Alphon--The A6 "hit man"?

[Limehouse]

Hi Julie,

That is true, but just because he was never required to account for the money, that doesn't imply that it was either illegitimate nor specifically paid to him to "scare" MG and VS.

And then there's the problem of explaining how an umbrella salesman managed to get that amount of money to casually throw away like that.

KR,
Vic.

Not such a problem if it wasn't the umbrella salesman who put that money in the account though?

[Victor]

It was also a ridiculous amount of money for a man of Alphon's habits to have stashed away in his bank account.

Hi Julie,

That is true, but just because he was never required to account for the money, that doesn't imply that it was either illegitimate nor specifically paid to him to "scare" MG and VS.

And then there's the problem of explaining how an umbrella salesman managed to get that amount of money to casually throw away like that.

KR,
Vic.

[Limehouse]

Hi Norma,

£2,000 to kill someone. You've said before there's lots of small time crooks that'd do it for a tenth the amount. Even that much for a professional hit is ridiculous.

KR,
Vic.

It was also a ridiculous amount of money for a man of Alphon's habits to have stashed away in his bank account.

[Victor]

I think he got that amount to keep him quiet so blackmail money mostly,because it went so terribly wrong and Alphon had to be kept from blabbing?How much for the job itself ? £2000 perhaps?

Hi Norma,

£2,000 to kill someone. You've said before there's lots of small time crooks that'd do it for a tenth the amount. Even that much for a professional hit is ridiculous.

KR,
Vic.

[Natalie Severn]

hi Norma

but wouldn't that have made his case stronger? it just seems so implausible that with no aparent expereince or expertise that he would have been approached to do the job or paid so much for it

all the best

Viv

Hi Viv, No I never said he received the 5000 thousand pounds for doing the job:I think he got that amount to keep him quiet so blackmail money mostly,because it went so terribly wrong and Alphon had to be kept from blabbing?How much for the job itself ? £2000 perhaps?

[jimornot?]

No never Viv!

hi Norma

but wouldn't that have made his case stronger? it just seems so implausible that with no aparent expereince or expertise that he would have been approached to do the job or paid so much for it

all the best

Viv

[jimornot?]

Hi Viv, How do you explain the statement on 13 September by Juliana Galves that when she opened the door of his room ,Alphon, as well as looking dishevelled and distracted at 11.45 am on the day of the murder,she saw he had a pair of Black nylon gloves on top of his suitcase?

I'm afraid I can't Norma but I am not so sure if Julian Galves was leaned on by the police as Nudds appears to have been. i personally don't think eitehr of their testiomnies are particularly reliable

I do agree it odd that Alphon didn't have to comply with a request to see the contents of his suitcases though

atb

viv

[Natalie Severn]

dear all

what evidence / theory is there which shows alphon would be a prime candidate to do a job for someone?

I have doubts as to where he got the money in his account but £5k was so much money then and I am sure more 'professional' thugs could have been hired at far less money.

Did Alphon ever explain satisfactorily how he was approached, why etc?

atb

viv

No never Viv!

[Natalie Severn]

Hi Viv, How do you explain the statement on 13 September by Juliana Galves that when she opened the door of his room ,Alphon, as well as looking dishevelled and distracted at 11.45 am on the day of the murder,she saw he had a pair of Black nylon gloves on top of his suitcase?

[jimornot?]

