The Lindbergh Baby Kidnapping

[sdreid]

I pretty much agree Graham although I'm not totally convinced that the child was killed accidentally. A fall wouldn't have been all that great and children have bones that are much more resilient than we adults even if a man landed on top of him. I can however see the child being seriously injured in a fall and the kidnappers finishing him off when they saw the seriousness of his condition.

Somewhere, I heard that Condon originally said that "John" had an Italian accent. I believe a German would have pronounced boat boot (more or less rhyming with soot) not boad.

[Mayerling]

John Condon, who for unclear reasons Lindbergh trusted to act as an intermediary, claimed that during his meeting with the masked man, who he said had a marked 'German' accent, at the 233rd Street Cemetery, the man asked him if 'he would burn if the baby was dead'. Condon then asked the man if indeed the baby was dead, and he claimed he was told that the baby was alive and well and on a boat (which Condon said the man pronounced as 'boad'). Further, the masked man ('Cemetery John' as Condon called him) said that he would send to Condon the baby's sleeping-suit, which did in fact arrive by post and was identified by the Lindbergh's as the one worn by Charles Jnr. on the night he was abducted. The remains of the baby found about a month later near Hopewell was dressed in a flannel shirt that had been made by Betty Gow. There was no sign (apparently) of a sleeping-suit.

Whilst much can be made of John Condon's involvement in the case, my own belief is that 'Cemetery John' was indeed Bruno Hauptmann, and that the remains found in the woods were indeed those of Charles Lindbergh Jnr. I do not feel, however, that Hauptmann acted alone. I am convinced that he had some inside help from someone at Hopewell (as I said, how did he know which room the baby slept in?), and I have a fairly strong feeling that other people were involved - ref: the talking in Italian that Condon claimed to have heard when he was phoned by the presumed kidnapper following his, Condon's, ad in the New York American.

And finally there was the amazing investigation by the wood technologist Arthur Koehler who pin-pointed the timber in the ladder as being sold by a lumber-yard in The Bronx - Hauptmann lived in The Bronx. And later, unless you believe it was a police plant, the nail-holes in a piece of the ladder matched nail-holes in the joists in the roof of Hauptmann's house.

So was it a case of kidnapping for a large ransom that went disastrously wrong? I believe it was.

Graham

Hi Graham,

I agree - it was a kidnapping that went completely wrong. Although it is constantly mentioned in biographies of Lindbergh and his wife Anne, and is touched on by students of the case, most people ignore that Anne's father was Dwight Morrow, who had been a business partner at J. P. Morgan & Son, as well as a former Ambassador to Mexico and New Jersey Senator to the U.S. Congress. Morrow died in 1931, but had he lived there was a strong movement to replace Herbert Hoover as Republican Presidential Candidate in 1932 with Morrow. The point is that Morrow being rich, Anne would have been in line for a large inheritance. Moreover, Lindbergh was making a huge salary (for that time) as an aviation advisor - mostly to Juan Trippe the creator of Pan American Airlines. Lindbergh and his wife had flown throughout the hemisphere mapping potential routes for Pan Am to use. They thus had money. Through the dead Senator they had top level political and financial connections. If anyone had been following Lindbergh's career at the time in the newspapers all this would have been known, and so the idea of a major ransom being possibly collectible for the child (known as "Baby Lindy" in the press) would have occurred to some thug sooner or later.

I have never figured out how Mr. Condon (a Bronx School Principal) managed to win his way into Col. Lindbergh's circle. Supposedly he had put some message to attract the kidnapper in a personal column of a Bronx newspaper, and he got a response (from Hauptmann, presumably), and then contacted Lindbergh. If so it is a crazy hundred to one shot that is somewhat hard to believe really happened. Still I would have been as suspicious as hell about it if I had been in Lindbergh's position.

