What offends you?

[Fleetwood Mac]

You talk as if a society that is more respectful is somehow less appealing. Do you really want to go back to the days when disabled children were called 'spastics' in the street ? Do you want to walk past guest houses with the sign 'no blacks - no Irish - no dogs in the window?

Why would anyone defend their right and other people's right to be offensive to others? Aren't we supposed to move forwards in tolerance and respect and human understand instead of retreating to ignorance and ridicule?

Limehouse:

a) Tolerance is not a human right; it is a view/opinion relating to the best means of achieving a peaceful co-existence (see John Locke).

b) If you think that tolerance needs to be forced upon us, which by extension you clearly do as you're advocating the right to not be offended, then we're lost anyway; and in essence you're imposing your (tolerant) opinions on my freedom of expression. What's more important? Your wish to tell me what to say, or my wish to have a voice while leaving you alone?

c) You are straight out of the Robespierre book of 'we must force the people to be free', except you're saying 'we must force the people to be tolerant'. And you know where Robespierre's ideas led? 'The Terrors'. This is why the left is so dangerous: they really believe they are the law, and if you don't agree with them they'll enforce it (all because the left think they're virtuous human beings whose **** doesn't smell like the rest of us).

You're tyrants, mate. The worst kind. Not only are you tyrants, but you appeal to people's emotions: "we just want to make you all free". I am ******* free, leave me alone with your idea of freedom!

P.S. Have a look at what you've just posted! Absolute bollocks about ignorance, ridicule, human understanding and the rest; the ususal appeal to abstract notions and nothing practical such as: 'you and I are neighbours, you keep your dog off my lawn and I'll keep my dog off your lawn, and we'll enjoy our privacy'.

[TomTomKent]

You talk as if a society that is more respectful is somehow less appealing. Do you really want to go back to the days when disabled children were called 'spastics' in the street ? Do you want to walk past guest houses with the sign 'no blacks - no Irish - no dogs in the window?

Why would anyone defend their right and other people's right to be offensive to others? Aren't we supposed to move forwards in tolerance and respect and human understand instead of retreating to ignorance and ridicule?

Yes, we should move forwards, and in my experience most broadcasts that people assume were "censored" were not. They were however complained heavily against when they were found offensive by a lot of people. Here in the UK, and abroad.

[Limehouse]

My estimation is that you have it the wrong way round.

Once upon a time you could say whatever you wanted in the knowledge that the thought police wouldn't be on your case. These days we have all sorts of waifs and strays jumping on the bandwagon of what should and should not be said. The definition of totalitarianism is censorship; this is a point that's lost on this generation. Slowly but surely the continental European way of doing things, i.e. left wing fascism, is increasingly clouding English values, which is why we really need the Americans, not for war spoils nor economic gain: they're the only sane people left on this planet who understand the importance of freedom of speech. The continental Europeans are beyond saving, and we're teetering on the brink.

'Bout time this country shaped up, sharpish!

Edited to add: ask an American about this and the majority will say you choose to be offended; ask a continental European and they'll blather on about feelings and victimisation; ask an Englishman and you'll get something like 50/50.

It takes a small spot of reason to arrive at the conclusion that no one can offend you unless you choose to be offended, and you can't base the rule of the law on 'feelings' unless you want a government encroaching into various aspects of your life.

We really need to get a grip on this situation. You 'offend' me in the street and we settle it like grown ups; the chances are I'll put you in your place before walking away. We don't need the law to resolve petty squabbles.

And, to answer the question, nothing offends me. You attempt to 'offend' me, and I'll laugh at you for being a dick. Conversation over. Simple.

You talk as if a society that is more respectful is somehow less appealing. Do you really want to go back to the days when disabled children were called 'spastics' in the street ? Do you want to walk past guest houses with the sign 'no blacks - no Irish - no dogs in the window?

Why would anyone defend their right and other people's right to be offensive to others? Aren't we supposed to move forwards in tolerance and respect and human understand instead of retreating to ignorance and ridicule?

[Errata]

a: That exact Rowan Atkinson sketch is literally my favorite bit of comedy of all time.

b: I don't get offended. I occasionally get deeply concerned. Quite frankly, I wouldn't care if all the possible epithets that could apply to me were said to me, if those epithets didn't have a nasty habit of predicating violence.

And there is a difference between someone calling me a c*%t on the sidewalk, and someone calling me the same thing in my own home, and someone calling me that is an parking garage.

I have had nasty beatings following those words. Others have had it far worse. I think that using those words conversationally makes you a jerk. I think using them as comedy makes you a full blown *******. But offended? Not often. Although I do hit my male friends upside the the head whenever they use the "C" word. I don't get offended by it, but most women do. I see it as a somewhat Pavlovian way of saving their life.

[Fleetwood Mac]

On the comedy front,Bernard Manning,one of the funniest comics around in my opinion,was of course largely ostracised by the tv networks,because of so called racist jokes.Yet he made fun of every race,perhaps hed have been ok if the only jokes hed made had been regarding white folkCant think how long ago that was now maybe 10 years? my memory fails me.

