Ripper Confidential by Tom Wescott (2017)

[Robert]

And a time machine.

[Sam Flynn]

There is NO way that can be worked back to and admittance around midnight on 30/8.

Unless, of course, you enlist the services of Dianne Abbott.

For those unfamiliar with the British domestic scene, Diane Abbott is a respected mathematician with modest political ambitions.

[MrBarnett]

MM was recorded as having been admitted on 1/9 and discharged on 18/8 after having spent 17 days in hospital.

There is NO way that can be worked back to and admittance around midnight on 30/8.

Unless, of course, you enlist the services of Dianne Abbott.

[MrBarnett]

Incidentally, patient no. 1030, Annie Glick, was recorded as being admitted and discharged (to the fever hospital) on 1/9. Margaret was patient 1032.

[MrBarnett]

I'm not a doctor and it's difficult researching medical matters on the net, but I have seen references to severed radial arteries closing up of their own accord (presumably provided the person holds their arm up, etc).

A person with a severed artery might not feel loike walking to a hospital. Presumably, though, a wound can re-open a day later.

As I say, I am not a doctor.

So they might even be able to make it from the Old Nichol to Whitechapel? Interesting.

[MrBarnett]

I didn't mean 'old' as an insult, Gary. I have no idea what your age is. But I'm guessing you're an adult, right? So too 'mature' petty jealousies is what I meant. As for Millous (or Mallows, etc), she went to the hospital on the same morning Nichols was murdered. She would have been treated at that time. That's the point that matters. Whenever the paperwork was filled out doesn't really matter.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

Tom,

You do realise that Polly was killed in the early hours of Aug 31st, right? And you do realise that 1st Sept is not the same day as 31st Aug?

The incident in Brady Street happened at least 20-odd, and possibly as much as 48, hours before the date Maragaret's admission was recorded. The surgeon assigned to her case was Mr Couper, who does not seem to have been on duty on 31/8.

You've shrugged off a string of geographical howlers as inconsequential, and still seem unaware of your wicket/wicker gaff, but surely you have to accept that this represents a major factual error in your book.

We can either use the date as recorded in the admissions book as the date MM was admitted to the hospital, or we can consider it unreliable. Either way, we have no evidence that MM was attacked in the early hours of 31/8 - something you state as a fact in your book and have just repeated.

Gary

[Robert]

I'm not a doctor and it's difficult researching medical matters on the net, but I have seen references to severed radial arteries closing up of their own accord (presumably provided the person holds their arm up, etc).

A person with a severed artery might not feel like walking to a hospital. Presumably, though, a wound can re-open a day later.

As I say, I am not a doctor.

[MrBarnett]

Gary,
Regarding the admission of this woman to the hospital. The admission record for her clearly states she was admitted on Sept 1st without a ticket.

I haven't looked in to the protocol of admissions to the London Hospital. Was admission recorded immediately on entering the hospital for treatment? What I mean is- was there an outpatients department where casualties without a ticket could walk in and be treated and then admitted later to a ward if the case was serious enough?
Perhaps a check for this would be to compare the date that Emma Smith was recorded as entering the hospital after her attack as she was a casualty entering at night who was admitted to a ward.

As you are aware, my interest in these records, which Tom kindly shared with me, was to discover if there was a woman admitted who may have matched the woman supposedly attacked by a blind man that I re-posted about when research was ongoing in to Pearly Poll and her husband Thomas Foggarty..

Debra,

Yes, that was my initial interest, too. And the lady I found intriguing was admitted as the first accident case on 10/9. I initially misread her name as Caroline Crab. The victim of the blind man was attacked on the 9th, and was initially treated by the police surgeon at Commercial Street station I believe.

For clarification, MM was admitted as an 'accident' victim and the date of her admittance was recorded as 1/9/1888, so somewhere between midnight 31/8 and midnight 1/9. Tom would have us believe that was the same 'morning' Polly Nichols was killed.

I made the point earlier that there could have been a delay in recording her admittance, if she was an emergency case. But stating as a fact that MM's injuries were sustained 'concurrently with the leaving of bloodstains in Brady Street' is misleading.

Gary

[Debra A]

Debs,

I also thought it looked like Millous initially.

As I'm sure you will have appreciated, that was not the main point of my post. Do you have an opinion on when this woman (however you spell her name) was admitted to the London Hospital? Is there any evidence that it was within a few minutes of a supposed JTR attack on the night of 30/31 August, 1888? Or do the records suggest it was 24-48 hours later?

Gary

Gary,
Regarding the admission of this woman to the hospital. The admission record for her clearly states she was admitted on Sept 1st without a ticket.

I haven't looked in to the protocol of admissions to the London Hospital. Was admission recorded immediately on entering the hospital for treatment? What I mean is- was there an outpatients department where casualties without a ticket could walk in and be treated and then admitted later to a ward if the case was serious enough?
Perhaps a check for this would be to compare the date that Emma Smith was recorded as entering the hospital after her attack as she was a casualty entering at night who was admitted to a ward.

As you are aware, my interest in these records, which Tom kindly shared with me, was to discover if there was a woman admitted who may have matched the woman supposedly attacked by a blind man that I re-posted about when research was ongoing in to Pearly Poll and her husband Thomas Foggarty..

[Tom_Wescott]

Tom,

Why resort to personal insults rather than answer the question?

How do you square Margaret's admission to the London Hospital at some time on the 1st September, after three other 'non accident' patients, with her radial artery having been severed 24-48 hours earlier?


Gary

I didn't mean 'old' as an insult, Gary. I have no idea what your age is. But I'm guessing you're an adult, right? So too 'mature' petty jealousies is what I meant. As for Millous (or Mallows, etc), she went to the hospital on the same morning Nichols was murdered. She would have been treated at that time. That's the point that matters. Whenever the paperwork was filled out doesn't really matter.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[MrBarnett]

Gary, you're really far too old and accomplished to be this petty and jealous.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

Tom,

Why resort to personal insults rather than answer the question?

How do you square Margaret's admission to the London Hospital at some time on the 1st September, after three other 'non accident' patients, with her radial artery having been severed 24-48 hours earlier?


Gary

[MrBarnett]

Tom read it as Millows himself. It was me who said I thought it read Millous, a variation of Milhouse when Tom asked my opinion as to what it said.

Debs,

I also thought it looked like Millous initially.

As I'm sure you will have appreciated, that was not the main point of my post. Do you have an opinion on when this woman (however you spell her name) was admitted to the London Hospital? Is there any evidence that it was within a few minutes of a supposed JTR attack on the night of 30/31 August, 1888? Or do the records suggest it was 24-48 hours later?

Gary

[Sam Flynn]

Tom read it as Millows himself. It was me who said I thought it read Millous, a variation of Milhouse.

She wasn't a pre-op Richard Nixon, was she?

[Tom_Wescott]

Tom read it as Millows himself. It was me who said I thought it read Millous, a variation of Milhouse when Tom asked my opinion as to what it said.

Thank you, Debs. But I agreed with your observation, which was also shared by Robert Linford. Barnett's hindsight criticisms are decidedly less impressive.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Tom_Wescott]

Looking at the original London Hospital record, the name looks very much like Millows, although it could be Millous.

What is certain, though, is that Margaret is shown as being admitted on 1st September, 1888 - so unless there was a 24 - 48 hour delay in recording her admission, or she was able to staunch her blood-loss for a day or two, she did not have her radial artery severed on the night of 30/31 Aug.

Gary, you're really far too old and accomplished to be this petty and jealous.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott