The Christie Case

[Mayerling]

Wouldn't it be ££££££££?

It also (in the case of typing this line on the computer) whether the key board is for use in the U.S. or U.K.

Jeff

[contrafib]

I'm pleased that the forum has something to talk about again, even if it's mainly just to express collective frustration that this new BBC production will probably forego the chance to use the information from the official archives released since the 1971 film in favour of a sloppy rehash of the standard version. Then again, shouldn't judge before we see it. I imagine there'll be something of interest in it in some regard. Perhaps for example there could be more honest and make Beryl seem less physically alluring (as she was in reality) than they did by using Judy Geeson in the original film.

On a sidenote, I occasionally check you tube and it seems that people are continually reposting the 45-minute Christie documentary, presented by Fred Dineage, which again offers nothing new except the suggestion of Ethel's possible involvement in the supposed abortions carried out by Christie.

If you don't mind, a quick shameless plug and link for the unofficial audio commentary for '10 Rillington Place' that Honest John and I did a couple of years ago, for those new to the forum or who haven't heard it. Feedback, positive or negative, always welcome

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMlF_ejXwyw&list=PLJHwepa7LNQ0PGIuiY1uS6odIBpdwGG1r

[contrafib]

Also on you tube, if you search on 'to kill and kill again', someone has posted the episode on Jack The Ripper from the 2001 ITV series on serial killers. There was also an episode on Christie in that series, which will probably appear at some point. Although the standard version is again featured, the programme did feature some interesting stuff, including interviews with former residents and also with a woman called Peggy Baker, who met Christie in the mid-forties and made an appointment with him that luckily she couldn't keep. I'll keep an eye out and post it here if it appears on YT.

[wigngown]

10 Rillington Place, with Richard Attenborough as Christie was an excellent, if disturbing, film.

[contrafib]

Full of inaccuracies and based on a book with a pre-determined agenda (as all good agendas tend to be...)

[Rosella]

Yes little Tim Evans was putty in Cristie's hands of course, innocent, illiterate, quite harmless, wouldn't hurt a fly really, according to Ludovic. Pity Beryl told a different story, before she was bumped off!

[Sherlock]

I think I have suggested this before, but I wonder if Evans knocked out Beryl in the course of a violent row, panicked, and then fetched Christie who with the good fortune to have an unconscious victim provided for him strangled her and achieved sexual release without actually having intercourse, which he was unable to perform due to his enteritis. He might have told Evans to leave the room and see to the baby while he tried to help Beryl and then told him that he had been unable to save her and that Evans would therefore be charged with her murder.

[Sherlock]

The fact that no underwear was found on Beryl's body might or might not suggest an attempt at sexual interference by someone other than her husband. Also, although Evans claimed to have strangled Bery with a rope he brought home in his van, no rope was found in his flat as far as I am aware. I think that Christie claimed in one of his conflicting statements in 1953 that he had strangled Beryl with a stocking which he afterwards threw on the fire, and that he had attempted to have intercourse with Beryl but had been physically unable to do so because of his enteritis. Of course, anything Christie says must be treated with extreme caution, but as I think Molly Lefebure observed in her book, although both Evans and Christie were habitual liars there were also occasions when they told the truth. The question is when?

[Sherlock]

If Christie killed Beryl without actually having intercourse with her it might also explain why no traces of semen were found on her body at the post mortem.

It is not impossible that Christie then did then inform Evans that he could get Geraldine looked after by a couple in East Acton; Christie had worked in that area at Ultra Radio in the later part of the war, which may be why the district came into his head. He could then have strangled the baby after Evans's departure for Wales. Another scenario might be that he actually killed the baby with Evans's knowledge and maybe even in his presence. Donald Hume claimed that while on remand in Brixton Prison Evans had told him that he had been present when the child was killed by Christie. Once again, however, this claim should be treated with extreme caution as Hume was also apparently a habitual liar.

