Donald Trump

[Joshua Rogan]

People once dreamt of putting a man on the moon.

Wasn't it a capitalist democracy that made the dream happen?

[Harry D]

Wasn't it a capitalist democracy that made the dream happen?

Only to stop the Commies getting there first.

[Steadmund Brand]

And then to many Trump voters (not all...don't start the hate mail)... we never DID put a man on the moon (that was an actual poll done... Trump voters asked about different "conspiracy theories").....shocking

Steadmund Brand

[Svensson]

Would it sound more believable if I said it WAS done but it was done using Nazi-technology..?

[Mayerling]

Would it sound more believable if I said it WAS done but it was done using Nazi-technology..?

Well, to be fair, the rocket program was based on the work of Von Braun and others. But we could keep going backward. All those scientists (as kids) liked to read Wells ("First Men in the Moon") and Jules Verne ("From the Earth to the Moon" and "Around the Moon", and maybe "Hector Servedac" - "To the Sun" and "Off on a Comet!"). Want to go back to Cyrano de Bergerac's use of morning dew to lift him up, or Edgar Allen Poe's "Hans Pfall"?


Jeff

[Sam Flynn]

Wasn't it a capitalist democracy that made the dream happen?

There's me thinking it was science.

[Pcdunn]

"...by the end of the decade..."

There's me thinking it was science.

Science, p!us a President who gave them a deadline...

[Wickerman]

And it helps when you have a president who believes in science, mind you that takes education.....

[Sam Flynn]

And it helps when you have a president who believes in science, mind you that takes education.....

We're doomed!

[Wickerman]

Washington Post - Breaking News
Now we find out that Trump deceived the American public by asking the president of Mexico to stop saying they won't pay for the wall.
Trump didn't want the press to make a big deal out of that, (he said) but of course Mexico will not have to pay for the wall - he explained that 'we can work something out'.

Every day, more lies, more deceit.

[jason_c]

Washington Post - Breaking News
Now we find out that Trump deceived the American public by asking the president of Mexico to stop saying they won't pay for the wall.
Trump didn't want the press to make a big deal out of that, (he said) but of course Mexico will not have to pay for the wall - he explained that 'we can work something out'.

Every day, more lies, more deceit.

Why is that deceiving the American public? Asking the Mexican President to stop saying Mexico will not pay for the wall is not deception. It's simply asking the Mexican President to tone down his rhetoric. Yes, I realise Trump asking someone to tone down the rhetoric may induce a coughing fit in some, but its still not deception on Trump's part. It all sounds like an attempt at negotiating to me.

[Wickerman]

Why is that deceiving the American public? Asking the Mexican President to stop saying Mexico will not pay for the wall is not deception. It's simply asking the Mexican President to tone down his rhetoric. Yes, I realise Trump asking someone to tone down the rhetoric may induce a coughing fit in some, but its still not deception on Trump's part. It all sounds like an attempt at negotiating to me.

The deception is that he insisted Mexico WILL pay for the wall. But on the phone he told the president of Mexico that "we can work something out". He knew Mexico was not going to pay for the wall and Trump was looking for some way out for him to not look so stupid to his base. He can't dig his way out of this hole he dug for himself if Mexico keep insisting they will not pay for the wall.
He needs Mexico to present a 'negotiation' face as opposed to a face of 'resistance'.

[Svensson]

In a way, there is nothing new in this "leak" . Trump's had no plan to make Mexico pay for the wall and this transcript merely confirmed this. He also had no plan on how to defeat ISIS, at least, he hasn't don't anything different yet. He also had no plan on health care, simple asking McConnell to propose a plan. He even had to read the bullet points of that plan off a sheet of paper because he wasn't even aware of its basics. As for North Korea, his entire plan was to say to China: " you deal with them". Which they haven't. So as far as I can tell, he never had a plan for anything that you would consider "big ticket" .

Anyways, I remain convinced that a fat lady is on her way to Washington. With the Grand Jury impaneled, we are now certain Mueller does have evidence, we just don't (yet) know what it is and how serious that evidence is.

[Wickerman]

I think it's fair to say he never planned on winning the election. Several stories leaked out of his campaign that he was only in this for the prestige, as a presidential candidate he could charge more for his hotel rooms, memberships & services.

Today, I think his only interest is milking the system for all he can get out of it.
He doesn't care about policies and making things better for Americans. He is earning millions in his hotels & golf courses. And his attempt at tax changes, financed by the cuts in healthcare, which will put billions more in his pocket, at the expense of the suffering American people, only serves to emphasize his deceptive agenda.

[jason_c]

The deception is that he insisted Mexico WILL pay for the wall. But on the phone he told the president of Mexico that "we can work something out". He knew Mexico was not going to pay for the wall and Trump was looking for some way out for him to not look so stupid to his base. He can't dig his way out of this hole he dug for himself if Mexico keep insisting they will not pay for the wall.
He needs Mexico to present a 'negotiation' face as opposed to a face of 'resistance'.

Nothing I have seen in the conversation(I haven't read the entire transcript only selected parts) suggests anything you say its suggesting. Yes, Trump said Mexico will pay for the wall. Trump did not say Mexico would pay for 100% of the wall. Trump did not specify the % Mexico would pay. I, and many others, kinda assumed this meant Mexico would pay for most of the wall not necessarily all. It didnt mean Mexico would pay for the entirety of the cost.

Trump will be trying to bring in legislation that will ensure Mexico pays for significantly more than 50% of the Wall's construction cost. The Mexican President will be fighting to pay 0%. If Trump can get the Mexicans to pay for much more than 50% of the wall then its a victory for Trump. If the Mexicans end up paying significantly less than 50% is probably a loss for Trump. A 50:50 split is a messy draw.

Much of the negotiating will surround not only the % that Mexico end up paying but also the timeframe for Mexico paying. It is these details that Trump will have been negotiating on in this leaked transcript. Again, its negotiating not deception, or it is only deception if Mexico ultimately end up paying relatively little cost towards the wall.