At that same time one John Curtis had contacted Lindbergh that he had contacts with the kidnappers who were hiding on a boat. Curtis later proved to be a liar or publicity seeker - he wasted precious time following his tale. And a friend of the Morrows, Evelyn Walsh McLean (whose husband owned the Washington Post) fell for a set of lies from former Secret Service Agent Gaston Means that he knew where the baby was - McLean lost a large sum of money to Means (a dubious, possibly murderous individual), and eventually Means went to prison for this fraud. But all this just shows that in the beginning of the crime the Lindberghs and their friends were desperately trying to follow any possible lead to get the baby back. This would (I suppose) include checking out Condon's story and trusting it.

Jeff

[Graham]

That's a good point. Hauptmann wasn't executed for the kidnapping, or the extortion. He was executed for murder. If he could have led the police to a living baby, he surely would have had a commutation to life in prison, probably with parole hearings. I can't imagine an accomplice he would protect with his life, other than his wife, and considering how publicly she pursued his posthumous exoneration, I don't think she was an accomplice, because her best strategy would be to lie low and let things die down after the execution. If she knew where the child was, and didn't want to come forward so she and her husband wouldn't both go to prison, she could send an anonymous note. I can't imagine a scenario where Hauptmann knew the location of the living child, and didn't reveal it.

The only way for the baby to have survived the kidnapping is for Hauptmann to have been entirely uninvolved, which is why he didn't know where the child was, but that still leaves the mystery of who the body in the woods was, and the police really did look at other missing child reports; the Lindbergh child fit the parameters perfectly, and no other missing child did.

John Condon, who for unclear reasons Lindbergh trusted to act as an intermediary, claimed that during his meeting with the masked man, who he said had a marked 'German' accent, at the 233rd Street Cemetery, the man asked him if 'he would burn if the baby was dead'. Condon then asked the man if indeed the baby was dead, and he claimed he was told that the baby was alive and well and on a boat (which Condon said the man pronounced as 'boad'). Further, the masked man ('Cemetery John' as Condon called him) said that he would send to Condon the baby's sleeping-suit, which did in fact arrive by post and was identified by the Lindbergh's as the one worn by Charles Jnr. on the night he was abducted. The remains of the baby found about a month later near Hopewell was dressed in a flannel shirt that had been made by Betty Gow. There was no sign (apparently) of a sleeping-suit.

Whilst much can be made of John Condon's involvement in the case, my own belief is that 'Cemetery John' was indeed Bruno Hauptmann, and that the remains found in the woods were indeed those of Charles Lindbergh Jnr. I do not feel, however, that Hauptmann acted alone. I am convinced that he had some inside help from someone at Hopewell (as I said, how did he know which room the baby slept in?), and I have a fairly strong feeling that other people were involved - ref: the talking in Italian that Condon claimed to have heard when he was phoned by the presumed kidnapper following his, Condon's, ad in the New York American.

And finally there was the amazing investigation by the wood technologist Arthur Koehler who pin-pointed the timber in the ladder as being sold by a lumber-yard in The Bronx - Hauptmann lived in The Bronx. And later, unless you believe it was a police plant, the nail-holes in a piece of the ladder matched nail-holes in the joists in the roof of Hauptmann's house.

So was it a case of kidnapping for a large ransom that went disastrously wrong? I believe it was.

Graham

[RavenDarkendale]

That's not what I meant. I think that if they thought there really was a chance this guy was the kidnapped child, they would get tests. But they know he isn't. I'm sure they have gotten advice from a lawyer, and it's to leave him alone.

I doubt that he is another illegitimate child of Lindbergh

I don't think he is either, I was just saying that even if he turned out to be Lindbergh's kid, he isn't Charles, Jr. That baby is dead,

As I said before, Hauptman had both the chance of death penalty commuted to life in prison and $90,000 from Hearst as well just for a confession of guilt. If he was involved and knew where that baby was, he could have walked. That cremation of the baby's remains destroyed the easy way out, which would be to get DNA from the body. But I know as a father of three had one of my children been found in a shallow grave and badly decomposed, I would most likely did the same. There's no way for an open casket funeral anyway.

