JUSTICE for the 96 ..Hillsborough

[Phil Carter]

I'm not sure I'd say they've received justice yet.

What they wanted..was to be believed that their own were not responsible for their deaths.. that there was a police cover up.. that the deaths were not an accident.. and that they be heard... no more whitewashing.. no more cover ups because the system allows it to happen.

Accountability will confirm the justice and remove any remaining injustice.


Phil

[Phil Carter]

Brilliant news. Shame Thatcher is not alive to pay her price in the cover up. I had two close friends at Uni who sold their tickets for the game, I also could not make it as I had to be home that weekend. The two kids who got their tickets did'nt make it. I'm just pleased after all this time the people affected by this can move on and have some closure. Justice for the 96!!!



Small world, so do I for my sins

Agreed. Great news.

[Phil Carter]

Football then was an entirely different game to what it is now. Today's sanitised version packaged for the middle class is nothing like what it was even as late as 1989 - even then it remained a sport for the working class.

I'm 42 now so went regular in the 1980s. I follow Sunderland and we always had a very large away following considering the lack of success the club has had since the 1950s. Sometimes we had far more in the away end than what was safe and most of us were half cut at the very least. I was born and bred on a council estate and as a regular home and away I have a good understanding of what football was about 30 years ago.

All that said, a charge of killing is not right. It's a step too far. Incompetent? Yes. Corrupt (as a result of the cover up and doctoring of statements)? Yes. But charged with killing? Not right in my opinion.

By the way, Phil, I think you follow Chelsea. Do you remember the cup quarter final Chelsea/Sunderland 1992? Monday night. I lost a job over that. Boss at work said: "you'll have to be in work Monday", so I said: "nee chance pal, I'll be travelling down to London for the match"..."I wouldn't if I were you"...."See you Tuesday"....was promptly sacked on the Tuesday.

That night at Chelsea, looked like we could have played for a fortnight and not scored so when the equaliser went in it was a sweet moment. Was it worth losing the job? 'Course it ******* was.

Hello FM,

there are 14 decisions made by the jury.
13 of them were unanimous.
1..only one..was majority.. 7-2
The rest were 9-0.

Taking into account over 800 witness statements.. over 2 years. It is the longest time ANY jury has sat in British legal history.

When you say.. a step too far.. you have of course the right to disagree with their verdict.. but be damned sure of one thing...

THIS verdict was not tainted by cover ups and lies. It considered the WHOLE agenda. Nothing was left out. Nothing.

It was as see through as could possibly be.

Now that tells me that all 9 people who sat on that jury went to the absolute limit of their thoughts to come to this conclusion. And the vast majority of the country..the footballing world in general, will agree with them. 14 times over.

They are backed by the HIP inquiry which overturned and threw out the 1991 verdict of accidental death. It was THIS inquiry, in 2012, that revealed the faults of those were were actually guilty of gross negligence in their jobs, and a systematic cover up to hide their blame for what happened.

This jury therefore, have been as scrupulous as possible. Accidental death was thrown out. Overturned. That leaves only a limited course of action. And considering unlawful killing was needed. Because, when all is said and done, there was an awful lot of incompetance, mis management, and down right lies told by those responsible. When people, a body...a public body, of senior officials get together and clearly pronounce that they will place the blame on the people that died themselves.. and football supporters in general.. then watch as 27 years of cover up help keep their names clean for the sake of self gratification.... then... THAT is the step too far.. not that they have been blamed for what they did.

I don't care who said what to whom at the time. I don't care one iota for excuses and how football was (I too come from a working class background)
I care for the truth...supressed by so many for so long.. to come out. And now it has. I dont care what person in what rank gets hammered over what he or she did or didnt do. Good I say. Every single damned one of them involved in this disgusting and disgraceful cover up SHOULD get hammered for their part in this.

I've been going to Chelsea since the mid sixties. Been to Stamford Bridge hundreds of times. Been to more away grounds than I care to remember..Hillsborough included. I've seen the worst.. and the best..of football supporters. I've seen the worst.. and the best..of policing.

The simple fact is that this decision was long...long overdue and it is a disgrace it should have taken so long. Little everyman has fought the system... humbly... and won.



Yes I remember the Sunderland game you mentioned.. just like I remember the trouncings Chelsea have had now and again from Sunderland since. :-)
I am sure you remember the day when Chelsea beat Sunderland 7-2 in 2010 as well :-)

Chelsea have played Sunderland in all competitions...

121 games
58 won
22 drawn
41 lost
212 for
178 against



Phil

[GUT]

I'm not sure I'd say they've received justice yet.

[Geddy2112]

Brilliant news. Shame Thatcher is not alive to pay her price in the cover up. I had two close friends at Uni who sold their tickets for the game, I also could not make it as I had to be home that weekend. The two kids who got their tickets did'nt make it. I'm just pleased after all this time the people affected by this can move on and have some closure. Justice for the 96!!!

I follow Sunderland...

Small world, so do I for my sins

[Fleetwood Mac]

Take a note of this. Inside a very few minutes.. the message came through to the BBC commentators that the gate was "broken Down" by supporters trying to get in. Then it was a "broken" gate.

It isnt until Des Lynam reports that the supporters themselves tell him that the gates were opened by the police.

From the first minutes..the police lied.

Then they gave orders for the gate to be opened...

Watch that story... it is still harrowing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Am6vmX9SuOY

Football then was an entirely different game to what it is now. Today's sanitised version packaged for the middle class is nothing like what it was even as late as 1989 - even then it remained a sport for the working class.

I'm 42 now so went regular in the 1980s. I follow Sunderland and we always had a very large away following considering the lack of success the club has had since the 1950s. Sometimes we had far more in the away end than what was safe and most of us were half cut at the very least. I was born and bred on a council estate and as a regular home and away I have a good understanding of what football was about 30 years ago.

All that said, a charge of killing is not right. It's a step too far. Incompetent? Yes. Corrupt (as a result of the cover up and doctoring of statements)? Yes. But charged with killing? Not right in my opinion.

By the way, Phil, I think you follow Chelsea. Do you remember the cup quarter final Chelsea/Sunderland 1992? Monday night. I lost a job over that. Boss at work said: "you'll have to be in work Monday", so I said: "nee chance pal, I'll be travelling down to London for the match"..."I wouldn't if I were you"...."See you Tuesday"....was promptly sacked on the Tuesday.

That night at Chelsea, looked like we could have played for a fortnight and not scored so when the equaliser went in it was a sweet moment. Was it worth losing the job? 'Course it ******* was.

[Phil Carter]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XaBnY-SnwxA

just so you all know why people never gave in to lies.



Phil

[Phil Carter]

Take a note of this. Inside a very few minutes.. the message came through to the BBC commentators that the gate was "broken Down" by supporters trying to get in. Then it was a "broken" gate.

It isnt until Des Lynam reports that the supporters themselves tell him that the gates were opened by the police.

From the first minutes..the police lied.

Then they gave orders for the gate to be opened...

Watch that story... it is still harrowing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Am6vmX9SuOY

[Phil Carter]

Hi Phil,
I wonder how the Sun will report on this result!
The right verdict but too late for some of the families.
Regards
Albert

Indeed... but I believe that the then editor has..long ago.. apologised unreservedly for the printing of the words written.

It will be up to the authorities now to sift the chaff from the wheat of blame... before..during and after the event.


Phil

[Albert]

Hi Phil,
I wonder how the Sun will report on this result!
The right verdict but too late for some of the families.
Regards
Albert

[Phil Carter]

Accountability


That is what should happen next.



The Shadow Home Secretary has backed the families for years.. he wont let any more lies be told. Theresa May, Home Secretary, will now see to it that those responsible get what is coming to them.

Retirements on grounds of ill health won't help this time.

[Pcdunn]

Tragic story. Excellent coverage here at CNN. Com

http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/26/football/hillsborough-disaster-liverpool-trevor-hicks-jenni-hicks/?iid=ob_article_organicsidebar_expansion

I am so sorry for what the families went through that day. Cheers for truth and justice triumphing at last.

[Phil Carter]

The 96 football fans who died in the Hillsborough disaster were unlawfully killed, an inquest jury has concluded - and police have admitted they got it "catastrophically wrong".

The jurors ruled that the behaviour of fans did not cause or contribute to the tragedy, which happened when supporters were crushed before an FA Cup semi-final between Liverpool and Nottingham Forest on April 15, 1989.

