The Big Society

[Fleetwood Mac]

What is it? How will we know when we've achieved it? Who will benefit from it?

It is inaccurate too say it is simply a cheap soundbite. It has its roots in Conservatism - particularly voluntary association - the idea that communities work better and take more interest in their locality where taking the initiative as opposed to being coerced by the state. This idea was once the preserve of Liberalism - political philosophies have become muddled.

At its core, the idea is that we all benefit from local power and individual initiative. It's a good idea (well, it's nothing new, this principle has underpinned conservative philosophy for centuries - see Chesterton) but we have become so brainwashed into accepting state interference in our lives that we can't see any other option. To be fair, we're not as far gone and totally beyond redemption as the French or Germans, but the Americans are far more proactive in advoctaing local power - give or take the odd Patriot Act here and there.

Make no mistake, though, this is an attempt to change Britain. An attempt to shrink the state and public schemes in exchange for private initiative.

[Zodiac]

Warning!!! Do Not Read This Post!!!

WARNING!!!

The following post has been classified as being "DEEPLY OFFENSIVE" towards Torys, Neo-Cons and diverse other forms of Pond-Life. Should you be in the invidious position of feeling that you, yourself, may be included among such illustrious company, then we implore you, please, ON NO ACCOUNT to read any further!!! Oh, and do NOT, and I cannot stress this enough, DO NOT even think about clicking on any of the links below!!! You have been warned!!! We can accept no responsibility for your own reactions towards material that you have already been given fair warning about!!!

"The Big Society"??? What??? But, surely, as every "True Blue" Tory w*nker... err... I mean... Tory supporter knows that, "There is no such thing as Society"!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTAHEu231ng

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQiGiLJINjo&feature=related

Oh Happy Day...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tSpLUAJq8s&feature=fvw

My youth on film...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQkActP-isE&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJmouowPH5k&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SKuI0ixLt4

Well... Err... Cat, say hello to Pigeons... Pigeons, this is Cat...

Best wishes,
Zodiac.

[Limehouse]

It is inaccurate too say it is simply a cheap soundbite. It has its roots in Conservatism - particularly voluntary association - the idea that communities work better and take more interest in their locality where taking the initiative as opposed to being coerced by the state. This idea was once the preserve of Liberalism - political philosophies have become muddled.

At its core, the idea is that we all benefit from local power and individual initiative. It's a good idea (well, it's nothing new, this principle has underpinned conservative philosophy for centuries - see Chesterton) but we have become so brainwashed into accepting state interference in our lives that we can't see any other option. To be fair, we're not as far gone and totally beyond redemption as the French or Germans, but the Americans are far more proactive in advoctaing local power - give or take the odd Patriot Act here and there.

Make no mistake, though, this is an attempt to change Britain. An attempt to shrink the state and public schemes in exchange for private initiative.

Hi Fleetwood -I love your name - but hope you prefer the early line-up with Peter Green etc?

I agree totally with what you have written in terms of the historical characteristics of Conservatism. As I wrote in a previous post - the Conservatives were the original 'softies' compared with the Liberals.

However - that was a time when you were expected to do your duty towards others - particularly the poor. That's not a bad thing - but it's not very accpetable if that is the only form of help the poor get. They are at the mercy of the generosity and benevolence of other. Thank God for those who took up the challenge and did many good works.

Today is different. We are all contributing to central funds of one sort or another to pay for what is needed by everyone. We all pay for libraries. We all pay for health. We all pay for everything that is needed collectively that would be difficult to provide for ourselves (like roads). Even if we have never worked or no longer work or refuse to work we pay. It is difficult to avoid VAT totally for example.

So - why should we pay - and then be expected to receive nothing in return? If a volunteer picks up litter in my community - why should I pay for litter collection? I would much prefer someone in a job picking up that litter. (I would also much prefer people not to drop it in the first place!).

I am not going to defend Labour either. As soon as they got into power - they slapped five years on my retirement age. The 'coalition' have slapped another year on to it. They have also frozen my pay for two years but are going to increase my National Insurance and have given me a VAT increase. I am going to get poorer. What have I done to deserve it? Worked hard all of my life that's what - like hundreds of thousands of others like me.

Meanwhile - top bankers - who are almost always drawn from the pool of elite public school boys (and a few girls but not many) - and who get their jobs mainly through the oldboy/girl network - continue to rake it in by the million. And it's not only bankers either. Why is a trade union General Secretary on a salary exceeding one hundred thousand pounds a year with expenses on top when many of his members are working for reduced salaries?

Have a good weekend everyone!

