a6 murder

[jimarilyn]

Greetings one and all

Don’t know whether it is a crescent or not, but it is highly unlikely that there would be any through traffic turning left off Redbridge Lane East into Avondale Crescent (This corner is shown on posting 606). Such traffic would have turned left at the previous road, Roding Lane South. This road runs parallel with part of Avondale Crescent, before the latter turns back onto the former.

The view shown on posting 607 is close to Green’s Stores at 220 Redbridge Lane East, which is 34 yards from the corner of Avondale Crescent. It is from outside number 220 that James Trower said he saw a car pass him and turn into Avondale Crescent.

Number 220 only changed from being Green’s Stores quite recently.

Peter

Hi Peter,


On the very slight off-chance that James Trower did identify the murder car turning left into Avondale Crescent shortly after 7am on August 23rd 1961, do you think that was when the car was parked and abandoned ? If not, that would mean the car returning to the same location several hours later that same day. If it was abandoned shortly after 7am it took a long time for the police to find it. Strange.

[Graham]

Hi All.

Re: the entrance to the cornfield. I think it's where Jimarilyn put the number 1on the Google Earth photo - there is some kind of structure just inside the field, and that's what I remember from my last visit. The cottages to the north-west are I feel where the various witnesses lived. I've just spent some time studying the Earth image, but the resolution isn't too good for the area.
I also seem to recall that Acott was purposely vague about the precise spot where the abduction took place - but I can't remember where I read this, to be honest. Typical police tactic, though. I thought about asking someone at the cottages if he or she could help, but I didn't as (a) it's doubtful if there is still anyone living there who was around in 1961 and (b) if there is, he/she is probably sick to death of callers asking about the 'Hanratty Field'.

Which brings me on to something I've meant to mention for some time. For a case which, at the time, was absolutely sensational in every respect, and which was the subject of fierce debate for 2 - 3 decades afterwards, and is still discussed today, I've always found it slightly surprising that there has never been a dedicated A6 Case website? Anyone fancy starting one up...?

Cheers,

Graham

[Steve]

Does the pylon help to orientate things any ?

Unfortunately not - the pylon is not there anymore.

[Steve]

I thought about asking someone at the cottages if he or she could help, but I didn't as (a) it's doubtful if there is still anyone living there who was around in 1961 and (b) if there is, he/she is probably sick to death of callers asking about the 'Hanratty Field'.

I have asked the 'locals,' some of whom have lived there since 1970, and the local view is that the entrance to the cornfield used by Gregsten & Valerie is the one at the bottom of Marsh Lane where the rowing lake drive has been built.

[Steve]

The view shown on posting 607 is close to Green’s Stores at 220 Redbridge Lane East, which only changed from being Green’s Stores quite recently.

Today it trades as Sai Superstore.

[P.L.A]

The Entrance

Greetings one and all

Number 1 on posting 629 is some distance from any dwelling. Also, there is no hedge immediately to the north of it.

The Google picture shows the southern end of the field, but it stretches four or five hundred yards to the north above where the image cuts off.

Peter

[P.L.A]

Dr. Whitaker

Greetings one and all

Last year I was lucky enough to spend five weeks in Australia. As part of the trip, I travelled the 3000Km length of the Stuart Highway from Darwin to Port Augusta. On the highway I had pointed out to me the spot where Peter Falconio disappeared and his girlfriend Joanne Lees hid in the bush.

This kindled an interest in the crime within me and I started to read up on it.

The DNA analysis in the case was carried out by no less a person than the Low Copy Number guru, Jonathan Whitaker – who did similar work on the A6 exibits.

Hanratty supporters will be interested to know that Whitaker was given a rough time in the witness box by the defence team and acknowledged that his beloved technique is not recognised universally, mainly because of concerns about possible contamination.

In at least one book on the case, Dr. Whitaker is portrayed as an arrogant, self opinionated expert witness. Nevertheless, as in the vast majority of cases subject to mass media coverage, the jury convicted.