[RivkahChaya]

That's a good point. Hauptmann wasn't executed for the kidnapping, or the extortion. He was executed for murder. If he could have led the police to a living baby, he surely would have had a commutation to life in prison, probably with parole hearings. I can't imagine an accomplice he would protect with his life, other than his wife, and considering how publicly she pursued his posthumous exoneration, I don't think she was an accomplice, because her best strategy would be to lie low and let things die down after the execution. If she knew where the child was, and didn't want to come forward so she and her husband wouldn't both go to prison, she could send an anonymous note. I can't imagine a scenario where Hauptmann knew the location of the living child, and didn't reveal it.

The only way for the baby to have survived the kidnapping is for Hauptmann to have been entirely uninvolved, which is why he didn't know where the child was, but that still leaves the mystery of who the body in the woods was, and the police really did look at other missing child reports; the Lindbergh child fit the parameters perfectly, and no other missing child did.

[Mayerling]

Somehow, if the baby had been handed to some other family after the kidnapping, I can't believe Hauptmann at the last moment would not have used that information as a bargaining chip with the authorities to keep him out of the electric chair.

I know Hauptmann pinned his whole appeal to the government and to the public on the issue of whether his guilt was really proved. Years ago I read an article in Liberty Magazine that he had submitted trying to show that some of the evidence against him was questionable at best. I am aware that some of the witnesses were not the greatest, but at the same time some of his alibi witnesses were certainly far from convincing either.

But in 1936 the New Jersey Governor was Harold Hoffman, and he was willing to listen to Hauptmann (probably more than he should - he lost his re-election bid), and he delayed execution while further investigations were made. It did not pan out well.

Under those circumstances I would wonder why Hauptmann at the eleventh hour would not tell a vital secret to the Warden like, "That was not the Lindbergh baby they found - the baby is with X family since 1932." Fear of reprisals? From whom? (Hauptmann might admit complicity in the kidnapping but would name his associates to protect his family). It just seems so totally odd that if it were true he'd not use it.

Earlier on this thread there was a comment that Al Capone was widely thought, at first, to be involved. Actually Capone did get involved in that he offered to aid the police in the investigation (he apparently admired Lindbergh), but in return he'd get a reduction in time on his income tax sentence. His offer was not accepted.

Jeff

[RivkahChaya]

That's not what I meant. I think that if they thought there really was a chance this guy was the kidnapped child, they would get tests. But they know he isn't. I'm sure they have gotten advice from a lawyer, and it's to leave him alone.

I doubt that he is another illegitimate child of Lindbergh, but that's not what he's claiming. If the tests showed that, I don't think it would satisfy him, and he would still continue to claim to be the kidnapped child, even if it required a convoluted story that involved Anne Morrow being unfaithful.

The family is doing the right thing by staying away from him.

[RavenDarkendale]

I think he genuinely believes he is the Lindbergh child, but that doesn't make it so. I don't think he is another illegitimate child of Charles Lindbergh. I think the Lindbergh family is right not to engage him, because he is essentially a stalker, and you should never do anything to encourage a stalker. Things that you would think are discouraging, or "finalities," are not that to a stalker. They see any kind of contact as the relationship going forward. Sometimes they say they have realized the error of their ways, and want to apologize, but letting them is always a mistake, because they see that as a foot in the door. If you forgive them, maybe you are open to starting over.

If they ignore this guy, he may never go away, but he also may never escalate. A DNA test is the kind of contact that could set up a string of fantasies, like meeting the family at the testing facility, which, when they don't pan out, could make him escalate.

You might have something there. Lindbergh and Anne Morrow's five surviving children, In light of the fact that their father had seven more children with three other women, may have felt that they just didn't want to hear about any more kids!

