A6 Rebooted

[NickB]

there is however a Gwynfryn Avenue which is indeed on the council estate and it's not that far from here, 10 mins walk. Would that be the one?

Yes, Sherlock corrected me in the post above yours.

Hanratty indeed claimed that he had only been to Rhyl twice.

[Kerry1983]

Just a slight correction with regards to Terry Evans's address. It was Gwynfryn Avenue.

The following pertinent exchange between Hanratty and Swanwick at the Bedord Trial [on February 7th] might prove interesting to posters.......


-'You have been told that we are going to see Mr Terence Evans. Did you stay that night with him ?'
-"I stayed at his house, yes."
-'Have you told us everything you can remember about the boarding house ?'
-"No, there are little bits more that I can remember."
-'Oh, well let's have them.'
-"I know at this stage that a lot depends on this boarding house. You are trying to suggest that it does not exist. My only hope is for a miracle and so I will try to put my mind back six months. That's what I have got to do, six months. Well, I remember there was no front garden to this house. In the morning I looked out the window and found a small courtyard."
-'At the front or the back ?'
-"At the back. They are the two items which I never told Mr Sherrard this morning.
-'You have just remembered them ?'
-"Sir, this is a bit of a strain on me, standing here like this."
-'Anything more come to you in the witness box just now ?'
-"About the house, sir, no. That's all I can remember."
-'Do you remember, for instance, what the paper was like on the wall of the room in which you slept ?'
-"No, I will be quite fair with you, I can't."
-'Do you remember the colour of the carpet ?'
-"No, I don't."
-'Can you remember the name of the street ?'
-"No sir, I can't. If I could I would not have given Mr Acott the false alibi."
-'When you stayed your night with Mr Evans in July, did you know the address where he was ?'
-"No sir, if I had known that I would have had no trouble in finding it."
-'Are you sure you have not taken the details of Evans's house and pretended it was this boarding-house ?'
-"I make this quite clear. Evans's house is a council house and not a boarding-house. He lives on a council estate."
-'Are you sure you have not transposed the details of Evans's house and the boarding-house ?'
-"The only way you can be sure is to check it yourself."

Thanks Sherlock, i don't think i would remember details, wallpaper, carpet etc from a hotel/b&b that i had stayed in 6 months ago.
Terry Evans' house and mine would be completely different from what i know of the houses on the council estate. I walk up Gwynfryn road quite a lot as it's an alternative route to my son's school and from what i can remember, they all have front gardens. Hanratty's first point here was that there was no front garden.

[Kerry1983]

Yes, Sherlock corrected me in the post above yours.

Hanratty indeed claimed that he had only been to Rhyl twice.

Yes sorry, i saw that after i posted.
Was Terry Evans his only connection to Rhyl? And was he the main reason for both visits that you know of? If he stayed at Terry Evans' house in July then surely he would remember his way back there a month later?

[Sherlock Houses]

Thanks Sherlock, i don't think i would remember details, wallpaper, carpet etc from a hotel/b&b that i had stayed in 6 months ago.

I wouldn't either, Kerry. I think Hanratty did remarkably well in remembering those things about Ingledene that impressed him most. He was fighting for his life and must have had to rack his brain to recall as much as he could about hs stay at the guesthouse.

It's possibly an appropriate moment to attach the following map of Rhyl which includes both Kinmmel Street [marked A] and Gwynfryn Avenue [marked with cross].

[NickB]

Was Terry Evans his only connection to Rhyl? And was he the main reason for both visits that you know of? If he stayed at Terry Evans' house in July then surely he would remember his way back there a month later?

On 25th July he arrived in Rhyl and went to the Ocean Beach amusement park where he met Terry Evans for the first time.

He did indeed claim that he could not find where Terry lived on his return. Even more surprising is his claim that he would not be able to find the guest house again.

At the trial Sherrard (defence) asked him why, when he knew the police were looking for him, he had not gone to Rhyl to locate the house.
Hnratty replied: “I did not have the right bearings of Rhyl and have only been there on two occasions, although I stayed there two nights. I have some idea of the house I stayed in and some description.”

Yet he also claimed that when he was staying at the guest house he walked around Rhyl and found his way back there.

[caz]

Hi Caz

I haven't gone further than Sherrard at all. Sherrard put up Hanratty's Rhyl alibi and examined him, in chief, on his whereabouts. It was Hanratty who then gave evidence in his own defence as such.

Goalposts, Del. I was responding to this:

I believe that this was planned in advance and if Hanratty was the A6 murderer then he could not have been working alone, therefore there had to a conspiracy of sorts because he would not have been able to send the telegram from Liverpool and put the gun on the bus on the Thursday.

So I ask you again. What evidence do you have that Hanratty could not have done both if he was the A6 murderer? Your assertion must have been based on the available time, and not on him being in Rhyl.

I will go further and answer your question in no uncertain terms by saying that there is no evidence of Hanratty putting the gun on the bus.

But that is not the same as saying he could not have done that and sent the telegram.

If you can show otherwise I will listen but until then I will stand by my assertion that it was impossible for him to have done so because he had been in the North West from the afternoon of the 22nd of August 1961 until late on the Thursday of the 24th August 1961.

Yes, well clearly he could not have done both if he wasn't in London on the Thursday, or had been in Rhyl or Liverpool when the crime itself was committed. And Sherrard was stuck with pushing one of these two alibis, at least one of which everyone knew to be false. He could have added that it would have been pushing it to put a gun on a London bus and send that telegram, but that's all. There is no evidence for his whereabouts after the crime, until he sent the telegram.

Love,

Caz
X

[Sherlock Houses]

Regarding the Rhyl alibi, the strongest witness was Margaret Walker, who lived in a street just behind Mrs Jones guesthouse. Even before Hanratty was hanged, she was telling private detectives that a young Londoner had come to her house late one evening in the summer of 1961 looking for lodgings. She was able to fix the date as 22 August, because she remembered that a family row had taken place the following Friday.

I agree that Mrs Walker was the strongest and most impressive witness.

Incidentally and for clarification purposes the family business that occurred on Friday, 25th August 1961 concerned the eviction of her son.

[Kerry1983]

That's a better map than the one i looked at. I thought Gwynfryn was where Ffordd Las is, it's Ffordd Las that i walk up quite a lot so not too far away.

Hanratty did indeed do well to remember those things. He said that he wasn't aware of the street name also and as i've just shown, i wasn't aware of the street name of a street i walk up all the time.
It seems perfectly believeable to me.

[NickB]

Sherlock,

Do you have any other interesting excerpts from the trial?

I understand a transcript is viewable in the archives at Bedford Council offices.

Would be a useful resource for this forum.

[caz]

FSS were (dishonestly) peddling LCN DNA testing as reliable and Mansfield took their statements at face value. As stated in the paper I posted a while ago, it's actually not that rare to recover no DNA after a rape - and even less likely when evidence has been stored God-knows-how for 40 years. It is perfectly possible that Alphon did carry out the rape but left no traces.

But what about the hankie, DM? Was that also contaminated with Hanratty's DNA after the event, but consistent with nasal mucous rather than semen on this occasion? Or are you suggesting Alphon had access to Hanratty's dirty hankie, which would imply they had close criminal connections?

Love,

Caz
X

[Sherlock Houses]

If he stayed at Terry Evans' house in July then surely he would remember his way back there a month later?

As Nick correctly points out, Kerry, Hanratty met [for the first and only time incidentally] Terry Evans on July 25th. They struck up an instant friendship and Evans was able to obtain work for Hanratty at the fairground, working on the dodgems.

At the end of the evening Evans invited Hanratty back to his home in Gwynfryn Avenue. It would have been dark at this time and they probably travelled to Evans's house on the other side of town in Evans's black taxi.
I have been to Gwynfryn Avenue and it is definitely not an easy place to find[even during daylight hours] especially for a stranger who's only been to Rhyl once before.

[Kerry1983]

As Nick correctly points out, Kerry, Hanratty met [for the first and only time incidentally] Terry Evans on July 25th. They struck up an instant friendship and Evans was able to obtain work for Hanratty at the fairground, working on the dodgems.

At the end of the evening Evans invited Hanratty back to his home in Gwynfryn Avenue. It would have been dark at this time and they probably travelled to Evans's house on the other side of town in Evans's black taxi.
I have been to Gwynfryn Avenue and it is definitely not an easy place to find[even during daylight hours] especially for a stranger who's only been to Rhyl once before.

That is very true, i thought it was a different road until i saw your map. There are lots of little roads around that area and i can imagine it would be very difficult to find.

[Sherlock Houses]

Sherlock,

Do you have any other interesting excerpts from the trial?

I understand a transcript is viewable in the archives at Bedford Council offices.

Would be a useful resource for this forum.

I have transcribed James Hanratty's trial evidence [February 7th and 8th] gleaned from about 5 or 6 different UK Newspapers of the time. I have gathered it all together and put it in a pdf document, too large to use as an attachment, I think, even though it is 221KB in size.

I will try and attach the pdf document with this post and see what happens. I have never tried to attach a pdf doc on this forum and don't know if it's feasible.

[Sherlock Houses]

If anyone has Adobe Reader they will be able to download this pdf document onto their laptop/PC. Hope you all find it useful.

[Kerry1983]

I have just downloaded onto my laptop, i'll have a good read through this evening.
Thanks very much for that!