Profiling

[smezenen]

Corey,
After working in the field (U.S. Army's Central Investigation division) for some years I can honestly say that Profiling is a great way to start an investigation, but if you rely on it in totality to narrow your suspect list you are going to fail in your investigation more times than not. Case in point the green river killer Gary Ridgeway was actually dismissed as a suspect early in the investigation because he didnt fit the profile. It took 20 some years for the police to finially come back around to him because they refused to look beyond the profile.

[sdreid]

Since "Is harmful" or "Is a disgrace" is not a choice, I voted for doesn't work which is the closest to that view. How many additional people were murdered by the DC Snipers and Shawcross because profilers had cops chasing unicorns? And, those aren't the only examples.

[corey123]

Hello Sdreid, Smezenem,

Just want to say that my view on profiling has changed a bit. I still find it useful, but after writing my essay this past year it had altered my veiw on it a bit.

Smezenen,

Good to see you, you haven't been on the boards for a while.
Anyhow, yes I see what you are saying, that it can be dangerous, however, what the police needed to realize in that case that just because some didnt fit their profile, doesn't mean you should knock them off the suspect list. I do believe that if the profiler has the right skill(pschology, geograph, law enforcement skills) and is not some regular cop, they can produce more accurate profiles. I also think profiling(if this is a word to be used, perhaps psychological analysis) is more effective in old cases, such as this.

[Mrs. E. Nigma]

I voted that it's a good tool to narrow suspect list, but no one should ever be so narrow minded that a viable suspect is thrown out because they don't match the profile.

"...Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn." - (Michael Caine, as Alfred in The Dark Knight). With that kind of criminal, profiling won't be much help.

Best Wishes,
Erynn

[protohistorian]

To think that no element of the persons mind can be discerned from the scene is ignorant, but not so ignorant as burning people at the stake for having a mole, the original profiling. Dave

[smezenen]

Corey,
Here is what the FBI’s says about offender profiling:
The role of offender profiling is not to provide a name, address and phone number of the guilty person but to provide Law enforcement officials with a psychological profile of the personality of the perpetrator that can then be used to direct the investigative search.

You may find it interesting to know that the FBI draws on data and findings elicited from interviews with just 36 convicted serial murderers, all of whom were male and 90% of them white.

Here are 3 more examples of FBI profiling gone wrong; 1- Aileen Wuornos 33 year old Florida prostitute, Killed 7 men. FBI's profile perdicted a white male 20-30 who had possibly been sexually abused as a child. The police recovered Aileens finger prints from the first victims car, matched them due to her prior convictions but dismissed her because she was a prostitute that the victim was known to associate with. 2-BTK Dennis Rader, brought a cord with him to strangle his victim, this was used to point out that he was an organized killer that preplanned his murders. Later the profile was changed to say he was disorganized because he left it behind. It took 30 years to catch him. And finally 3- The reason I haven’t been on the boards much lately (I’ve been working on this case as the military consultant because the accused is prior service and we are looking into unsolved murders from areas he was stationed) The Cleveland Strangler Anthony Sowell 50 years old. While not yet convicted he is charged with killing 11 women,the bodies where found in and around his home. He was arrested after the 5th victim disappeared, he was identified by the only know victim to escape. However because the witness was deemed not reliable do to drug addiction, there was no other evidence and he didn’t fit the FBI profile that said the killer was 25-35 highly educated and from out of town with no prior convictions, he was releasedand killed 6 more before being caught. While Mr. Sowell had traveled during his military career he lived in Cleveland at least 5 years and had served 15 years for attempted rape.

[corey123]

Hello Smezenen,

I agree that profiling should be done with great caution and taken with great care. However, they have also proved to be right.

Dave,

I agree.

[FrankO]

You may find it interesting to know that the FBI draws on data and findings elicited from interviews with just 36 convicted serial murderers, all of whom were male and 90% of them white.

Hi Smezenen,

This is where I think the American way of profiling is far from flawless sometimes: it is based on statistics rather than on viewing each and every case on it’s own and by someone who has a degree in psychology.

If the profiler is well educated in psychology, the profile may be of help in providing a rather accurate psychological picture of the perpetrator and his/her background, in giving advice as to where or how to look for him/her and the profiler can be of help in getting the perpetrator to talk/confess once he/she has been caught.

All the best,
Frank

[corey123]

FrankO,

This is exactly what I have been saying.

[Mr. Candlebridge]

My thoughts

Profiling, using statistics, can be a useful tool to narrow a search, but at the same time, shouldn't be considered as forensic evidence either unless of course evidence does arise.

In America, profiling is often associated with racial profiling, which many feel that authorities have utilized racial bias under the guise of forensics, which is why the recent immigration law in the State of Arizona, making it a criminal offense to be living and working in the state without having your presence documented via a visa or legal residency as a foreigner, has become a hot issue. To an outsider, it may seem like a perfectly reasonable law, but many Mexican Americans believe it will open the door to biased racial profiling. Mistrust of authority has created this. The O.J. Simpson trial is a good example of how justice can be distrupted through the popular mistrust of police, where actual forensic evidence was glossed over and the racial integrity of the Los Angeles Police Department was put into question. The City was relieved that the jury said he was not guilty because of th erioting that would ensue, but 15 years later, it is pretty much a universal understanding that O.J. murdered his wife and her friend. Of course, O.J. opened the door for DNA evidence and really changed the game across the board, just as Ripper changed the game I'm sure too. If I'm not mistaken, photgraphy was just barely beginning to be admitted as evidence...and racial bias was an easy out. Warren was smart to erase "Juwes" to save the city, but like O.J., big public affairs like this put the efficacy of the police under the microscope.

[corey123]

Hello Mr.Candelbridge,

First and formost welcome to the forums.

Now on to your opinion that statistic profiles are sometimes helpful. I believe that this type of profiling is rather dangerous. I agree, when things happen multiple times, statistics can help to a point, however, not one murderer is the same that is why I believe Psychological analysis is more effective rather than statistically profiling an offeneder.

Yours truly