Charles Bravo: Choose Your Own Verdict

[Mayerling]

Belinda, Google Analytics informed me that there had been a referral from this site. Being curious, I visited the site and then tracked down the forum and then you!

George Henry Storrs will be a future case. Next in line will be Edmund Geoffrey, arguably Britain's oldest cold case from 1678. After that its Julia Wallace - possibly the best Agatha Christie story not written by her (you know what I mean!). I'm also intrigued by Adelaide Bartlett, Evelyn Foster, Steinie Morrison, Sir Harry Oakes, possibly Rattenbury and also Maybrick. Plus Kennedy and Lizzy Borden too.

If you have any good Aussie cold cases I would be delighted to hear of them (I really interested in pre-1950 cases).

My purpose in joining casebook is to research the ripper. There are SO many theories and suspects, I will be asking casebook posters for their hottest suspect and their best long shot in due course!

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory
www.coldcasejury.com

You have a great selection to begin with there. I suspect the mystery with Francis Rattenbury's murder is if Alma was actually behind it or not. I tend to think she wasn't. Poor Stoner - he finally got out of prison, but got back in for a subsequent event dealing with a minor.

Have you ever stopped to think that Francis Rattenbury's situation and fate is similar to his American counterpart Stamford White, with Harry Thaw and Evelyn Nesbit? Both are great architects who are killed in love triangles.

Not being Australian I can't think of any major mysteries (the Gatton case is a good suggestion from Stan), but the career of that pearly member of the government of New South Wales, Minister of Justice (???!!!) Thomas "Lemonade" Ley is worth looking at. Last time I read his "Wikipedia" entry there were at least three odd deaths and disappearances involving him that occurred before he high-tailed it to England with his mistress.

Jeff

[Mayerling]

Hi Antony:

Julian Fellows suggested in his A Most Mysterious Murder series that Charles was poisoning Florence but only to quell her alcohol problem, not to kill her, and that he took the poison by accident, confusing it with his epsom salt.

I have also read a theory that posits that Mrs. Cox and/or Florence were poisoning Charles, again not to kill him but to make him sick enough not to be continually getting Florence pregnant, and likewise accidentally gave a little too much on this last occasion.

Both versions of this theory (Charles doing it to Florence, or Florence to Charles) one to cure alcoholism and one to end child bearing problems smacks a bit of the theory suggested by Sir Edward Marshall Hall that Crippen was using the hyoscin to make Belle fall sound asleep and allow him to have his nightly romps with Ethel, but misjudged the right amount.

Jeff

[sdreid]

Stan - Yseult Bridges advanced the he-was-poisoning-Florence theory in her 1956 book. There is little evidence for it, in my view. Not least, because it does not explain Mrs Cox's behaviour. You can vote for the accident theory at the Cold Case Jury site, however, if you are still convinced.

If you are right, it was a poetic justice: he planned to kill his wife but ended up killing himself!

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory
www.coldcasejury.com

Hi Antony:

Julian Fellows suggested in his A Most Mysterious Murder series that Charles was poisoning Florence but only to quell her alcohol problem, not to kill her, and that he took the poison by accident, confusing it with his epsom salt.

I have also read a theory that posits that Mrs. Cox and/or Florence were poisoning Charles, again not to kill him but to make him sick enough not to be continually getting Florence pregnant, and likewise accidentally gave a little too much on this last occasion.

[sdreid]

If you have any good Aussie cold cases I would be delighted to hear of them (I really interested in pre-1950 cases).

Not to but in (But I am aren't I?)-Gatton Mystery, Taman Shud and, only slightly beyond the 1950 mark, Shirley Collins.

[ColdCaseJury]

I found your site very interesting What cases are you planning in future? George Harry Storrs and The Croydon Poisonings are two that are very interesting.
BTW How did you find out that I had posted about you here?

Belinda, Google Analytics informed me that there had been a referral from this site. Being curious, I visited the site and then tracked down the forum and then you!

George Henry Storrs will be a future case. Next in line will be Edmund Geoffrey, arguably Britain's oldest cold case from 1678. After that its Julia Wallace - possibly the best Agatha Christie story not written by her (you know what I mean!). I'm also intrigued by Adelaide Bartlett, Evelyn Foster, Steinie Morrison, Sir Harry Oakes, possibly Rattenbury and also Maybrick. Plus Kennedy and Lizzy Borden too.

If you have any good Aussie cold cases I would be delighted to hear of them (I really interested in pre-1950 cases).

My purpose in joining casebook is to research the ripper. There are SO many theories and suspects, I will be asking casebook posters for their hottest suspect and their best long shot in due course!