We disagree here, Glyn; he's not my cup of tea with his appeal to primitive, base humour.

But, if people don't like him then just don't listen to what he has to say.

[TomTomKent]

On the comedy front,Bernard Manning,one of the funniest comics around in my opinion,was of course largely ostracised by the tv networks,because of so called racist jokes.Yet he made fun of every race,perhaps hed have been ok if the only jokes hed made had been regarding white folkCant think how long ago that was now maybe 10 years? my memory fails me.

The issue there was the type of jokes he made, not whom they were about. But that's my opinion. Remember that long before Manning became famous Peter Sellers was making jokes about all kinds of people but laughing with them, not mocking their percieved flaws.

What bemuses me more is that the character of Alf Garnet is often compared to Manning, when the Garnett character is clearly poking gentle fun at the sort of people who thought Manning was a serious political commentator (and perhaps he was trying to be, but I digress). Garnett was never meant to be the hero of his own show, quite the opposite in fact.

On the other hand Spike Milligan managed to be incredibly offensive in some of his sketches and shows (Curry and Chips being the worst offender) yet has never had the same stigma attached to him.

[glyn]

On the comedy front,Bernard Manning,one of the funniest comics around in my opinion,was of course largely ostracised by the tv networks,because of so called racist jokes.Yet he made fun of every race,perhaps hed have been ok if the only jokes hed made had been regarding white folkCant think how long ago that was now maybe 10 years? my memory fails me.

[TomTomKent]

Lets get the important matters dealt with first;

The sketch altered slightly depending on what was topical during which performance. The version on the Rowan Atkinson live album on iTunes mentions Americans (and the French get targetted in "driving abroad".

My experiences on the continent are not ones of there being a thought police. You havethe right to say what you want, but the chances are others will use their right to tell you exactly why they disagree. It is important not to mistake popular or or media reaction for censorship. Most often "political correctness" is blamed for reacting to some comments where common sense suggests offense may be taken. (One person who I thankfully no longer have to work with would blame Political correctness for the reaction he got from complete strangers for remarking "Look at her! I wouldn't mind getting my hands on her!" Or, "what is she wearing? Looks like a slut." Even back "in his day", I am not convinced girls would have felt honoured by the attention. They may not have been as vocal (or direct) in their response, but im pretty sure not every girl got a spring in their step when cat-called.

Of course, if you want freedom of expression the cost is higher cat-callers and Jim davidson telling people not to support oxfam in a "comedy" routine. The cost is stormfront, religious fanatics. advocating terrorism, and anything else. You may detest something,but if you want the freedom you have to accept people using it.

[Adam Went]

I get offended by people who get offended about unbelievably petty things, if that makes sense.

Cheers,
Adam.

[Magpie]

There was a time,not too long ago,in Merry Olde England,when whatever one said ,someone would be offended by it.Be it the word black,immigrant,gypsy,gay, or even the word Christmas in some cases.Now it seems the words "I find that offensive" seem to be very rarely uttered.Im wondering why.Has the word "offended" or "offensive" gone out of fashion?Or have those words been used so often that they no longer mean anything any more? Have the "offended" run out of things to be offended by? What a dreary state of affairs to be sure.
Anyone here got any pet words or sayings that offend them?

I think the emphasis has changed from "I find that offensive" (correct) to "You are being offensive" (mostly bollocks. but see below). Lot's of stuff offends me, but I recognize that offense is my response, therefore my problem to deal with.

Ironically, despite so many people trying so hard to deliberate offend everyone else (usually so they can claim to be poor, persecuted victims of "political correctness"), I find it hard to get offended at what they say--why give 'em the attention they so desperately crave?

[jason_c]

Pretty much nothing offends me. As as libertarian I try to practice what I preach.

[Jeff Leahy]

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0163186/usercomments

Interestingly the original show was never released in the USA..

I wonder why that was?

[Jeff Leahy]

Hi Fleetwood

No. The original Atkinson one man show was writen by Angus deaton when he was an unknown writer comedian long before 'Have I got News for you'

And doing some quick internet searches your absolutely correct UTUBE have not only added advertising they have also writen out the original gag!

Its like being in 1984, new speak, big brother has ordained we cant laugh at Americans..

Its rather sinister

I'm now frightened someone might realize I have a copy of teh original sketch and they'll come for me in the night...Help...! I have the black spot!!

Pirate

[Fleetwood Mac]

Oh contere Fleetwood Mac

The original sketch, writen by Angus Deaton

I thought we were talking of Rowan Atkinson's sketch, simply because you mentioned Rowan Atkinson, and there was a complete absence of Angus Deaton in your post. This could get surreal.

[Jeff Leahy]

Oh contere Fleetwood Mac

The original sketch, writen by Angus Deaton clearly has the punch line

"Americans are you here!"

And goes on to explain that their fore fathers fell out with God and he condemned the entire race...

I guess its since been thought that Americans dont have a sense of ironie and that it wouldnt play well with their massive dollar spilling audience pockets..

And lets face it who cares if anyone offends the French or the Germans?

Pirate

PS I have a copy of the original one man show somewhere do you think its worth anything?