R.L.S., H.J., & E.H.: a questions of sources and results

[GUT]

[QUOTE=Henry Flower;405090]

Jeff, I admire your gift for comedy!

The idea that he read the play!

But don't you know the next degree he will claim is literature.

[Henry Flower]

He is busy decoding his gogmagog letter. Intrigued by the grand gilt coach he Googles the phrase. The third link takes him to Letters of Tennyson 1851-1870, which opens to a letter using a similar phrase. He goes to online-literature.com to explore some works of Tennyson, the third piece in the list of works is Queen Mary: A Drama. That's probably enough for him. He glanced at the link for the Dramatis Personae. He wrongly assumes it's the other Queen Mary, notes the presence of a Princess Elizabeth. It's done.

That is what the poster calls researching, analyzing sources. He loves the phrase internal and external source criticism, but we saw no evidence that he'd actually done anything more substantial than what I just did.

[Henry Flower]

[QUOTE=Mayerling;405082]

Hi Pierre,

I'm not asking here for how you connect ideas, like Mary Kelly, Lord Mayor's Day, and "Queen Mary" by Tennyson, but how you ended up ever reading the play. It's not a good play, and it is certainly not considered on the same level of any well known work by that poet, like "Idylls of the King", "Locksley Hall", "The Charge of the Light Brigade", or even his short poem, "Ulysses". This is the equivalent to somebody discussing, say Jules Verne, and instead of talking about "Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea" or "Journey to the Centre of the Earth", discussing the merits of some long forgotten short story, "The Humbug". I have nothing against literary studies, but this was from left field. Did you study up on Tennyson for a course?

Jeff

Jeff, I admire your gift for comedy!

The idea that he read the play!

[Mayerling]

[QUOTE=Pierre;405064]

Hi Jeff,

The murder of Mary Jane Kelly on Lord Mayor´s Day brought it to my attention.

Regards, Pierre

Hi Pierre,

I'm not asking here for how you connect ideas, like Mary Kelly, Lord Mayor's Day, and "Queen Mary" by Tennyson, but how you ended up ever reading the play. It's not a good play, and it is certainly not considered on the same level of any well known work by that poet, like "Idylls of the King", "Locksley Hall", "The Charge of the Light Brigade", or even his short poem, "Ulysses". This is the equivalent to somebody discussing, say Jules Verne, and instead of talking about "Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea" or "Journey to the Centre of the Earth", discussing the merits of some long forgotten short story, "The Humbug". I have nothing against literary studies, but this was from left field. Did you study up on Tennyson for a course?

Jeff

[Pierre]

[QUOTE=Mayerling;405034]

Well, a dichotomy representation of the two 16th Century Queens for Mary Kelly is curious, to say the least.

One thing has bothered me about the Tennyson play. I have a copy of it in an old edition of the complete poems and plays of Tennyson, and I ploughed through it. What brought that awful play to your attention?

Hi Jeff,

The murder of Mary Jane Kelly on Lord Mayor´s Day brought it to my attention.

Regards, Pierre

[GUT]

I think he might keep changing it! And Happy New Year, GUT.

Possibly.

Thanks and same to you and yours.

[John G]

Doubt he's really got a suspect.

I think he might keep changing it! And Happy New Year, GUT.

[GUT]

Happy New Year to you and your missus Gut.

Jeff

Thanks Jeff, same back to you.

[Mayerling]

Doubt he's really got a suspect.

Happy New Year to you and your missus Gut.

Jeff

[GUT]

Have you been reading Alice in Wonderland again, Pierre? Are there any other fairy tales that you also enjoy? Apart from the one about your suspect, of course.

Doubt he's really got a suspect.

[Henry Flower]

Thanks Jeff,

And David is continuing his attacks on me in his discussion with you, trying to correct you and misinterpreting me.

Mary is represented by the two queens: One for Lord Mayor´s Day in Tennysons play, one for the position of the arm in the painting.

Mary Kelly was killed on Lord Mayor´s Day and the killer positioned her arm as in the painting.

It is not "the same queen". It is one victim: one Mary with the attributes of two queens.

At least one could expect that people here were serious. But David is constantly making up lies about me and he is systematically misinterpreting everyting I write. So David is the one who is wrong.

Very sorry to bother you with it, Jeff.

Regards, Pierre

Any other Queen Marys you want to throw into the mix Pierre? Why stop at two? Interesting that this idea of two Marys reared its head only since David pointed out your hilarious error, or can you show us any earlier reference to it?

[Mayerling]

Happy New Year, David and Jeff!

Happy and healthy New Year to you John, and also to David.

Jeff

[Mayerling]

Thanks Jeff,

And David is continuing his attacks on me in his discussion with you, trying to correct you and misinterpreting me.

Mary is represented by the two queens: One for Lord Mayor´s Day in Tennysons play, one for the position of the arm in the painting.

Mary Kelly was killed on Lord Mayor´s Day and the killer positioned her arm as in the painting.

It is not "the same queen". It is one victim: one Mary with the attributes of two queens.

At least one could expect that people here were serious. But David is constantly making up lies about me and he is systematically misinterpreting everyting I write. So David is the one who is wrong.

Very sorry to bother you with it, Jeff.

Regards, Pierre

Well, a dichotomy representation of the two 16th Century Queens for Mary Kelly is curious, to say the least.

One thing has bothered me about the Tennyson play. I have a copy of it in an old edition of the complete poems and plays of Tennyson, and I ploughed through it. What brought that awful play to your attention? During the 19th Century only one major poet in Britain actually wrote a play that is still possible to act. It was Shelley, with his "murder play" "The Cenci", set in late Renaissance Italy. But Tennyson and Browning flopped as playwrites.

On another thread today, I made a joke regarding "Enoch Soames", the short novella by Max Beerbohm from a collection, "Seven Men and Two Others". One of the other novellas in that collection is Beerbohm's spoof of historical playwriting, "Savenarola Brown", about Beerbohm being executor to a would-be dramatist who spent most of his life trying to write a great historical drama about Renaissance Italy. Supposedly concerning an impossible love affair between the Florentine religious reformer Savenarola and Lucrezia Borgia, Beerbohm's "Brown" throws in every possible figure of the Renaissance, and at one point, in a stage direction, casts a dart at Browning. Among the myriads of historical figures we are told "Pippa passes."

Ploughing through Tennyson's murky cardboard figured historical work about the horrible burnings at Smithfield of Protestants in Mary I's reign, I realized that he too deserved his historical comeuppance in theatre: when his play about female education "The Princess" became Gilbert & Sullivan's only three act operetta, "Princess Ida". And even Gilbert's customary sheen as a comic master sort of wilted in "Ida' which (with "Utopia Ltd." and "The Grand Duke", among the operettas whose scores exist) it is rarely performed. I think "The Sorcerer" and "Ruddygore" (or "Ruddigore") are performed more often.

How did Tennyson's real dreck come to your attention? This really bugs me.

If you have a chance please explain.

Jeff

[David Orsam]

And to you John.

[John G]

Happy New Year, David and Jeff!