One other point of interest to this forum was my visit to the old Darwin jail, now a museum. There I saw the execution chamber and gallows, last used in 1952. The most striking thing to me was how small the apparatus of death is.

Peter

[Steve]

On the very slight off-chance that James Trower did identify the murder car turning left into Avondale Crescent shortly after 7am on August 23rd 1961, do you think that was when the car was parked and abandoned ? If not, that would mean the car returning to the same location several hours later that same day. If it was abandoned shortly after 7am it took a long time for the police to find it. Strange.

Trower's evidence was shown to be totally incorrect by his friend Hogan, who said that morning Trower arrived later than usual. Also, from the position Trower would have been standing, on the pavement outside the shop and with his own car parked inbetween himself and the road, he would at best have had only a fleeting glimpse of the car's driver. It would seem that Trower involved himself in the A6 murder case for reasons known only to himself and, with his false evidence, actually stood in the way of justice being done.

One witness, Doreen Milne, said that she parked her own Morris Minor on the opposite side of Avondale Crescent a little after 8 o’clock on the morning of the alleged sighting, and didn't notice a second grey Morris Minor being there. That’s not to say there wasn’t one actually there and she just failed to notice it, but her own vehicle could well have caused confusion about the actual time that the gunman (assuming it was the gunman) dumped the car in Avondale Crescent. However, corroboration of Doreen Milne’s statement came from Margaret Thompson who told the police at the scene that evening that she was sure that Gregsten’s car had not been there earlier in the afternoon when she had walked along the road with her little boy.

[Steve]

Number 1 on posting 629 is some distance from any dwelling. Also, there is no hedge immediately to the north of it. The Google picture shows the southern end of the field, but it stretches four or five hundred yards to the north above where the image cuts off.

You have to bear in mind that much of this area has been altered substantially since 1961. For instance, the more northern entrance to the field is now protected with a substantial padlocked gate and is in regular use providing access to a local water-supply facility. The entrance, which most certainly was there at the bottom of Marsh Lane, has been changed out of all recognition by the construction of the very long driveway leading virtually the full width of the cornfield and providing access to the rowing lake and its facilities. Even within the last few weeks further construction work has taken place along much of that section of Marsh Lane, changing its appearance yet again.

[Steve]

Dr Whitaker

The DNA analysis in the case was carried out by no less a person than the Low Copy Number guru, Jonathan Whitaker – who did similar work on the A6 exibits.

Hanratty supporters will be interested to know that Whitaker was given a rough time in the witness box by the defence team and acknowledged that his beloved technique is not recognised universally, mainly because of concerns about possible contamination.

In at least one book on the case, Dr. Whitaker is portrayed as an arrogant, self opinionated expert witness. Nevertheless, as in the vast majority of cases subject to mass media coverage, the jury convicted.

This is very interesting and proves that we do need to keep an open mind on the DNA evidence. Who knows what future scientific developments might shed further light on the A6 murder case!

[Steve]

Avondale Crescent

Another view of Avondale Crescent showing the area where the Morris Minor was found, and also showing the flats above the Redbridge shops.

[Steve]

Green's Stores

This is another view of the parade of shops at the bottom of Redbridge Lane East. What was Green's Stores is the fourth one along from the right with the yellow and black sign. It was part of a chain of local grocery stores all trading as Green's and owned by Green's Stores (Ilford) Ltd. I believe they had as many as twenty stores in the group at one time all located in this part of Essex and East London.

[larue]

I believe they had as many as twenty stores in the group at one time all located in this part of Essex and East London.

quite right Steve. my mother worked in one for years, in what is now part of basildon.

changing the subject completely, here's a pic of Sidney Taffler, who some have said bears a visual resemblance to one Peter Alphon. sorry aboot the size and quality

[larue]

and another

[larue]

and yet a third. i have as yet been unable to find a better picture for visual comparison. yay!! i've been promoted to detective!!