In my view Alphon got off the murder charge very lightly given his unstable state in the Vienna Hotel and Alexandra Hotels .This makes me think he must have gathered himself together by the time Supt Acott and Oxford interviewed him.When I read through their interview notes I was surprised at Alphon"s gall and that he got away with not letting them near the contents of his suitcase, which he said was in a locker at Victoria Station.All I can think is that when Valerie failed to identify him,Acott simply "moved on". But I can"t help thinking someone apart from Nudds planted the idea of Hanratty in their heads.
Jean Justice saw the gaps and determined to get to the bottom of the Alphon mystery and in my view this is what was badly needed.Trouble is I tend to think he bit off more than he could chew and that Alphon outwitted him--as he did the police.
Norma

Hi Norma

I don't (now) believe Alphon was guilty of the murder etc but his presence in the case is disturbing for all the reasons outlined by others before. He certainy seems to have got away lightly with his actions and the police investigation appears as questionable as it was inept at times

I haven't read Justice's book so can't really judge him. that said even if he (JJ) had an agenda to get back at the establishment, I have to think he was entirely sincere in his belief that Alphon did the crime

atb

viv

[jimornot?]

if alphon wsa a hit man

dear all

what evidence / theory is there which shows alphon would be a prime candidate to do a job for someone?

I have doubts as to where he got the money in his account but £5k was so much money then and I am sure more 'professional' thugs could have been hired at far less money.

Did Alphon ever explain satisfactorily how he was approached, why etc?

atb

viv

[Natalie Severn]

In my view Alphon got off the murder charge very lightly given his unstable state in the Vienna Hotel and Alexandra Hotels .This makes me think he must have gathered himself together by the time Supt Acott and Oxford interviewed him.When I read through their interview notes I was surprised at Alphon"s gall and that he got away with not letting them near the contents of his suitcase, which he said was in a locker at Victoria Station.All I can think is that when Valerie failed to identify him,Acott simply "moved on". But I can"t help thinking someone apart from Nudds planted the idea of Hanratty in their heads.
Jean Justice saw the gaps and determined to get to the bottom of the Alphon mystery and in my view this is what was badly needed.Trouble is I tend to think he bit off more than he could chew and that Alphon outwitted him--as he did the police.
Norma

[Derrick]

Hi Derrick,

The issue with entrapment is that encouraging someone to confess or commit a crime, promotes false confessions or abherrent behaviour which often someone wouldn't do without the encouragment. It completely invalidates the evidence.

The number of law abiding people who buy stolen or smuggled goods (usually duty-free fags and booze) at massive discounts when offered them reveals this.

KR,
Vic.

Victor
I will make only 3 points which I will stand by and will make no further comment upon. Nothing that Justice put forward as ever been used in evidence in the Hanratty case.

1) So who said it was evidence at all?

2) I fully stand by my post regarding Justice's attempts to try to save Hanratty from the gallows. Again it was never evidence in any way shape or form. It was the action of a man who was willing to go to great lengths in support of his own conviction to save an innocent man from the gallows, rightly or wrongly. Justice himself said that he did try to trap Alphon into a confession and it is pointless taking the argument further.

3) Are you saying that those people who buy contraband are completely unaware of where it came from? It would take a very naive person indeeed to believe that anyone in the market to cheaply acquire the good things in life is unaware that the goods on offer have either been knocked off or smuggled in.

Have several listens to the Clash's first album mate. That'll sort your head out!

Derrick

[Victor]

I don't think anyone should be under any illusion that Justice tried to get Alphon to make a confession because Hanratty was awaiting execution. Call it what you like, honey trap or entrapment, Justice did it to try save Hanratty from the gallows.

Justice believed in Hanratty's innocence and quickly went all out to try to do something about rescuing the situation before anyone else outside the Hanratty family arrived on the scene. After Hanratty's execution he was inconsolable.

Hi Derrick,

The issue with entrapment is that encouraging someone to confess or commit a crime, promotes false confessions or abherrent behaviour which often someone wouldn't do without the encouragment. It completely invalidates the evidence.

The number of law abiding people who buy stolen or smuggled goods (usually duty-free fags and booze) at massive discounts when offered them reveals this.

KR,
Vic.

[Natalie Severn]

Apologies to readers of this thread:

Late last night I made the mistake of transcribing the last part of Alphon"s "written confession" of 1961, on the thread entitled The A6 Murder---so the rest of the confession is there on page 651......