[RivkahChaya]

I would think that if his intentions were sincere he would have approached the family privately and explained to them why he thought he might be their brother. Since he would not have been given any provision in his father's will, any claim he might have on that money would have to be sued out of every living descendant. And no judge is going to order that, even if he was their brother. He would only get anything through his sibling's good will, and you don't get that by announcing your birthright to a reporter.

I don't know his whole history with the family. I'm assuming he started out with that. He's been around for a while. The family probably gets contacted by people like that a lot, and wealthy people usually have lawyers on retainer, so he probably got referred to the lawyer. He may have even gotten a form letter.

I think this is an unfortunate combination of the same kind of fantasies everyone has around the age of 12 about discovering that the people raising them aren't their real parents and their "real" parent are famous and glamorous, along with a situation where something really did happen, to fuel the situation, like a parent who died when he was young, or parents who left him with relatives at some point, and then a mental illness that makes it hard for him to distinguish fantasy from reality, and in the end, he hurts people who have already endured a lot of pain.

I think he genuinely believes he is the Lindbergh child, but that doesn't make it so. I don't think he is another illegitimate child of Charles Lindbergh. I think the Lindbergh family is right not to engage him, because he is essentially a stalker, and you should never do anything to encourage a stalker. Things that you would think are discouraging, or "finalities," are not that to a stalker. They see any kind of contact as the relationship going forward. Sometimes they say they have realized the error of their ways, and want to apologize, but letting them is always a mistake, because they see that as a foot in the door. If you forgive them, maybe you are open to starting over.

If they ignore this guy, he may never go away, but he also may never escalate. A DNA test is the kind of contact that could set up a string of fantasies, like meeting the family at the testing facility, which, when they don't pan out, could make him escalate.

[RivkahChaya]

There's a map of the house at http://www.house-crazy.com/the-charl...ll-new-jersey/ , plus some photos of the nursery, then and now.

Where's the secret passage to the conservatory?

I wonder too how good his hearing was, having been an open-cockpit airplane pilot.

That's a good point. My step-father was a career Navy pilot, and while his general health is very good for a man of his age (75), and always has been exceptional, his hearing is very poor. He won't admit it, though. If you tell him it isn't a personal failing, and is probably because of his piloting, he has an even worse attitude about that, because he seems to think you're saying something bad about the Navy.

Don't get me wrong-- SF is a really great, mostly easy-going guy (who my mother is very lucky to have). But he's going to have to go completely deaf before he gets a hearing-aid, I guess.

[Errata]

The reason that the Lindbergh kids aren't having DNA tests is that people like this don't accept defeat; they do what's called "moving the goalposts." If the DNA tests didn't match, he'd claim something was wrong with then-- the samples were switched, or that Anne Morrow was unfaithful, and Lindbergh wasn't the father of her other children, or something. He'd start demanding something like the exhumation of Lindbergh's body for an attempt at tissue recovery, or a DNA test with a paternal cousin.

I would think that if his intentions were sincere he would have approached the family privately and explained to them why he thought he might be their brother. Since he would not have been given any provision in his father's will, any claim he might have on that money would have to be sued out of every living descendant. And no judge is going to order that, even if he was their brother. He would only get anything through his sibling's good will, and you don't get that by announcing your birthright to a reporter.

[RivkahChaya]

If anyone is interested, a detective actually tracked Anna Anderson's real family pretty much as soon as she popped up. She had so much staying power, because there were people in France at the time actively looking for a survivor, or if there were none, then a pretender, to foment a counter-revolution in Russia, and overthrow the communist government in favor of a monarchical restoration. Also, because the play based on her life, which was immensely popular, assumed that she was actually Anastasia, and that was the only story a lot of people heard for many decades.

When DNA finally disproved Anderson's claim by matching (or, more to the point, not matching) her with Prince Philip's mitochondrial DNA, further DNA testing was done, and she in fact, did match with the people in Poland (current borders-- she was born in West Prussia in 1896) whom the detective in the 1920s had thought were her family. Her name at birth was Franziska Schanzkowska.