The unlawful killing conclusion, reached by a majority of seven to two of the jurors, was greeted with sobbing and cheers at the hearing in Warrington.

Lawyers acting for relatives of the victims said the jury's findings had completely vindicated their 27-year fight for justice.

The Crown Prosecution Service has said it will "formally consider whether any criminal charges should be brought against any individual or corporate body", while Home Secretary Theresa May will appear before MPs on Wednesday to set out the Government's response

In order to reach a verdict of unlawful killing, jurors had to be convinced that the match commander, chief superintendent David Duckenfield, owed a duty of care to those who died in the disaster, and that he was in breach of that duty of care.

Third, they also had to be satisfied that his breach of duty caused the deaths, and fourthly, that it amounted to "gross negligence".

Mr Duckenfield gave the order at 2.52pm to open exit Gate C in the Leppings Lane end of the stadium, allowing around 2,000 fans to pour into the already packed central pens behind one of the goals.

The jurors had to reach decisions on a total of 14 questions about the disaster that were put to them before they began their deliberations at the end of the longest jury hearing in British legal history.

As part of their deliberations, they had to consider a range of questions covering police preparation for the ill-fated FA Cup semi-final, policing on the day, the response of the emergency services, management of the stadium by Sheffield Wednesday FC, and the behaviour of fans.

They concluded that both the police and the ambulance service caused or contributed to the loss of lives by an error or omission after the crush had started to develop.


The jurors also unanimously found that the policing of the game caused or contributed to a dangerous situation developing at the turnstiles.


They ruled that commanding officers also caused or contributed to the crush, as did those senior officers in the police control box when the order was given to open the exit gate at the Leppings Lane end.
After the key conclusions were delivered, someone in court shouted "God bless the jury", and the jurors were applauded as they left the courtroom.

The original inquests in 1991 ruled the supporters had died accidentally, but the families vowed to overturn the verdicts.

This happened in 2012 with the publication of the Hillsborough Independent Panel report.

South Yorkshire Police Chief Constable David Crompton ,speaking outside court, says his force "unequivocally" accept the conclusion of unlawful killing and wider findings of Hillsborough Inquests.

"I want to make it absolutely clear that we unequivocally accept the verdict of unlawful killing and the wider findings reached by the jury in the Hillsborough Inquest," Crompton said.

"On [April] 15, 1989, South Yorkshire Police got the policing of the FA Cup semi-final at Hillsborough catastrophically wrong. It was, and still is, the biggest disaster in British sporting history.

"That day, 96 people died and the lives of many others were changed forever. The force failed the victims and their families. Today, as I have said before, I want to apologise unreservedly to the families and all those affected."

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/10258828/hillsborough-disaster-96-were-unlawfully-killed-jury-decides

And the question I ask..now that the responsibility has been pointed in the right direction after 27 years is this...

What will happen now to the policemen, ex policemen and ambulance service people responsible for this massive cover up?..Because the fog of lies has been lifted at last. Normal folk knew the truth from day one.. and I will never ever forget some of the stuff policemen said of that day..trying to blame the fans for their own deaths included, whilst doing everything in their power to cover their own backsides from that day onwards.. INCLUDING re-editing, behind some of the individuals backs, the statements that came in..including those from police individuals.

This disgusting episode has soiled the name of the police..again...but it wasnt just one individual this time..it was a bunch of self interested people who cared not one iota for anyone but their own name and their workforce.
It wasnt just the bottom rung..it went all the way to the top. Because of that over used Word...loyalty.

A loyalty that went way beyond their much used motto...

"without fear nor favour".

I simply cannot accept not one reason in response for such actions used from that time. The whole bunch of them should be totally and utterly ashamed of their actions , their words and their complicit agreement to hide the truth. The families didn't lie. Policemen did.

800 witnesses testified to the conclusion that made that a fact.... a fact. 800!!!!!!

The apologies of the police today are 27 years too late.

The jury that was needed now can hold their heads high.

As a Chelsea supporter..a football supporter..we true football fans from whatever club.. feel for the families and the fantastic campaign never to give in to lies and cover ups, smear campaigns and fogging the issue.

Justice for the 96... UNLAWFULLY KILLED.

Thats the bottom line.