December 6, 1995 Rettendon triple murder

[DrummondStreet]

First off, Happy Sunday morning!

Does anyone across the pond remember a triple homicide involving 3 gangsters each of whom was shot multiple times with a shotgun while sitting in their Range Rover on Workhouse Lane? Their names were Pat Tate, Tony Tucker, and Craig Rolfe.

I've looked at the crime scene photos and the ballistics/physics look strange to me. Were any police reports ever released that proposed a credible scenario describing the series of events that took place during the shootings? For example, Who was shot first? Was the shooter a passenger in the car or was the broken backseat passenger window cause by external gunfire?

[Fleetwood Mac]

First off, Happy Sunday morning!

Does anyone across the pond remember a triple homicide involving 3 gangsters each of whom was shot multiple times with a shotgun while sitting in their Range Rover on Workhouse Lane? Their names were Pat Tate, Tony Tucker, and Craig Rolfe.

I've looked at the crime scene photos and the ballistics/physics look strange to me. Were any police reports ever released that proposed a credible scenario describing the series of events that took place during the shootings? For example, Who was shot first? Was the shooter a passenger in the car or was the broken backseat passenger window cause by external gunfire?

From what I remember, those shooting and those being shot were business associates of a sort and Pat Tate in particular had ruffled a few feathers among these business associates.

If memory serves, the shooter was not in the car but was waiting down the end of the lane. The driver of the car got to the end of the lane and got out leaving the other 3 in the car and that is when the shooter emerged.

[DrummondStreet]

Thanks for your reply, Fleetwood. Did you live in the area (southeastern-ish England) at the time?

You're right about the gangsters ruffling feathers. As much as I don't wish death upon anyone, these men had murdered nonviolent "business associates" and threatened/terrorized the innocent relatives of other associates. They were violent thugs --live by the sword, die by the sword.

When I looked at the crime scene photos --stumbled upon them by accident, really, I wondered if the victims weren't shot from multiple angles. The left side rear passenger window was shot out (w/ bloody glass on inside of car), but the victim closest to that window (Tate) had left-side exit wounds indicating that he was shot from the right. The driver was still clutching the wheel and he had both left and right exit wounds. I think the killer(s) must have entered the car at some point, maybe to finish his victims off. The photos were incredibly gruesome; shotguns do a lot of damage.

This case intrigues me because at the time it occurred, I was a young American girl aching to move to England one day --a place that I had over-romanticized quite a bit. I was completely unaware of these murders until just a few days ago. It's funny because I was closely following the UK news and pop culture at the time and don't know how I missed it.

[Fleetwood Mac]

Thanks for your reply, Fleetwood. Did you live in the area (southeastern-ish England) at the time?

You're right about the gangsters ruffling feathers. As much as I don't wish death upon anyone, these men had murdered nonviolent "business associates" and threatened/terrorized the innocent relatives of other associates. They were violent thugs --live by the sword, die by the sword.

When I looked at the crime scene photos --stumbled upon them by accident, really, I wondered if the victims weren't shot from multiple angles. The left side rear passenger window was shot out (w/ bloody glass on inside of car), but the victim closest to that window (Tate) had left-side exit wounds indicating that he was shot from the right. The driver was still clutching the wheel and he had both left and right exit wounds. I think the killer(s) must have entered the car at some point, maybe to finish his victims off. The photos were incredibly gruesome; shotguns do a lot of damage.

This case intrigues me because at the time it occurred, I was a young American girl aching to move to England one day --a place that I had over-romanticized quite a bit. I was completely unaware of these murders until just a few days ago. It's funny because I was closely following the UK news and pop culture at the time and don't know how I missed it.

No bother, Drummond.

No, I'm from the North East which is an entirely different part of England when compared with London and its environs. Think New York compared with some place in the US where people want simple lives by and large.

From what I know, Pat Tate and associates were amateurs who got a bit ahead of themselves. They made a lot of noise unnecessarily and drew attention to themselves in a way that the serious players wouldn't dream of.

It caught up with them in the end and they got done in. Just a matter of time really.

They weren't really gangsters. They'd come up through the drug/ecstasy/club scene around the mid to late '80s which was all over England and they made a few bob out of it. They got a promotion of sorts but were never in the same league as the big hitters which is why they ended up in a coffin.

Romanticised England? There certainly is a romantic side to England, but like the US you wouldn't want to be caught out by the wrong people. It isn't all charming villages, although there are many.

[Fleetwood Mac]

This is where I live, Drummond:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iueq8V-ThM

A world away from those city dwelling types in the capital. People round here shoot game, not humans.

[DrummondStreet]

Dent looks like a beautiful and peaceful little village.

Perhaps idealized is a better word than romanticized. I finally got the chance to live in London (as a BUNAC student) but it was nothing like I had imagined. There was certainly more crime/violence than I had anticipated. Also, London can be a bit cold and aloof, but I guess that is a problem with most large and fast-paced cities. The people in smaller English towns struck me as much friendlier.

It's funny, soon after I returned to the States, I missed London like crazy and still do .

[GUT]

G'day Fleetwood Mac

Looks like my sort of place.

[Cogidubnus]

Stick in the Mud

Hi FM

More years ago than I care to remember I spent two or three weeks in the West Riding of Yorkshire, (also on the Settle - Carlisle Railway line but think three peaks), and ever since have had a kind of lasting affection for the rugged but beautiful type of landscape your YouTube clip shows.

In many ways I envy you, but think in reality, I'd have huge difficulty tearing myself away from my abiding love of the rolling green South Downs with the verdant Weald behind...and the sound of the gulls...and the sea...things we who live with them tend to take for granted most of the time...

I was born in what is now a city (albeit in largely rural Sussex)...escaped at 31, and am now approaching 61...I wouldn't want to go back to city life...but nor would I want to shift from Sussex!

All the best

Dave