a6 murder

[jimarilyn]

Incidentally Michael Sherrard whilst being very critical of Basil’s tactics thought even less of Sergeant Oxford.

Hi Tony,

I wonder why that doesn't surprise me about Sir Kenneth Oxford ?

From what little I know of Oxo, he very much comes across as a racist and tyrant, two not very endearing qualities.
He ruled his police force ( he was Chief Constable of Merseyside from 1976 to 1989 ) with a rod of iron.
Seems like anyone can get knighted. He perhaps should have got knotted instead.


regards,
James

[Tony]

Hi Tony,

I wonder why that doesn't surprise me about Sir Kenneth Oxford ?

From what little I know of Oxo, he very much comes across as a racist and tyrant, two not very endearing qualities.
He ruled his police force ( he was Chief Constable of Merseyside from 1976 to 1989 ) with a rod of iron.
Seems like anyone can get knighted. He perhaps should have got knotted instead.


regards,
James

Where in Knotty Ash?

Great to see you back Jimarilyn. I’ve been a bit worried about you. So much has happened on here you’ve got a lot of catching up to do.

Tony.

[jimarilyn]

Where in Knotty Ash?

Great to see you back Jimarilyn. I’ve been a bit worried about you. So much has happened on here you’ve got a lot of catching up to do.

Tony.

Hi Tony,

Nice swan. That would be the dwelling place of the hilarious Sir Kenneth Dodd (whose house I go past several times a week). He still hasn't invited me in for a jam butty though !

Just getting over the effects of a heavy cold, but I've kept up to date with the numerous posts since I last logged in.


regards,
James

[jimarilyn]

I have read that he was relieved when the DNA tests came out but if he now thinks, because of that, that JH was guilty how long did he hold the belief that he was innocent?
Did he think all along that we had hanged an innocent man or did he have a sneaky suspicion about JH?
Or did he think post DNA: “Well bugger me JH did it after all and he’s had me fooled for 40 years.”

Hi Tony,

I know appearances can sometimes be deceptive but on camera (in Bob Woffinden's 1992 documentary) Michael Sherrard comes across to me as a strong believer in Hanratty's innocence. I think all in all, and on very limited resources that Sherrard put up a good defence (apart from the Michael Clark aspect of the case). It seems very much the case that James Hanratty, himself, was very impressed with Sherrard's handling of his defence.

One thing I can't understand (apart from Swahili) is why there was not a single female on the 11 member jury at Bedford. Disgraceful, in my opinion.

regards,
James

[Tony]

Hi Tony,

I know appearances can sometimes be deceptive but on camera (in Bob Woffinden's 1992 documentary) Michael Sherrard comes across to me as a strong believer in Hanratty's innocence. I think all in all, and on very limited resources that Sherrard put up a good defence (apart from the Michael Clark aspect of the case). It seems very much the case that James Hanratty, himself, was very impressed with Sherrard's handling of his defence.

One thing I can't understand (apart from Swahili) is why there was not a single female on the 11 member jury at Bedford. Disgraceful, in my opinion.

regards,
James

James,

Read my post 2939 for your reply.

Tony.

[Tony]

Hi all,


And yet you simultaneously demand to see private papers from Dixie France after his suicide without permission from his surviving family.


I share those hopes.


Oo-er is that a threat, I'm soooo scared. Actually it'd be nice to talk to him about whether his brother uses the same bullying tactics, illogical arguments and unhanded tactics in his everyday life.

KR,
Vic.

Hello again Vic,

I can not recall anybody on here on anywhere else for that matter demanding to see the France letters.

I personally would like to see them and I would like to see certain other things; such as a photo of Michael Clark, John Kerr’s notes conveniently lost by the police and also the court cases of Peter Alphon for fraud and hire purchase fraud in about 1960 which somebody enquired about recently and the people in charge of Freedom of Information decided they should not be made available to the public for another 61 years as they were against the public interest

I wonder if the non-driving Mr Alphon tried to get a HP agreement to buy a car?

Tony

[Victor]

Hello again Vic,

I can not recall anybody on here on anywhere else for that matter demanding to see the France letters.

Hi Tony,

Answering that would involve trawling back through the thread which I haven't got time to do. My personal impression is that Reg and James in particular were expressing dismay that they weren't more widely available.

