product of the subconscious attempt of an ignorant yet creative mind to counteract the fear of the unknown with the tales of fantasy.” Abhijit Naskar.

                              “Conspiracy theorists, she knew, were paranoid by definition, and usually with good reason - they were indeed being watched, largely because they were standing on an upturned bucket, haranguing the sheeple with their wingnut delusions.” Mick Herron.

                              ”The most confused you will ever get is when you try to convince your heart and spirit of something your mind knows is a lie.” Shannon L. Alder.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Yabs View Post

                                Hi Caz.

                                Out of interest i’ve checked the listings for Bambers choice of viewing for the evening of the 6th of August, going into the early hours of the 7th.
                                Bear in mind that there were only four channels in 1985 and tv shut down not long after midnight.

                                On ITV the last show of the evening was a repeat of the detective show Travelling Man starting at 11:30 for an hour.

                                On CH4 was Ready Steady Go- finishing just after Midnight.

                                BBC1’s last programme was ‘Recovery, followed by The Weather at 11:35

                                And BBC2 had highlights of the day’s cricket, starting at 11:45.
                                Very thorough detective work, Yabs! Thank you.

                                Love,

                                Caz
                                X
                                "Comedy is simply a funny way of being serious." Peter Ustinov


                                Comment

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