As far as I am aware the tie that was found around the baby's neck was never conclusively determined to have belonged to either Christie or Evans, which could have meant that either of them could have been responsible for her death, or even that they were both in collusion over it.

[Sherlock]

Due to Christie's back complaint the job of parcelling up Beryl's body and placing it in the wash house might have been done by Evans, possibly under the direction of Christie, and with or without Evans's knowledge that his child was dead or that it was intended to kill her. From pictures I have seen of the interior of the house the stairs were very narrow and awkward and it therefore seems somewhat unlikely that Evans would have been able to get the large bundle down the stairs in the middle of the night without making a good deal of noise and without waking the Christie's, as he claimed he had, particularly as he would have had to pass the Christie's bedroom to get to the yard.

Beryl's body was probably placed in Kitchener's flat as a temporary measure soon after her murder, possibly by Evans dragging it there while Christie looked on. Christie might possibly have told Evans that the wash house would also be a temporary resting place until he could dispose of it permanently down the drain at the front of the house, as Evans claimed.

[Sherlock]

It is also unknown precisely why Evans made the unexpected return to Rillington Place so soon after leaving. Was it because he was genuinely concerned for his daughter's welfare as he claimed, or was it to ensure that Christie was still keeping silent about her death as well as that of Beryl?

The scenario I have outlined in these posts assumes a good deal of collusion between Evans and Christie in the murders of Beryl and Geraldine which was sparked off by the the violent row between Beryl and Evans in the top flat. As I think I have said before, it is not impossible that Christie did indeed show Evans the St John's ambulance book prior to this and claimed that he could terminate Beryl's pregnancy, a claim he apparently made to other people although there is no evidence that he ever carried out an abortion or attempted to do so in spite of the claim by Mr Trevallian in the tv programme presented by Fred Dinenage. When Evans was informed by the police in Wales that the body of Beryl was not in fact in the drain he may have embroidered what Christie told him by claiming that the latter had indeed killed Beryl as a result of a botched abortion in order to deflect all the blame onto Christie, although it is uncertain if he knew that Geraldine was also dead at this stage.

[Sherlock]

It is also not impossible that Evans may have had some idea of loading the body of Beryl and possibly that of Geraldine onto his van and disposing them in some remote place, but that the loss of his job with Lancaster Food Products prevented this and instead prompted him to clear out of London and go to Wales, possibly at Christie's suggestion. I am not entirely clear whether Evans was actually fired from his job or resigned by mutual agreement with his boss.

I must stress that everything I have suggested in the previous posts is purely speculation, and that we will probably never know exactly what happened in 10 Rillington Place in Novembef 1949. There seems little doubt that Evans was, as F. Tennyson Jesse put it, a low form of life and a violent drunkard, but did that mean he had to be a murderer as well?

To this day in the eyes of the surviving members of his family Evans was completely innocent. Are they right?

I do not know, but truth can be stranger than fiction.

[contrafib]

Anyone know why that inaccurate Fred Dineage documentary is continually reposted on you tube? must be up to 50 versions of it now, almost like they are automatic reposts. On the subject of YT, here's something I found, with footage of R Place and a brief interview with one of Evans's relatives towards the end

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17fMiuiLb1A

[Rosella]

Thanks for posting this. It was very interesting. It's a revelation really isn't it that in 20th century Britain thousands lived in sub-standard accommodation like that shown on the video? Even more so when you realise that Timothy and Beryl Evans and their baby were stuck in two rooms on the top of 10 Rillington Place with no bathroom or WC near except the outside one in the back yard.

[GUT]

Thanks for posting this. It was very interesting. It's a revelation really isn't it that in 20th century Britain thousands lived in sub-standard accommodation like that shown on the video? Even more so when you realise that Timothy and Beryl Evans and their baby were stuck in two rooms on the top of 10 Rillington Place with no bathroom or WC near except the outside one in the back yard.

Unfortunately some people live in not much better conditions today