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory

https://www.coldcasejury.com

[Mayerling]

Jeff, again this is fascinating backstory. I agree this may be difficult to pull together into a plausible, coherent theory, but you could think about a connections-style article. What connects Bravo to Thackeray to x to y. Your objective, I suggest, would be connect to the ripper. As James Maybrick is a long-shot ripper suspect, and he was poisoned by his wife, also called Florence, you may have a (tenuous) connection there. But with you research skills I'm sure you could find stronger ones. Just an idea.

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory
www.coldcasejury.com

Thanks again for the complement. It's tough to do, and sometimes a mere chance causes one to note a connection that was not noted before. That one about Bravo supporting Governor Eyre was due to a list of supporters of the Governor among the upper classes in Jamaica in a book called "The Hero as Murderer" about Eyre. When I saw it I was amazed nobody ever linked the Eyre Affair with Joseph Bravo before.

But the tenuous nature of such links is always there. One exists between the Bravo case and an earlier murder by poison but really due to stretching things. The first husband of Florence, Captain Alexander Ricardo, was the grandson of the economist David Ricardo ("the iron law of wages") and Alexander's father made his fortune (in part) by purchasing the rights of inventors Wheatstone and Cooke to their pre-Morse telegraph of 1837. This telegraph had actually proven it's worth in 1845 when used in the tracking down and capturing of John Tawell, the "Quaker"/or "Kwaker" poisoner of Sarah Hart at Salt Hill near Aylesbury. After that Mr. Ricardo decided to get his hands on such a valuable machine and system of communications.

Jeff

[belinda]

Belinda - thank you for visiting the site. I'm the author. Just finishing the second book in the Cold Case Jury series, called Death of an Actress. It does not quite have the depth of mystery as the Charles Bravo case, or indeed the ripper, but it is a great story, involving sex and death on the high seas!

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory
www.coldcasejury.com

I found your site very interesting What cases are you planning in future? George Harry Storrs and The Croydon Poisonings are two that are very interesting.
BTW How did you find out that I had posted about you here?

[ColdCaseJury]

Graham, when you say 'a shadow hung over Florence due to her first husband' what do you mean? It can't be that she poisoned him. Florence and Alexander Ricardo had been long separated at the time of his death and he collapsed and died in a hotel room in Cologne. He'd been an alcoholic for years and suffered bad health due to it. Or is the shadow due to Florence's bad reputation?

Rosella, John Williams in Suddenly At The Priory, subscribed to the view that Alexander Ricardo died from antimony poisoning. This theory was given short shrift by Taylor and Clarke, as you know. There really is no evidence to back it up. I'm with you on this one.

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory

https://www.coldcasejury.com

[Rosella]

Graham, when you say 'a shadow hung over Florence due to her first husband' what do you mean? It can't be that she poisoned him. Florence and Alexander Ricardo had been long separated at the time of his death and he collapsed and died in a hotel room in Cologne. He'd been an alcoholic for years and suffered bad health due to it. Or is the shadow due to Florence's bad reputation?

[Graham]

Hi Graham,

Tartar emetic is a powerful emetic - just a few grains will induce nausea. The accident theory - which you can vote for on the Cold Case Jury site, BTW - was propounded by Yseult Bridges, as you know. There are problems with her theory, which I expound in my book. One of them, however, is that Charles Bravo was an expert on medical jurisprudence, and would have known the correct dose. Rather, his calling out for hot water (a weak emetic) is consistent with him thinking he had swallowed laudanum. I also cover this.

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory
www.coldcasejury.com

Hi AMB,

know what, I think I confused tartar emetic with hot water regarding their relative emetic actions. It's a long time since I read up on this case, but if memory serves tartar emetic had been purchased by the stable-lad for the horses. Hot water is an old treatment for upset tums and constipation, as I know only too well from when I was a very young child. I still rather subscribe to the accident theory, although as I said there was a shadow hanging over Florence regarding her first husband. Also interesting is the fact that Charles was seen by Dr William Gull, a one-time Ripper suspect (probably still is in some circles). One thing that came out of this case is that the police didn't succumb to a possible knee-jerk reaction and charge either Florence or Jane Cox (or anyone else) and worry about the consequences afterwards, so long as someone stood a chance of hanging for Bravo's murder.

I believe there is to this very day a legend that Charles Bravo's unhappy ghost still haunts The Priory..........can't say I blame him, to be honest, although by most accounts he was a rather unpleasant man.

Graham

[ColdCaseJury]

Ah, Gay Gibson and the self confessed ladies man deck steward. I'll look forward to it!

Thanks, Rosella. It is a truly interesting case. If James Camb had not admitted to being in her cabin, and there was a wider pool of suspects, I think this case would rival the ripper in interest. Sex and murder on the high seas. Rather, it is a did-he-or-did-he-not-kill-her mystery. One of the questions is: did she like male attention?

