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  • Herlock Sholmes
    replied
    Originally posted by Al Bundy's Eyes View Post

    Classic Herlock, side stepping the real question. Who put Bella in the Wytch Elm? No answer old man. Stumped. Pun intended.
    To be honest Al I’d heard of this but I’ve never looked at it properly. I’ve just read some of the online stuff and it sounds really interesting. I’ve got three books on order so I might get one on the Witch Elm Case next. The Merrill ones look interesting.

    Leave a comment:


  • Herlock Sholmes
    replied
    I’m looking forward to getting a couple of books on the case as I can see where Abby’s coming from. Purely from reading what’s online I'm being pointed heavily toward Brady having to have been involved. I know from experience with Antony’s previous books though that he wouldn’t have chosen it if it was straightforward.

    ****

    Im not asking for names of course Antony but have you got anything in mind as your next case yet?

    Leave a comment:


  • ColdCaseJury
    replied
    Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post

    ok thanks cold case. just seems to me brady was pretty much behind the murders. ex military would have been pretty handy with a gun and probably a scary dude with lots of nefarious connections to other killers. to me looks like a bunch of criminals with one snake a little nastier than the others.
    Unless it was Holmes who murdered Smith and set Brady up. Lots of permutations when you look deeper. Not sure how much fighting Brady did - his military service introduced him to his criminal expertise - signature forgery.

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  • Abby Normal
    replied
    Originally posted by ColdCaseJury View Post

    Abby, every book on this case (there are four, quite an elite club) has found Brady more or less innocent. So, I guess that would be the mystery for you! However, it is unlikely that Brady was involved in the death of Holmes because he was in custody, and it is quite a stretch to even believe that he orchestrated a hit from behind bars. So, the killing of Holmes then becomes open and, with it, the entire case. Just sayin'...
    ok thanks cold case. just seems to me brady was pretty much behind the murders. ex military would have been pretty handy with a gun and probably a scary dude with lots of nefarious connections to other killers. to me looks like a bunch of criminals with one snake a little nastier than the others.

    Leave a comment:


  • ColdCaseJury
    replied
    Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post
    hi all
    in just a quick glance on the case in wiki-im not sure if there is much of a mystery here. smith holmes and brady were all in criminal cahoots together and eventually turned on each other. seems rather straight forward to me-- brady killed smith, holmes broke under pressure and tried to kill himself, but was eventually killed by brady/accomplice. am i missing something?

    i guess my main question would be-were holmes and brady in on the smith murder?
    Abby, every book on this case (there are four, quite an elite club) has found Brady more or less innocent. So, I guess that would be the mystery for you! However, it is unlikely that Brady was involved in the death of Holmes because he was in custody, and it is quite a stretch to even believe that he orchestrated a hit from behind bars. So, the killing of Holmes then becomes open and, with it, the entire case. Just sayin'...

    Leave a comment:


  • Abby Normal
    replied
    hi all
    in just a quick glance on the case in wiki-im not sure if there is much of a mystery here. smith holmes and brady were all in criminal cahoots together and eventually turned on each other. seems rather straight forward to me-- brady killed smith, holmes broke under pressure and tried to kill himself, but was eventually killed by brady/accomplice. am i missing something?

    i guess my main question would be-were holmes and brady in on the smith murder?

    Leave a comment:


  • Herlock Sholmes
    replied
    Originally posted by ColdCaseJury View Post

    A small possibility - there was powder and singe marks on his forehead so the gun barrel was against the skin, or at point blank range. If he was murdered (or looked like murder), his life assurance polices were valid; if suicide, invalid. He might not have considered the financial implications in his drunken state the first time.



    It was more likely the rope. The arm was not digested so any drug would not have made it into the shark's system, I suggest. If you want to turn this into the Stoned Shark Arm case, you can start your own thread!
    Cheers Antony. I didn’t think that there was any mileage in the ‘drugged’ idea but I had to ask.

    The rope is interesting. Why would there be a rope around the arm?

    Leave a comment:


  • ColdCaseJury
    replied
    Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post
    Is there any possibility that Holmes suicide attempt was actually a murder attempt as he claimed? If it was a failed suicide attempt why didn’t he just try again?
    A small possibility - there was powder and singe marks on his forehead so the gun barrel was against the skin, or at point blank range. If he was murdered (or looked like murder), his life assurance polices were valid; if suicide, invalid. He might not have considered the financial implications in his drunken state the first time.

    I was thinking about why the shark had become ill and vomited?Could Smith have been drugged and it was the drugs that made the shark vomit?
    It was more likely the rope. The arm was not digested so any drug would not have made it into the shark's system, I suggest. If you want to turn this into the Stoned Shark Arm case, you can start your own thread!

    Leave a comment:


  • Herlock Sholmes
    replied
    Originally posted by Al Bundy's Eyes View Post

    Classic Herlock, side stepping the real question. Who put Bella in the Wytch Elm? No answer old man. Stumped. Pun intended.

    Leave a comment:


  • Herlock Sholmes
    replied
    Certainly makes sense.

    ***

    Is there any possibility that Holmes suicide attempt was actually a murder attempt as he claimed? If it was a failed suicide attempt why didn’t he just try again?

    ***

    Time for an ‘out there’ question from someone with no medical knowledge.

    I was thinking about why the shark had become ill and vomited?Could Smith have been drugged and it was the drugs that made the shark vomit?

    Leave a comment:


  • ColdCaseJury
    replied
    Originally posted by DJA View Post

    Given the arm was still "fresh",perhaps Smith was being interrogated.

    The "Pathfinder" was a decent sized vessel and Terrigal has long been a major entry point for drugs offloaded at sea.

    Perhaps someone thought he had stashed a consignment the previous year.

    Would make an excellent "Underbelly" addition.
    Smith helped himself to some valuables (including silverware) on Pathfinder before he scuttled it. One of the possibilities I consider is this enraged Holmes and his cartel. And if the valuables had to come to light, it might have prompted a re-investigation of the yacht's loss by police. So, I think you might be on the right lines.

    Leave a comment:


  • DJA
    replied
    Originally posted by ColdCaseJury View Post

    Smith went missing on 8 April. Shark was caught on 18 April.
    Given the arm was still "fresh",perhaps Smith was being interrogated.

    The "Pathfinder" was a decent sized vessel and Terrigal has long been a major entry point for drugs offloaded at sea.

    Perhaps someone thought he had stashed a consignment the previous year.

    Would make an excellent "Underbelly" addition.

    Leave a comment:


  • Al Bundy's Eyes
    replied
    Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post

    I had to look into this one Al. Of the previous 4 books in this series by Antony I’ve agreed with his preferred solution in 3. The odd one out was the Wallace case of course but Antony at least accepts the possibility of a guilty William and I accept that he could have been innocent

    ....he was probably guilty though of course
    Classic Herlock, side stepping the real question. Who put Bella in the Wytch Elm? No answer old man. Stumped. Pun intended.

    Leave a comment:


  • Herlock Sholmes
    replied
    Originally posted by Al Bundy's Eyes View Post
    God Almighty Herlock, is there a cold case your not familiar with? You'll be telling us who put Bella in the Wytch Elm next!
    I had to look into this one Al. Of the previous 4 books in this series by Antony I’ve agreed with his preferred solution in 3. The odd one out was the Wallace case of course but Antony at least accepts the possibility of a guilty William and I accept that he could have been innocent

    ....he was probably guilty though of course

    Leave a comment:


  • Al Bundy's Eyes
    replied
    God Almighty Herlock, is there a cold case your not familiar with? You'll be telling us who put Bella in the Wytch Elm next!

    Leave a comment:

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