[martin wilson]

Hi all
It seems to me we get the kind of government we deserve.
During the housing boom nobody gave a stuff about first time buyers.
Charity donation is limited to Comic relief/children in need/race for life, as long as you can consume something, get the T shirt or a plastic red nose.
How far do you think £20 milion goes?
Or run the London marathon dressed as a bloody penguin, look at me I'm doing something for charity!!
Every day my local paper has a story about benefit fraud,its suppposed to be for unemployed people but as a result of the benefit bill the mentally and physically disabled are facing cuts in benefits and services,so obviously nobody gives a stuff about them either.
Then there is the wekend binge,absolutely disgusting behaviour,costing us a fortune in police and hospital services.
Insurance fraud, compensation claims, abusing disabled parking, all Big Issue sellers are con men who live in big houses, Nimby's moaning about travellers,killing each other over hedges or car parking, voting for the BNP, attacking paediatricians, buying Katie Price's books, and generally behaving like a bunch of selfish,greedy pig ignorant ****wits.
You are all a bunch of tossers except me,and I'm a right arshole.
All the best.

[Stephen Thomas]

Hi all
It seems to me we get the kind of government we deserve.
During the housing boom nobody gave a stuff about first time buyers.
Charity donation is limited to Comic relief/children in need/race for life, as long as you can consume something, get the T shirt or a plastic red nose.
How far do you think £20 milion goes?
Or run the London marathon dressed as a bloody penguin, look at me I'm doing something for charity!!
Every day my local paper has a story about benefit fraud,its suppposed to be for unemployed people but as a result of the benefit bill the mentally and physically disabled are facing cuts in benefits and services,so obviously nobody gives a stuff about them either.
Then there is the wekend binge,absolutely disgusting behaviour,costing us a fortune in police and hospital services.
Insurance fraud, compensation claims, abusing disabled parking, all Big Issue sellers are con men who live in big houses, Nimby's moaning about travellers,killing each other over hedges or car parking, voting for the BNP, attacking paediatricians, buying Katie Price's books, and generally behaving like a bunch of selfish,greedy pig ignorant ****wits.
You are all a bunch of tossers except me,and I'm a right arshole.
All the best.

Tell it like it is, Martin

[Robert]

"Why is a trade union General Secretary on a salary exceeding one hundred thousand pounds a year with expenses on top when many of his members are working for reduced salaries?"

Hi Limehouse

You probably know more about trade unions than I do. Have the members ever been asked how much they want to pay their leaders? Have a variety of salary bands been submitted to them, with the idea of finding the most popular (or perhaps doing some sort of averaging process)? I don't know, I'm just asking.

I do know that the public have never been asked how much they want to pay MPs. That wouldn't do. We might get the idea that they are the servants, rather than us.

[Limehouse]

Hi Robert

You are correct. Union members do have some say over how much they pay their top leaders. To their credit - some of them do not draw all of their salary and some donate some of their salary to various fighting funds as the need arises.

Today Cameron is defending The Big Society:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-12441972

What intrigues me is - whereas the Big Society is supposed to be less about central government and more about local - he makes this statement:


Mr Cameron said the government would announce details in the coming week of a £100m transition fund to help groups at a time when local councils were seeing their budgets cut.

That sounds like a big fat contradiction to me.

The Big joke in the Big Society and the 'we're all in it together' illusion is the Big fat reality. Cameron and his gang are not suffereing one little bit.

[martin wilson]

Hi all
I think the idea is to encourage councils to use their financial reserves,if any,make some efficiencies and perhaps even look at the council bosses salaries, which for some reason 'have to reflect what is paid in the private sector',although I dont suppose any of those will be looking to take a pay cut to save a few jobs at the sharp end for the people who actually do the work.
I know someone who was a councillor and they were always saying about how much money our local council wasted.
Add to that the fact that anything supplied to the public sector always comes with an extra 0 added on, and they obviously think there are some savings to be made.
There are no brilliant innovative managers though,comiing up with original ideas to save money, faced with budget cuts they just make people redundant.
So nice idea Dave,but as usual the people at the bottom get crapped on.
All the best.

[Robert]

Hi Limehouse

OK, well if union members agree to pay their leaders these six figure sums, I guess they have themselves to blame - just as the shareholders who allow these huge salaries and bonuses to be paid to business leaders have themselves to blame.

Personally, when I see a footballer being paid in lottery number money, I think it's ridiculous - but it isn't me paying it. It's the club paying it, and ultimately I suppose the money comes from advertisers, football supporters who go to see matches, and soccer fans who buy TV packages allowing them to see the matches. I don't fall into any of those categories so I'm not paying anything and I'm not being robbed. If I were to buy a satellite package then I would be paying - but it would be voluntary.

The only thing I do pay towards their wages is the tiny bit of my TV licence fee that goes towards the BBC buying football rights. That is voluntary in a way - but the only way I could opt out would be to not have a TV at all. So it is more compulsory than voluntary, I would say.

Bankers on the other hand are a different kettle of fish - and the fish stink.