kennedy assassination

[Stephen Thomas]

He must have removed it himself after having second thoughts. It was about the most nauseating piece of obscenity I've seen. He's also removed himself from these boards too, I believe.

Hi Graham

Yes, dougie is over on jtrforums now slagging off Casebook and you and Ally in particular. No doubt he'll be back here soon, though.

[Pinkerton]

Someone mentioned the documentary on A&E narrated by Peter Jennings (before he died) on the JFK assassination. What they actually demonstrated in that documentary was to pick out 10 random people who were not marksmen. They gave them the same type of rifle that Oswald used, and gave them one HOUR of training on how to shoot. They they had them shoot at a car with a dummy moving at the same speed and from the same distance and trajectory, and within the same amount of time as the Oswald assassination. The majority of the people WERE able to match Oswald's accuracy. That rifle that Oswald used, though old, was a bolt action rifle. Bolt action rifles are what snipers use to this day because of their accuracy. Stan can tell you all about this I'm sure.

The JFK conspiracy is built on a series of strawmen.

"SINCE Kennedy was sitting in THIS position and governor Connally was sitting in THIS position it would have taken a magic bullet to hit both of them..."

That's right...IF they were sitting in the position conspiracy buffs claim! However they DIDN'T sit in that particular position...

Conspiracy buffs also consistently misrepresent the number of seconds it took to fire the shots.

One of the interesting things that documentary touched on that I wasn't aware of was the fact the Oswald ALSO tried to assassinate Edwin A. Walker a few months before Kennedy. That guy was a right-wing, racist, nutjob and fortunately (or unfortunately ) Oswald missed HIM...

[sdreid]

You can make practically any rifle accurate by zeroing in the sights for a given distance. Even when the weapon doesn't have adjustable sights, you can allow for inaccuracies by experimentally shooting at a target at the preferred distance, that is for instance, if you see that the gun is shooting 6" high then you just aim 6'' below what you want to hit. It's very easy to get used to doing that.

Regarding the time it takes to shoot three shots, some forget that the first round is already in the chamber and there's no need to eject the final casing. If a rifle has a 3 second cycle then it therefore only takes 6 seconds to fire 3 rounds.

[Doctor X]

Indeed, indeed.

The most impressive was the recreation of the shot, in time, with the bullet bouncing off of the "Governor's" thigh--"t3h r34l" bullet superficially penetrated the real Governor's thigh and was found later--the "magic bullet."

Despite shattering actual bone, the bullet was as deformed as the original "magic bullet." That, as Pinkerton suggests, is another fantasy propagated by the conspiracists--that the bullet should have been deformed. Well . . . it was. It just was not mangled.

I do not know what more people want. I think this was the same documentary where Oswald's brother basically states that as much as he would like it otherwise, it is clear his brother did it on his own.

The really cool reconstruction is "t3h Gr4ssy Kn0ll" claims. If you look at a grainy picture you can see . . . an . . . ASSASSIN!!11!

Or is it a robot?

Anyways, rather than go through the lengthly photographic analysis [He knows nothing about it.--Ed.] they figured out how far away a person would have to stand to be "t3h figure" in that picture--based on size.

It was . . . like . . . a football field or farther away.

Finally, regarding the difficulty of a bolt action in the time necessary . . . one thing Mrs. Oswald complained about was how Oswald sat repeatedly working the action. . . .

You know . . . if they ever could discover Jack--somewhere they find a bit of that apron and . . . Lo and BEHOLD there is two sets of DNA . . . search . . . find relatives . . . some will find a way to make him in the employ of the Masons/Royals/Illuminati/Trilateral Commission.

. . . oh and the Skull and Bones . . . forgot about them.

--J.D.

[steje73]

I watched a documentary last week about the JFK assasination where some bloke claimed that, due to his research and expertise in whatever his field was, he had discovered that the fatal head shot could only have come from someone hiding in a storm drain and shooting from a gap in the kerbstone. He claimed that this alleged marksman could have nipped away through the drain network to safety in about 20 minutes.
Oh dear...

[Doctor X]

The guy must never have received the memo that the X-Files is not real.

--J.D.

[Vila]

Indeed! That particular episode of X-Files was the first thing I thought of when I read that post. Too bad that the person behind that claim didn't choose the episode of Quamtam Leap that dealt with the Kennedy assassination: The show's producer actually knew Oswald in the military and used his own memories of that in the writing of the script.

Vila

[jimarilyn]

Hi,

I wonder how many people on this thread have considered how impossible it was (and still is) to fire 3 shots ( in less than 6 seconds ) from the so called sniper's nest with this antiquated piece of junk (Mannlicher Carcano) at a moving target that is moving away and on a decline. The first shot would always be the easiest for very obvious reasons ( in this case it missed it's target). There would then be an established minimum of 2.3 seconds before the next shot could even be fired, the shooter having the difficult task of sighting the moving target again through the misaligned telescopic scope, steadying his aim and getting off his second shot. This time delaying process would repeat itself for the third shot. Dream on you you lone gunman advocates !

