Cricket

[Herlock Sholmes]

You either love it or hate it but I thought I’d start this threads for any cricket-related comment or discussion.

[Herlock Sholmes]

I have a cricket-based ‘conspiracy theory.’ Yes I know….irony of the year.

I’ve had the impression for a few years that there is a movement to either eliminate entirely or to reduce the time taken up by test cricket in the calendar. I like shorter form cricket but I prefer test cricket and I think that, in these days of big money shorter form games, test cricket is now considered a bit of an inconvenience to some of those in authority. It used to be the case that one day international cricket was fitted in around the test calendar but I get the feeling that it’s now the other way round? Hence the short series that we see (one and two tests)

Teams are scoring quicker in general and so we are getting more and more tests finishing in 3 or 4 days and now of course we have Bazball. Are there hopes in some quarters that all teams will eventually adopt this approach leading to a call for test matches to be reduced in duration to 4 or even 3 days? I hope not. I’m convinced that some in authority would be glad to see the back of test cricket though so could a hoped for spread of the Bazball outlook lead eventually to this?

Bazball is certainly entertaining and England have had recent success with it but for me it introduces with the risks an element of luck. They have employed it rigidly against their toughest opponents yet and are in very real danger of losing 3-0. Attacking cricket is one thing but gung-ho T20 style batting is always going to struggle against a tough team playing tough cricket.

[Enigma]

Agreed Herlock. T20 tactics in a Test match are entertaining and may be successful from time to time. All the same, those tactics rely heavily on luck and will inevitably come unstuck. The proverb of the tortoise and hare is applicable.

[Svensson]

BAZball is the future, but we have only seen it's first iteration. In a way, the Aussies are doing england a Favour here by outsmarting England tactically and in overall game management. Bazball will need recalibrating following this series and there needs to be acknowledgement that Bazball is maybe not for the entire XI. A place needs to be found for a specialist WK, you just don't get away with a "bazball part-timer" in tests. I'm just relieved that for the first time since Strauss' retirement (in 2012 or 2013?) the spotlight is not on the openers.....

[Herlock Sholmes]

Agreed Herlock. T20 tactics in a Test match are entertaining and may be successful from time to time. All the same, those tactics rely heavily on luck and will inevitably come unstuck. The proverb of the tortoise and hare is applicable.

In any game you have to play to the circumstances and England aren’t doing that. The Aussies are.

I have a bit of an ‘issue’ with Moeen Ali too (I don’t know if others agree or not) He’s a really talented cricketer but he’s an under-achiever because of the unshakeable way that he plays. He’s played some of the best England innings in recent years but he only averages 28 and I can’t think of any other batsman who has got out so often playing daft shots? And yet the selectors send the message to all younger players that they just don’t justify a place in the test team by bringing Ali out of retirement. A young spinner like Rehan Ahmed, who took 7 wickets on his debut against Pakistan and who can bat doesn’t get a game. In the last test we played 5 fast-medium bowlers!

[Herlock Sholmes]

BAZball is the future, but we have only seen it's first iteration. In a way, the Aussies are doing england a Favour here by outsmarting England tactically and in overall game management. Bazball will need recalibrating following this series and there needs to be acknowledgement that Bazball is maybe not for the entire XI. A place needs to be found for a specialist WK, you just don't get away with a "bazball part-timer" in tests. I'm just relieved that for the first time since Strauss' retirement (in 2012 or 2013?) the spotlight is not on the openers.....

Yeah, I’m a fan of Bairstow as a batsman but he’s been so poor behind the stumps. Maybe they should go back to Ben Foakes? I’ve just checked - he’s only averaging 5 less than Bairstow with the bat.

[Svensson]

so that's 10 runs per test. He will save 10 runs on byes alone and won't drop catches that cost 50 or 100 runs.....

#nobrainer

[String]

I always found that cricket is much better played than watched. In fact I can’t stand watching it but if someone asked to give it a go I would.

[Herlock Sholmes]

I always found that cricket is much better played than watched. In fact I can’t stand watching it but if someone asked to give it a go I would.

I wish that I still played but the body just says ‘forget it, the pub’s open.’

[Herlock Sholmes]

2-1 to the Aussies. On to Manchester with 2 to play and England having to win both. It’s a big ask but not impossible.