In 2007, the last two bodies of the royal family were finally found (Alexei, and one of the sisters), and while forensic anthropologists are not entirely sure which skeleton is which sister, they have accounted for every family member. Five young women, one teenaged boy, two related adults, and an unrelated woman, each with its own DNA profile, correctly established as two parents, six children, and the personal maid who was known to be with them.

[Ginger]

I too found Lindbergh's mention of hearing a cracking noise and assuming it to be a wooden slat falling off an orange in the kitchen very odd.

Did slats used to spontaneously pop off wooden orange crates? I've never heard of such a phenomena. Even if they did, wouldn't a security-conscious celebrity who was also a parent take a second to investigate?

Where was the kitchen located in relation to the baby's upstairs bedroom and the sitting room (I believe that's correct) where Lindbergh was located when he heard the noise?

Are the bedroom and kitchen even on the same side of the house? One would expect him to at least get the general direction right.

Best regards,
Archaic

When he said 'the slats of an orange crate falling off a chair', I took it as meaning loose slats from an orange crate stacked on a chair, awaiting some use, having fallen to the floor. He had at least one dog, plus his wife and several servants in the house, so you probably heard noises like that in other parts of the house from time to time.

There's a map of the house at http://www.house-crazy.com/the-charl...ll-new-jersey/ , plus some photos of the nursery, then and now. I don't see how he could have confused a noise from the nursery directly overhead, with a noise from the kitchen at the far end of the house. The only thing I can think of is that perhaps the orange slats had fallen before, or were precariously stacked, and hearing a wooden sound, it had to be that. I wonder too how good his hearing was, having been an open-cockpit airplane pilot.

[sdreid]

People also claimed they were Princess Anastasia, her brother Prince Michael, Amelia Erhart, Billy the Kid, and so on. People will do anything if there's money or fame involved...

In addition, those claiming to be "Little" Charley Ross who was the first kidnap victim in the modern sense.

[RivkahChaya]

Now we get into the realm of the claimant:


Supposed to be Charles A Lindbergh, Jr

Notice that there is some resemblance, but not really. Can't do DNA on the baby's body as he was cremated. Perhaps Lindbergh's lids should have the DNA ran either to shut him up, or discover yet another illegitimate child, for if Lindbergh is his father, he still isn't the Lindbergh baby

He does share a lot of features with the pictures of the baby: close-set eyes, cow-lick, broad forehead, small chin, but those are all pretty common features.

The reason that the Lindbergh kids aren't having DNA tests is that people like this don't accept defeat; they do what's called "moving the goalposts." If the DNA tests didn't match, he'd claim something was wrong with then-- the samples were switched, or that Anne Morrow was unfaithful, and Lindbergh wasn't the father of her other children, or something. He'd start demanding something like the exhumation of Lindbergh's body for an attempt at tissue recovery, or a DNA test with a paternal cousin.

The fiasco would get press attention, and probably supporters for the "Lindbergh" pretender. Public recognition as the Lindbergh child is the last thing the family wants, so they don't want him getting any publicity.

Something that gets lost in the shuffle, is that the police did check around the state for another missing toddler who could be the body found in the woods, and there wasn't another child of the right age and date missing from anywhere within a couple of states, and since this was before the highway system, it was unlikely it would be a child from California, or something, although as far as I know, that possibility was checked as well. The Lindbergh's house was on a large area of land, and the site where the body was left was really out-of-the-way for someone not coming from the house. It's possible someone drove along the road looking for a desolate place, but you'd think if there were any planning, the body would buried.

If the baby were younger, just a few months old, I'd believe the "home birth, no record" theories, but this baby was more than a year and a half. It's also possible it was a child who just wasn't reported, and children did just die then, but since it was a lot easier to cover up child abuse with "the baby just died," the need to dump bodies wasn't so great. It's just very unlikely this child could have been anyone else, because there weren't any other candidates.