a6 murder

[Victor]

For those who doubt that LCN DNA testing is regarded with caution and suspicion in many places other than the UK - the following article might prove useful:

http://www.suite101.com/content/what...ber-dna-a38840

Hi Julie,

That link is from 2007 and is superceded by the 2009 Reed/Reed/Garmson ruling.

KR,
Vic

[Limehouse]

Hi Norma,

You still haven't given your proof of this contention so please stop repeating it because I believe it to be inaccurate.

KR,
Vic

For those who doubt that LCN DNA testing is regarded with caution and suspicion in many places other than the UK - the following article might prove useful:

http://www.suite101.com/content/what-is-low-copy-number-dna-a38840

[Natalie Severn]

Thanks for the point of information Trevor.I am surprised .
Norma

[tji]

Hi

[QUOTE=Natalie Severn;157188]Steady on,----vaginal fluid is not released automatically.The recipient usually only releases vaginal lubricant if she wants to participate surely?

Sorry to come in halfway through a thread but no, quite a lot of rape victims produce natural lubricant and can orgasm when being raped. The body responds to the stimulant it feels even if the victim doesn't want to participate.

Tj

[Natalie Severn]

What???? Are you for real? I honestly can't be bothered trying to tackle the nonsense in your postings much longer.

There was vaginal fluid and semen in a typical distribution and pattern which demonsrated to those who analyse these exhibits for a living that sexual intercourse had taken place between Hanratty and Storie. He raped her. That's the facts. That's the science. Be a denier if you choose. Defend a murderer and rapist if you choose. But those are the facts of the matter. End of.

Steady on,----vaginal fluid is not released automatically.The recipient usually only releases vaginal lubricant if she wants to participate surely?

Hence the market in KY jelly for those who get a "headache" or find sexual intercourse painful etc.

[babybird67]

Jen,


Jen,

For the scientist to be saying that vaginal fluid was discovered to be mixed with the rapists semen, surely it follows that oxytocin was released too ie the ingredient present during the release of vaginal fluid in order to reach sexual orgasm,.I have great difficulty accepting this.I mean oxytocin is released in response to "pleasure" ,nurturing etc.What on earth can this have to do with rape for goodness sake.
Norma

What???? Are you for real? I honestly can't be bothered trying to tackle the nonsense in your postings much longer.

There was vaginal fluid and semen in a typical distribution and pattern which demonsrated to those who analyse these exhibits for a living that sexual intercourse had taken place between Hanratty and Storie. He raped her. That's the facts. That's the science. Be a denier if you choose. Defend a murderer and rapist if you choose. But those are the facts of the matter. End of.

[Natalie Severn]

Jen,

.forget about the DNA identifying the participants. Forget about that altogether for a moment, ok. It's not that Hanratty's DNA was there. It's that the distribution and pattern reflected a sexual activity. This is used in rape cases all the time, regardless of LCN DNA testing. Scientists look for said distribution so they can determine whether sexual intercourse took place and that distribution was there. They had sex. It was not contamination.

Jen,

For the scientist to be saying that vaginal fluid was discovered to be mixed with the rapists semen, surely it follows that oxytocin was released too ie the ingredient present during the release of vaginal fluid in order to reach sexual orgasm,.I have great difficulty accepting this.I mean oxytocin is released in response to "pleasure" ,nurturing etc.What on earth can this have to do with rape for goodness sake.
Norma

[Natalie Severn]

Vic,
Have you found the title yet of the article you keep quoting from about Micheal Sherrard that has no name to it and no date on it?

[Victor]

But this evidence which came through LCN DNA testing would not be allowed to be produced as evidence in the Courts of Appeal in many States in America due to the frequency of error in the conclusion.Such use of LCN DNA tests have been banned in appeal courts in these American States.

Hi Norma,

You still haven't given your proof of this contention so please stop repeating it because I believe it to be inaccurate.

KR,
Vic

[babybird67]

But this evidence which came through LCN DNA testing would not be allowed to be produced as evidence in the Courts of Appeal in many States in America due to the frequency of error in the conclusion.Such use of LCN DNA tests have been banned in appeal courts in these American States.

Norma...one, we aren't in the USA.

Two...forget about the DNA identifying the participants. Forget about that altogether for a moment, ok. It's not that Hanratty's DNA was there. It's that the distribution and pattern reflected a sexual activity. This is used in rape cases all the time, regardless of LCN DNA testing. Scientists look for said distribution so they can determine whether sexual intercourse took place and that distribution was there. They had sex. It was not contamination.

[Natalie Severn]

It's what the experts said. They can distinguish between primary and secondary transfer. This was without a doubt primary. What they found proved conclusively sex had taken place.

But this evidence which came through LCN DNA testing would not be allowed to be produced as evidence in the Courts of Appeal in many States in America due to the frequency of error in the conclusion.Such use of LCN DNA tests have been banned in appeal courts in these American States.

[babybird67]

Thanks. Personally - I am not convinced that the final DNA tests did show that the DNA was mixed together. Certainly the first tests could not have shown this. However - I will read the report again.

It's what the experts said. They can distinguish between primary and secondary transfer. This was without a doubt primary. What they found proved conclusively sex had taken place.

[Limehouse]

what the stains on someone's knickers like when vaginal fluid and semen are mixed together after intercourse...i.e., not from being spilled accidentally onto something.

Thanks. Personally - I am not convinced that the final DNA tests did show that the DNA was mixed together. Certainly the first tests could not have shown this. However - I will read the report again.

[babybird67]

Could you clarify what you mean by distribution of semen please?

what the stains on someone's knickers like when vaginal fluid and semen are mixed together after intercourse...i.e., not from being spilled accidentally onto something.

[Victor]

So who IS your sock-puppet?

Graham

Hi Graham,

Great question. Although personally I'd ask "Who's got their hand up your ar$ehole"?

KR,
Vic