[GBinOz]

2-1 to the Aussies. On to Manchester with 2 to play and England having to win both. It’s a big ask but not impossible.

Australia did it in the first two matches.

I am disappointed in the current trend of over after over of short pitched deliveries employed by both sides. It puts me in mind of Jardine's bodyline leg theory. That was eliminated by rule changes. The current tactic is not even allowed in T20 and should, IMHO, be eliminated.

I am also disappointed when rarely employed rules are used to gain a short term advantage - the Starc catch and the Bairstow runout. Was nothing learned from the Chappell under-arm incident?

Thus endeth the sermon for today. I'm impressed with the crowds patronising the Ashes. Is this due to BAZball, or are they looking to traditional cricket. I was impressed with Stokes declaration in the first test, even though he's taken some flak for the decision. I'm all for aggressive cricket, but not intimidatory.

As with the Ali/Ahmed example above, it will be interesting to see if Marsh retains his place in the team if Green is fit to play the next test. IMO it is Warner's tenancy in the team that should be considered instead. Likewise with the Lyon/Murphy selection.

Cheers, George

[Herlock Sholmes]

Australia did it in the first two matches.

I am disappointed in the current trend of over after over of short pitched deliveries employed by both sides. It puts me in mind of Jardine's bodyline leg theory. That was eliminated by rule changes. The current tactic is not even allowed in T20 and should, IMHO, be eliminated.

I am also disappointed when rarely employed rules are used to gain a short term advantage - the Starc catch and the Bairstow runout. Was nothing learned from the Chappell under-arm incident?

Thus endeth the sermon for today. I'm impressed with the crowds patronising the Ashes. Is this due to BAZball, or are they looking to traditional cricket. I was impressed with Stokes declaration in the first test, even though he's taken some flak for the decision. I'm all for aggressive cricket, but not intimidatory.

As with the Ali/Ahmed example above, it will be interesting to see if Marsh retains his place in the team if Green is fit to play the next test. IMO it is Warner's tenancy in the team that should be considered instead. Likewise with the Lyon/Murphy selection.

Cheers, George

Totally agree on excessive short stuff George. I’ve read Bodyline Autopsy and I’ve just ordered a book called Bodyline Mythology which seems to be a book that says that England/Jardine’s ‘heartless’ attitude was exaggerated by invented or exaggerated quotes but I’m wary of bias on the subject. It may be fair though as it includes conversations with Larwood. Bodyline certainly wasn’t good though. Imagine what the reaction would have been if Clive Lloyd had set the same kind of fields for Holding and co? Imagine Bodyline with Lillee and Thommo.

On the Starc catch,I have to say that this is a slight bugbear of mine. I’ve seen this many times in recent years (from players of all nationality) where catches have been awarded on replay when, to me, the ball has clearly touched the ground. You’re right that it would be easy to clear up the Bairstow issue with a clarification of the ruling. It’s the same with ‘mankading’ which I still believe there’s no actually ruling on. Just making it a rule that you have to give the batsmen a warning (via the umpire) first seems a simple enough solution and avoids all accusations of poor sportsmanship.

I have to say that I was doubtful when Stokes was made captain but I’ve been proven wrong. He’s done well.

Talent-wise I don’t think that there’s anything to choose between the two sides. I just think that England need to take a leaf out of the Aussies book and play as the situation of the game dictates. Australia have certainly had a blow with Lyon’s injury btw. I’m certainly looking forward to the 4th test though.

[Svensson]

Yep. Australia are tactically far superior but hey.... Word in the street is indeed that Warner may have played his last Ashes test and that a reshuffle of some kind will accomodate both Green as well as Marsh for the next test. Clearly, there are dark forces at play to prevent Stuart Broad from going past McGrath's 17 dismissals of Atherton at all cost.

I have no problem with the short stuff. It's supposed to be a test for all players. The only thing is that is usually shows that the captain is out of ideas.... If you don't like to see the short stuff, go and watch some T20

[Scott Nelson]

Oh yes...and Druitt was a cricketer. Why did you have to start this?

[Herlock Sholmes]

Oh yes...and Druitt was a cricketer. Why did you have to start this?

I blame Druitt for England being 2-1 down Scott.