Visiting London for the First Time

[Svensson]

the site of Dutfields Yard is now a school. there is a gate into the schoolyard that is almost exactly at the location where the entrance to Dutfields yard was but I can't make out from the picture exactly where it is. Bloody roadworks everywhere in London atm....

Dutfields yard however is Henriques street, not Durward street.

[Svensson]

Is this the correct gate that opened into Dutfield's yard? I noticed that the IWMEC does not appear to be there. The building to right appears to have been built in the early 1900s.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/4QGXvtEoTZrqPWSD6

actually, yes, that's it. Just nopt the original gate I'll get my coffee now....

[Robert]

Polly's site is just east of the board school (where the road curves round into Winthrop Street) except that the board school building has now been refurbished as flats. The site is on the same side as the school.

[Joshua Rogan]

Is this where Hutchinson saw Mary Kelly and Astrakhan man? If so, did they walk up what is now Fashion Street? Was Millers Court on the left or right? This is the murder site that I'm most confused about. Thanks!

https://photos.app.goo.gl/MitEtQTdkHxZiD7C9

Yes, that could be the lamp-post that Hutchinson said he leant against. He was walking north up Commercial St from Whitechapel Road (possibly having just found out/ confirmed that the Victoria Home was no longer open at that hour) when he met Kelly. She went south and met Astrakhan Man, then they walked north again past Hutch to her room.
Opposite the pub, across Commercial Street, is White's Row, and the next road north of that on the same (west) side was Dorset Street, just across from the south end of the churchyard. Pure speculation, but Hutch may have been hoping to sleep there for the night (before Kelly caught his interest) as many homeless people slept on the benches, if the police didn't move them on. Miller's Court was about 40 yards down Dorset Street on the north side, though it was demolished in the '20s.

[MrBarnett]

Is this where Hutchinson saw Mary Kelly and Astrakhan man? If so, did they walk up what is now Fashion Street? Was Millers Court on the left or right? This is the murder site that I'm most confused about. Thanks!

https://photos.app.goo.gl/MitEtQTdkHxZiD7C9

Yes it is. It's on the corner of Commercial Street and Fashion Street. Dorset Street was on the other (W) side of Commercial Street. White's Row is directly across Commercial Street from the Queen' Head. Dorset Street was the next street up (N) and about the same size as Whites Row, but all trace of it is now lost under modern buildings.

White's Row, though, has some Ripper connections and even more importantly it was the birthplace of Jack Sheppard.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Sheppard

[MrBarnett]

You beat me to it, Joshua.

[Sam Flynn]

Polly's site is just east of the board school

My Auntie Mwynfron attended that school, and fondly recalled its rooftop playground. She also remembered being spooked by the school's close proximity to the murder site of Polly Nichols, which would presumably have been visible every playtime

[MrBarnett]

My Auntie Mwynfron attended that school, and fondly recalled its rooftop playground. She also remembered being spooked by the school's close proximity to the murder site of Polly Nichols, which would presumably have been visible every playtime

'Auntie Mwynfron' - what a lovely name!

My ancestors, the Barnetts, lived and worked in and around Winthrop Street for decades (1810 - 60ish):

Ducking Pond Lane (Brady Street)
Little North Street (Winthrop Street)
Hope Place
North Place

William Monk originally ran the knackers yard there. When he died without a male heir he left the business to his assistant, William Barber. It was his son, Alfred, and several others, who in 1886 teamed up with John Harrison of Belle Isle, Islington to create Harrison, Barber & Co.

A great aunt on my mother's side - 'aunt Lizzie Mac' - attended Berners Street School briefly in the early 1900s.

[Robert]

Gareth, your auntie was probably also spooked by the ghosts of a million slaughtered horses.

[MrBarnett]

Gareth, your auntie was probably also spooked by the ghosts of a million slaughtered horses.

Presumably she could have looked down into HB's yard, albeit at a bit of an angle.

When was this, Gareth - is the old girl still alive?

[Sam Flynn]

'Auntie Mwynfron' - what a lovely name!

Thanks, Gary - I like it, too. Roughly translated it means "gentle/tender of heart", and it's an unusual name even in Wales, never mind the East End. Her mother Myfanwy - yes, really! - was Welsh and, despite having lived two thirds of her life in and around East London and Kent, she remained a Welsh speaker all her days.

[Robert]

Didn't Dylan Thomas have a daughter of that name?

[Robert]

Correction. I think that was Aeronwy.

[Sam Flynn]

When was this, Gareth - is the old girl still alive?

Sadly not, Gary. She died a few years back, and I last met her in 2009.

[Sam Flynn]

Correction. I think that was Aeronwy.

Correct, Rob.