I personally would like to see them and I would like to see certain other things; such as a photo of Michael Clark, John Kerr’s notes conveniently lost by the police

Definitely, although the former may not exist especially if Mr Clark is deceased, and the latter may have been destroyed along with most of the exhibits.

and also the court cases of Peter Alphon for fraud and hire purchase fraud in about 1960 which somebody enquired about recently and the people in charge of Freedom of Information decided they should not be made available to the public for another 61 years as they were against the public interest

Not in the same league as the above, but certainly would be interesting.

I wonder if the non-driving Mr Alphon tried to get a HP agreement to buy a car?

Tony

What about if Mr Alphon was purchasing for a friend or someone willing to act as a chauffeur for him? Although interesting, such information would need careful examination before any conclusions could be drawn, and unless he was given the opportunity to respond to any allegations, ultimately of limited significance to Hanratty and the A6 murder case.

KR,
Vic.

[Tony]

Hi Tony,

Answering that would involve trawling back through the thread which I haven't got time to do. My personal impression is that Reg and James in particular were expressing dismay that they weren't more widely available.


Definitely, although the former may not exist especially if Mr Clark is deceased, and the latter may have been destroyed along with most of the exhibits.


Not in the same league as the above, but certainly would be interesting.


What about if Mr Alphon was purchasing for a friend or someone willing to act as a chauffeur for him? Although interesting, such information would need careful examination before any conclusions could be drawn, and unless he was given the opportunity to respond to any allegations, ultimately of limited significance to Hanratty and the A6 murder case.

KR,
Vic.

Hi Again Vic,

Interesting reply.

I can only, of course, answer for myself but I do not perceive that expressions of dismay, not that I recall them, are demands. Anyway I think we should leave it at that as we will be arguing about sentence construction next.

Michael Clark was brought from RAF Northwood for the ID parade; I might just drop them a line to see if they have any photos available of personnel at that time. You can sometimes drop lucky with such requests.

Certainly the court proceedings involving Peter Alphon just prior to the case would be interesting but we are not allowed any information about them for another 59 years. I may not be around then.

Purchasing a car for a friend? He had none.
For a chauffeur? He could not afford one at that time. But, of course, he could have just after the trial when he mysteriously became very wealthy.

Tony.

[Victor]

I can only, of course, answer for myself but I do not perceive that expressions of dismay, not that I recall them, are demands. Anyway I think we should leave it at that as we will be arguing about sentence construction next.

Hi Tony,
Fairy snuff, we can agree to disagree.

Michael Clark was brought from RAF Northwood for the ID parade; I might just drop them a line to see if they have any photos available of personnel at that time. You can sometimes drop lucky with such requests.

Now that would be fortunate and very useful, although it's worth remembering that PLA was on that ID parade and was not picked out at the time.

Certainly the court proceedings involving Peter Alphon just prior to the case would be interesting but we are not allowed any information about them for another 59 years. I may not be around then.

Well I certainly hope that you will be.

Purchasing a car for a friend? He had none.

I was offering alternative explanations prior to the results coming out, so that noone can accuse me of subterfuge afterwards. "He had none" is a bit of a blanket statement that would be difficult to prove, especially with a subjective word like "friend" and just where does the line between "friends" and "acquaintances" lie?

For a chauffeur? He could not afford one at that time. But, of course, he could have just after the trial when he mysteriously became very wealthy.

Tony.

It depends upon how much a chauffeur would charge and whether they would accept alternative payment methods - use of the car at other times, "services rendered" including illegal ones such as acting as a getaway driver.

I'm not so sure about the "mysteriously" part, gambling wins and playing the media certainly contributed to his wealth.

KR,
Vic.

[reg1965]

In Woffinden (1997, pps444-5) following artefacts discovered during the CCRC investgation into the case in the late 90's it appears that Nudds told a fellow prisoner that Hanratty was innocent. Nudds also acquired a gun in the late 50's and was a police informer who was passing information to the police about illegal gun deals.

[Tony]

In Woffinden (1997, pps444-5) following artefacts discovered during the CCRC investgation into the case in the late 90's it appears that Nudds told a fellow prisoner that Hanratty was innocent. Nudds also acquired a gun in the late 50's and was a police informer who was passing information to the police about illegal gun deals.

Hi Reg,

Just read those pages. I must have read them lots before. They obviously did not register.
Well spotted.

Tony.

[john]

One of my occasional threads. i firmly believe that he was innocent and that people are coming to my way of thinking re Michael Clark and VS. The image of Clark would finally tell us how accurate was her powers of observation and if Clark looks nothing like Hanratty, what or what was going on at the 2nd identity parade.

The stress of the 1st parade argument does not really hold up if Clark looks nothing like Hanratty. It does, if he does looklike Hanratty.

I am sure that the prosecution would have produced him if he looked like Hanratty to show that VS had been reasonably consistent in her identifications. The Clark photo is the most single powerful aspect left that can nail it or leave it wide open. Thus I doubt that anyone will see it!!

Although I do believe him innocent something is nagging at me. When he left the Vienna that morning, all agree that he said that he had said to them he was going to the Queensway to do some business, hence the dispute about the bus numbers etc given to him by the dubious Nudds. All seem to agree on that.

So why was he going to the Queensway and he actually set off in the opposite direcion to what he asked for etc. Why and what was the business?
Also I do not think he made a mistake re Paddington thinking it was Euston.
He had travelled too much to Liverpool to make that error.

[jimarilyn]

Anyway I think we should leave it at that as we will be arguing about sentence construction next.

A very perceptive remark Tony and one already well noted my myself.

Purchasing a car for a friend? He had none.

I'm not too sure about this Tony. Some very interested parties picked Alphon up after his court appearance (see post 2630) at Mortlake Magistrates Court on October 3rd 1961. These friends must have been keeping a close eye on what was happening to their pal Peter Louis Alphon during September and early October.

The magistrates very mysteriously dismissed the charges ( of attacking and causing bodily harm to Mrs Dalal ) directed against him, despite Mrs Dalal's positive identification of him as her attacker and would be rapist.

As far as I am aware nobody else was subsequently charged in connection with this dreadful and vicious attack on Mrs Dalal. Did the police pursue further investigation into this crime I wonder ? If not, why ?

This attack on Mrs Dalal occurred on September 7th and the similarities with what happened in the Morris Minor a fortnight earlier are striking (no pun intended ). One thing is for sure.....the attacker, who claimed to be the A6
murderer, could not have been James Hanratty. Hanratty was in Eire from September 4th to September 11th.

Another undeniable fact is that Mrs Dalal had an excellent view of her attacker. The whole episode, which occurred around lunchtime, must have lasted at least 10 minutes or so, ample enough time for the features, etc, of her attacker to register strongly in her mind.

Her address in Upper Richmond Road West, incidentally, was in an area that Alphon knew very well.



regards,
James

[reg1965]

Although I do believe him innocent something is nagging at me. When he left the Vienna that morning, all agree that he said that he had said to them he was going to the Queensway to do some business, hence the dispute about the bus numbers etc given to him by the dubious Nudds. All seem to agree on that.

So why was he going to the Queensway and he actually set off in the opposite direcion to what he asked for etc. Why and what was the business?
Also I do not think he made a mistake re Paddington thinking it was Euston.
He had travelled too much to Liverpool to make that error.

Hi John
When Hanratty left the Frances on Monday 21st August he said that he was going to visit an aunt in Liverpool. This was obviously not true, yet not true in the sense of "I'm going to see a man about a dog".
Why should Hanratty tell the members of staff of a doss house the details of what he was going to do after leaving? As for going to Paddington no one knows why he went there? It is possible that he thought that he had left some luggage there and realised that he was mistaken. Who knows?
He was certainly seen by the actor Da Costa at Euston just before midday. Mr Da Costa did not want to get involved for whatever reason he must have had. He may have been a homosexual and feared being exposed in those days when being gay was a taboo subject in society.

Welcome aboard.
Reg

[jimarilyn]

I personally would like to see them and I would like to see certain other things; such as a photo of Michael Clark, John Kerr’s notes conveniently lost by the police and also the court cases of Peter Alphon for fraud and hire purchase fraud in about 1960 which somebody enquired about recently and the people in charge of Freedom of Information decided they should not be made available to the public for another 61 years as they were against the public interest

Hi Tony,

It's interesting to note that about 9 months after the Bedford trial, Nudds was sent down for 6 years for fraud offences. Alphon claimed to have known Nudds. I wonder if Nudds ever sought Alphon's advice on the matter of fraud ?


regards,
James