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory

https://www.coldcasejury.com

[ColdCaseJury]

Jeff, again this is fascinating backstory. I agree this may be difficult to pull together into a plausible, coherent theory, but you could think about a connections-style article. What connects Bravo to Thackeray to x to y. Your objective, I suggest, would be connect to the ripper. As James Maybrick is a long-shot ripper suspect, and he was poisoned by his wife, also called Florence, you may have a (tenuous) connection there. But with you research skills I'm sure you could find stronger ones. Just an idea.

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory

https://www.coldcasejury.com

[Rosella]

Ah, Gay Gibson and the self confessed ladies man deck steward. I'll look forward to it!

[Mayerling]

Jeff, a great post, with some interesting facts. But if Joseph Bravo or Henri Pineux were involved, they must have been in league with Mrs Cox "on the inside". Otherwise, how to you account for her lying? Lie she must have done because, if Charles was murdered, he would never have said to Mrs Cox "I've taken poison for Dr Gully, don't tell Florence." And why should she lie, unless she was involved? I explain this pivotal logic in my book.

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory
www.coldcasejury.com

Thank you for the complement. I never really finished the work on it, which has been kicking about for years, but when I began to gather it I got into an emotional funk about writing that I still have.

Basically, Pineux (as "Comte de Tourville") had gone to the same inn of court as Charles did, and that is how is how they knew each other. Pineux is one of the most fascinating underwritten serial killers of the 19th Century that I know of - most of what I read of him is from essays in books by the likes of Charles Kingston from the days of the "potted" crime story books in the 1910s - 1940s. Neither Roughead nor Tennyson Jesse nor Bolitho nor Pearson tackled him, nor did Dilnot. None of the first raters.

He fascinates me because (unlike Cream or Deeming or the Ripper or Chapman) he varies his methods from victim to victim. He shoots his mother-in-law ("accidentally" she commits suicide shooting herself in the back of the head). He poisons his first wife. He tries to burn his infant son to death in a large house fire. He throws his second wife off a mountain height (features about him and this murder pop up in Conan Doyle's "The Adventure of the Illustrious Client" including the foreign "titled" villain, Baron Gruber). He is basically a fortune hunter (which may have given him entry to Charles' friendship - a community of interests there). But I was having problems documenting it. Once de Tourville was really notorious in 1876, after his second wife's death, anyone who knew him did not mention it openly. By that time (though) Charles had died. My suspicion was that de Tourville may have "advised" Charles regarding poisoning Florence, but in reality doing it in such a way that Charles would be killed instead. Then, provided no problems regarding the murder of the second Mrs. de Tourville arose (as unfortunately for him they did), he'd be comforting Florence - and paving the way to get her and her fortune for himself.

It is an intriguing theory, but I don't know if it could be proven.

Joe Bravo was not involved in the murder - he was just having his hands full of Charles and his inane speculation schemes. But he knew that if the police found that letter he sent to Charles it would put him in a bad light, and he did not want that. He did want to push the blame on Florence with or without Gully and Mrs. Cox. This was to comfort the distraught Mary Bravo, who would be pining away for the dead son she loved. Had it been up to Joe on his own, he'd have buried Charles and that would have been that.

There was more to the article as planned - I wanted to get into Gully and his water cure place at Malvern, with it's deluxe clientele like Charles Darwin and George Elliot. But I discovered as I looked into that an entirely separate subject - how in the 19th Century a number of doctors connected to spas and watering institutions were involved in homicide cases. Two in particular were in Gully's period of operations: Dr. Thomas Smethurst and Dr. Edward William Pritchard. This part of the research had little to do with the Bravo Case as such but it was an interesting sidelight in terms of social history.

Good luck on your second book, which I suspect is that 1948 "porthole" case.

Jeff

[ColdCaseJury]

I have two theories to work with, and they don't point at Florence and Jane Cox, nor Florence's lover Dr. James Manby Gully. They look at Charles Bravo's step father Joseph Bravo (though not as a suspect, precisely), and at a hitherto unknown party in this case who may have been an acquaintance (even a friend) of Charles - Henri Pineux, a.k.a. Henri de Tourville, a fellow member of Middle Temple, a social climber (like Charles), and a murderer (serial killer - in a variety of ways).

Jeff, a great post, with some interesting facts. But if Joseph Bravo or Henri Pineux were involved, they must have been in league with Mrs Cox "on the inside". Otherwise, how to you account for her lying? Lie she must have done because, if Charles was murdered, he would never have said to Mrs Cox "I've taken poison for Dr Gully, don't tell Florence." And why should she lie, unless she was involved? I explain this pivotal logic in my book.

Antony Matthew Brown
Author Poisoning at the Priory

https://www.coldcasejury.com