[plang]

All of the Kennedys were asassinated by the mafia.

[Doctor X]

I wonder how many people on this thread have considered how impossible it was (and still is) to fire 3 shots. . . .

It is not impossible, as has been explained previously, it has been recreated numerous times.

So . . . like . . . there you go.

Yours truly,

--J.D.

[dougie]

People,(myself included) through reading books written by conspiracy buffs over the years and accepting their so-called facts have been misled terribly into believing far-fetched and downright ludicrous conclusions.The "not enough time to fire three shots" argument is just one of them. In fact there was ample time,and according to the experts those 3 shots werent particularly difficult either (both in time required and target wise) for a guy who had registered 212 in the Marines.
regards

[Tom_Wescott]

All of the Kennedys were asassinated by the mafia.

Someone forgot to tell Ted.

So, has anyone read any of the new books out on the Kennedy assassination, including Vincent Bugliosi's massive opus? I'd love to hear some reviews.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Tom_Wescott]

Check out the reviews for this new book on the KA. It sounds like it's worth a read. The book is The Road To Dallas: The Assassination of John F. Kennedy, by David Kaiser.

Publishers Weekly (starred review) : While plenty of authors have argued that the Mafia and anti-Castro Cubans were behind the assassination of President Kennedy, few have done so as convincingly as Naval War College history professor Kaiser...His attention to detail and use of recently released FBI and CIA files put this analysis ahead of many of its fellows...This is a deeply disturbing look at a national tragedy, and Kaiser's sober tone and reasoned analysis may well convince some in the Oswald-was-a-lone-nut camp.

Kirkus Reviews : In the seemingly neverending arms race between the lone-assassin and the conspiracy theorists, Kaiser adds a serious piece of scholarship to the arsenal of those who believe Americans have yet to learn the whole truth about the assassination of JFK.

Library Journal (starred review) : A scrupulously researched account, which may be one of the best books yet on the assassination...Kaiser posits that Lee Harvey Oswald was the lone gunman although he did not act alone: the murder plot was hatched by Mafia bosses Santo Trafficante, John Roselli, and Sam Giancana as revenge for Attorney General Robert F. Kennedy's relentless pursuit of the mob and for the vast sums of money they lost when Castro closed Cuba's mob-controlled casinos. Other startling revelations are that Oswald might have been a CIA agent, even though he was promised a large sum of money by the mob to kill Kennedy, and that Jack Ruby killed Oswald on orders from the Mafia, to which Ruby was connected. This detailed, often chilling account stands out among the overwhelming number of assassination books.
--Karl Helicher

Chicago Sun-Times : A thorough recounting of facts interspersed with interpretations and opinions that carry the weight of someone who knows how to analyze history... Kaiser isn't the first to suggest JFK was assassinated by a conspiracy of anti-Castro Cubans upset at Kennedy's failure to eliminate Fidel Castro and a Mafia enraged by the obsession of JFK's attorney general, his brother Robert Kennedy, to attack organized crime. But Kaiser may be the first to reach the depth of reporting the facts that support this theory...It would be hard to imagine anyone but Kennedy assassination scholars and historians not learning something new in Kaiser's book. For fans of Oliver Stone's movie JFK (1991) and JFK assassination junkies, the book is the latest--and perhaps best--view of the historic event.
--Roman Modrowski

Playboy : In The Road to Dallas we see the rare vindication of the lunatic fringe, as Kaiser--who teaches history at the Naval War College--puts forth the first serious historical study to confirm what we've long suspected: that JFK's killing was not the work of a lone madman. Comprehensive and well documented, The Road to Dallas connects the dots from the CIA to Carlos Marcello with convincing thoroughness. If you think you've had enough of grassy-knoll theories, this book will surprise you.
--Leopold Froehlich

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[dougie]

Someone forgot to tell Ted.

So, has anyone read any of the new books out on the Kennedy assassination, including Vincent Bugliosi's massive opus? I'd love to hear some reviews.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

The Bugliosi work "reclaiming history" is really in my opinion the only one you need..1500 odd pages..an accompanying cd of endnotes,sourcenotes which adds somewhere in the region of another 900 pages. Every aspect is covered,every conspiracy issue is examined and ultimately destroyed.Nothing is left unanswered.The only criticism I have is ,maybe there is too much detail, the detail being the books strength,but at times its weakness too.But if you want to know everything there is to know about the kennedy assassination, oswald,ruby, and all the characters,motives and actions of everyone in between.....this is the book for you....forget the rest-this is the best!
regards

[Tom_Wescott]

Thanks for that endorsement, Dougie. Were you actually able to plod all the way through that material? By the way, I met Bugliosi at a talk he gave back in the 90's. He mocked me and dismissed me as a 'Manson fan' because of my age and long hair. Or it might have been the FREE CHARLIE sign I was holding, who's to know.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott