JtR Documentaries- Complete the List

[Bailey]

Yes, Mike. The three brass monkeys.

Bailey - those are actually Liam's hands! The awful emo Jack you mention is simply an employee of the London Dungeon. Using their actors was one of their requirements. To this day, all the staff have to wear white make-up with whatever they want on top of it. Seriously. You would have thought they would have let the guy be a little more normal though, wouldn't you?

I've got a couple of photos of myself lurking around somewhere from when I worked there. Including white face.

PHILIP

*Speechless* ... and yet should I make it to London, I know I'm such a sucker I'll cough up money to go the LD and see this for myself.

On the other hand, now that you've confessed to the existence of those pictures, I think the only honourable thing to do would be to post them here for us to see...

Love the Python quote, BTW. "Dinsdale!"

B.

[George Hutchinson]

^ Top marks to Bailey! "Dinsdale" comes from the very same sketch I did the Chapman quote from.

I might post up a photo from my time at the LD. Then again, I might not.

PHILIP

[Bailey]

^ Top marks to Bailey! "Dinsdale" comes from the very same sketch I did the Chapman quote from.

PHILIP

I know it does, that's why I said it, silly person! One of my very, very, favourite Python sketches! Now post those humiliating photos, lest I be forced to come round there and nail your head to the floor.

B.

[George Hutchinson]

Sooner that than use.....

.....sarcasm.

PHILIP

[Jeff Leahy]

Yikes! That's pretty ambitious, Jeff! So presumably, one episode per each of six (assuming C5 plus Tabram?) victims, then are you looking at an episode per suspect, or one suspect episode? Either way, best of luck - it'd be something to see.

Interestingly enough my first taste of Jack the Ripper as a kid was the Barlow and Watts series. It was after the news on a friday night which meant I was allowed to stay up. I believe that is six hours. But yes I'd include Tabram as one hour and referance Emma Smith as thats where that case opens. 1 hour would soon fly by if you took the opportunity to discuss the policeman involved, who they really were, what the dose houses were, some back ground on the victims as Mothers and family backgrounds. So I dont think I'd necessarily want a suspect based series...I'd be far more interested in reinacting the witness statements from Berner Street..piecing it all together..imagine what a mine field that could be?

So as per your feeling that you'd want to be extremely on the ball with fact checking, would you, for example, show a cut or perhaps the raw footage of their interview to each contributor to allow them to correct themselves if they felt they'd put a foot wrong somewhere? The downside there of course is that while you might be able to cover such situations in the edit (a new voiceover placed over appropriate archival stills or footage being the easy option) you could find yourself having to resort to reshoots.

Well a documentary would be a very different animal to the Rippercasts (which I'm just going to take a bath and listen too) Of course its always a question of time. I've worked on productions where you have three days to knock out your feature and playout to VT. I'm currently producing five programs on Extreme sports an have a couple of months...and yes I give a copy to the experts and ask them what they think..and I make corrections..but thats the beauty of owning your own edit suite..my problem is hard drive space...more than time.

The world of TV is moving on very fast. The big current market is IPTV neche' TV. There are currently TV channels springing up on anything from Horse Jumping to Ballooning..these channels are often run bye enthusiasts in their specific areas. I'm talking to some guys who want to set up a channel on military vechiles...build your own tank. So the idea that Rippercast couldn't eventually become a TV channel just on Jack the Ripper is not a way out there idea. The problem is raising revenue and financing the project, the technology exists.

And I guess you'd maybe want a couple of better known names - the likes of Begg, Evans, Fido, Skinner et al - to peruse the entire finished product to fact check. That could be costly of course, as I expect such consulting / advisory fees might run to a few quid.

Anyhoo, best of luck - as I said, it's an ambitious project you have in mind, and I can see how it might be a tricky one to find a home for.
Cheers,
B.

Finding finance is always the biggest problem, not making the program. And yes a program without one of the big names would be pointless if you are serious about finally making a series which reflects something of what actually happened in the autumn of terror.

However I'v long since reached the conclusion that you cant do the story justice with any less time, so its not worth bothering with another 1 hr, its waste of time. Noones ever really done the JtR story properly for TV. So i guess there is still a first to be had. Its convincing someone to put up the money that is the problem.

Anyway, I trust things are fine in New Zealand. Weather in Kent is fantastic and its tempting to go out on the river and do some fishing...but I better get back to work. Nice to meet you Bailey

Yours Jeff

[Bailey]

Hey Jeff

Well, matey, it sounds like a monster undertaking, but I for one will be keen as mustard to see it!

Another cost I'd be worrying about if you want accuracy is building suitable sets for your recreations. Serious Ripperologists have seen all those photos from various periods of the locations and will leap on you if the door to the back yard at Hanbury St is six inches too far to the right

I've gotta say, if you're going to shoot for the moon, maybe 12 episodes - or two series of six? - and cover some suspect theories. Perhaps one show to dismiss the more obvious duds, then an episode each focusing on more viable candidates. It'd also be great to have some focus on what's happened since 1888 - a look at the books that have been published, blah blah. Maybe we're up to three seasons now...

Cheers,
B.

[Bailey]

Sooner that than use.....

.....sarcasm.

PHILIP

Hey, what kind of monster do you think I am?

B.

[Jeff Leahy]

Hey Jeff

Well, matey, it sounds like a monster undertaking, but I for one will be keen as mustard to see it!

Another cost I'd be worrying about if you want accuracy is building suitable sets for your recreations. Serious Ripperologists have seen all those photos from various periods of the locations and will leap on you if the door to the back yard at Hanbury St is six inches too far to the right

Yeah I've given this a lot of thought. I've never claimed to be an expert in any other area of JtR other than filmactic reconstruction. So I guess the visuals would be my main area of interest. Obviously I've done a lot of murders with Andy Aliffe so any project would have to include the man on costume. set, and first AD. And I'm not certaiin he'd be happy about me having an actress where his Cathrine Eddows costume for a few months out in the rain, while I go method .

But its a question of careful story boarding and hoping that there would be enough money to employ some decent 3D studio max or Mia model makers. Certainly they exist its a question of finance. Certainly i have access to a decent green screen studio at low cost. So that would be my route but lots of mix matching and imaginative lighting. Rendering models is a costly and time consuming process.

I've gotta say, if you're going to shoot for the moon, maybe 12 episodes - or two series of six? - and cover some suspect theories. Perhaps one show to dismiss the more obvious duds, then an episode each focusing on more viable candidates. It'd also be great to have some focus on what's happened since 1888 - a look at the books that have been published, blah blah. Maybe we're up to three seasons now...

Cheers,
B.

I've now got a script I'm fairly happy with. I knock out the Royal conspiracy theories and wilder suspects as I go along, where velivant to the facts. So the last programme only has three suspects to consider, and i'm really only interested in one. But the suspect thing isn't of great interest to me. Its presenting the facts and letting the audiance reach there own conclussion that matters. So the witness statements, autopsies and the Coppers, thats my interest, the Facts.

I think anything after 1891 is another program. But I've just listened to the Hollywood podcast..what a great programme that would have made in its own right, cut with the movie clips as they are discussed. I guess an hour program with archive on mini DV and webcams on mini DV would take me about a week to edit.

catch you later

Jeff

[jmenges]

Thanks again

Thanks again to all who added their bits of documentaries here on this thread. The new episode is online now. It might be better if you have iTunes or a podcast grabber, as it takes forever for the streaming audio to load (for me at least) on the website.

Let the discussion continue, and I'll keep my eye on this thread for anyone who may comment about the podcast.

Thanks Philip and Mike, I could not have done the show without you two this week.

JM

[C. F. Leon]

Here's my updated list (compiled mostly from the podcast, with some corrections from the videos themselves):


Jack the Ripper Documentaries

1959-
- TV (UK)- Farson's Guide to the British (H- Daniel Farson; BW, 2, possibly 3 ep) ??LOST (as of 2008 July)
-- 1) ?Nov 05- Wave of Terror
-- 2) ?Nov 12- The Curious Incident of the Grave


1967-
* - TV (UK)- The London Nobody Knows (H- James Mason; 46 min) (segment at 29 Hanbury St)


1973-
- TV (UK)- Barlow & Watt: Jack the Ripper (1973; 6 ep) (US version has added introductory scenes with Sebastian Cabot) [2013/06- version on YouTube is incomplete, missing pts 2 & 3]
* -- 1) July 13- The First Two
-- 2) July 20- Double Event
-- 3) July 27- Butchery
* -- 4) August 03- Panic
* -- 5) August 10- Suspects
* -- 6) August 17- The Highest in the Land?

1978
* - TV (US)- Oct 12 In Search Of... Jack the Ripper (S03E05) (H- Leonard Nimoy) [with Dr J M Cameron, Stephen Knight, Donald Rumbelow, Wendy Sturgis]
-- (repackaged sometime in the 1990s for A&E syndication; 23 min?) [end credits of version on YouTube seem to be from different episode]

1980-
* - TV (UK)- Jack the Ripper: The Final Solution (H- Ray McGregor; 41 min) (based on Stephen Knight's book) [only known film of Goulston St entranceway before demolishment] [version on YouTube has short text commentary at end abt Lewis Carroll theory]
-- Video (1989- or 1988?) [Easter Egg on From Hell DVD]


1987-
- TV (US)- Biography: Jack the Ripper, Phantom of Death (H- Peter Graves) [may not have been subtitled 'PoD']

1988-
* - TV (US)- The Secret Identity of Jack the Ripper [H- Peter Ustinov; 80 min] [with Paul Begg, Daniel Farson, Martin Fido, Melvin Harris, Donald Rumbelow]
* - TV (UK- BBC)- Timewatch: Shadow of the Ripper (H- Christopher Frayling; 50 min) [with Martin Fido]
- TV (UK)- Secrets & Mysteries: Jack the Ripper (H- Edward Mulhare; 26 ep) [with Robert Bloch, Donald Rumbelow] [PH thinks it 15 min, may be misindent]
* - Video (as Secrets of the Unknown: Jack the Ripper) (1989 (dated 1987); 28 min) [version on YouTube is abt 21 min]
- TV (US)- Mysteries, Magic and Miracles (H- Patrick MacNee)
- (Sweden; never shown- about Liz Stride) [with Martin Fido]

1990
- TV (UK)- Crime Monthly: Who Was Jack the Ripper? (H- Paul Ross) [with Paul Begg]


1993-
* - Video- The Diary of Jack the Ripper: Beyond Reasonable Doubt? (N- Tom Baker, H- Michael Winner; 79 min) [with Stewart Evans, Martin Fido, Shirley Harris, Keith Skinner; Donald Rumbelow] [full version on YouTube has annoying web logo at beginning & end credits cut, abt 3 min short]

1995-
Jack the Ripper: Final Solution

1996-
* - TV (US) May 23- Biography: Jack the Ripper, Phantom of Death (N- Jack Perkins; 48 min) [with Stewart Evans, Martin Fido, Melvin Harris, Donald Rumbelow]
* - TV (UK- Channel 4) July 25- Secret History: The Whitechapel Murders (S04E02) (H- David Jessel) [with Stewart Evans, Donald Rumbelow]

1998-
- TV (US- A&E)- History's Mysteries: The Hunt for Jack the Ripper (S12E02, #112- series was originally named In Search of History) (H- Arthur Kent; 50 min) [YouTube version is HC repackage]
* -- (repackaged in 2005? for History Channel syndication, cut to 41 min)
- TV (US- Discovery Home & Leisure)- (Routes series)- JtR (c 30 min)

1999-
* - TV (US)- Scotland Yard's Greatest Investigations (History Channel; 13 min segment) [with John Ross, Martin Fido, Jim Nicholson, Harry Clement]

2000
# (6 segments)- TV- Jack the Ripper: An On-Going Mystery (N- Robert Lindsay) [with Paul Begg, Stewart Evans, Donald Rumbelow]


2001
- TV (UK- Channel 4)- To Kill and Kill Again ()
- (2003? or 2005?) Places of Mystery: Jack the Ripper's London (Travel Channel) [date confusion may be due to Liam Dale having one by same title]

2002
* - TV (UK)- Omnibus: Tracking the Killer (1 hr?) [with Patricia Cornwell] [version on YouTube (as JtR Case Closed) is 58 min & cuts opening & end credits]

2003
- Video- Jack the Ripper: Conspiracies (Liam Dale; 90 min)
- Video- Jack the Ripper Revealed: Truth at Last? (c 90 min)

2004
- Unsolved History: Jack the Ripper

2005
* - Video- Unmasking Jack the Ripper (H- Richard Jones) [with Paul Begg]

2006
- TV (Canada/US- Discovery Channel)- Freemasonry Secrets Revealed (3 ep, c 1 hr each) [with Phil Hutchinson] [Ripper segment is about 4 min long]
* -- (90 min long version)
# (4 parts) - TV (US- National Geographic)- Is It Real: Jack the Ripper [with Patricia Cornwell, Stephen Ryder, Ivor Edwards]
# (5 parts) - TV (UK)- Revealed: Jack the Ripper: First Serial Killer Revealed (UK- Atlantic Productions) [with Laura Richards (sp?), Neil Sheldon]
- (made in 2006 Dec) Swedish show with PH & Glen Anderson (c 15 min)

2007
- TV (US- Discovery Times) March 20- Jack the Ripper: Case Unsolved (UK- Atlantic Prod; D- Dan Oliver; 50 min) [with Laura Richards]
- ?? (TV (UK- satellite station) Summer (July?)- JtR show with PH Freemasonry footage (c 1 hour)
- TV (French)- Babylone (c 1 hr) [with Phil Hutchinson]

2008
? (3 parts) - TV (US- History Channel) Being Jack the Ripper (UK- Atlantic Prod) [with Phil Hutchinson] [CGI reconstruction?] [may have been re-titled In the World of JtR]

2009
# (5 parts) - TV (UK) - Jack the Ripper in America (N- Terry MacDonald) [focuses on 1891 Carrie Brown case]

2010-
* - TV (Canada)- The Real Jack the Ripper (45 min; N- Robert Latimer Cornell)
[* - TV (US- National Geographic)- Finding Jack the Ripper (45 min; with Trevor Marriott)


(Date Unknown)
- The Discovery Channel: Jack the Ripper
- Jack the Ripper: The Definitive Story
- Jack the Ripper: Notorious Serial Killers
- The Royal Ripper (Russian?)
* - Vic Reeves Investigates... JtR [with Richard Jones] [YouTube end credits cut]
* - Yours Truly, Jack the Ripper (footage from TSI of JtR) [abt 7 min]
- (other Richard Jones material)

---------------------------------------------------------------

* indicates that I have it (mostly from YouTube)

[Cogidubnus]

Hi CF

Last time I caught the Barlow and Watt series on YouTube the second instalment was actually a concatenation of episodes - so the series was actually complete, but to the casual glance didn't appear to be.

The giveaway was the running time of the second instalment when compared to the first...

Either way, I was pleased to see it again...in some ways 1973 seems such a long way ago, and in others only yesterday...a sad reflection on ageing!

All the best

Dave

[C. F. Leon]

Hi CF

Last time I caught the Barlow and Watt series on YouTube the second instalment was actually a concatenation of episodes - so the series was actually complete, but to the casual glance didn't appear to be.

The giveaway was the running time of the second instalment when compared to the first...

Either way, I was pleased to see it again...in some ways 1973 seems such a long way ago, and in others only yesterday...a sad reflection on ageing!

All the best

Dave

I tried to download the B & W show back last September (as I recall, it was in 6 installments then), but had problems downloading. When I tried again the next day, it had been removed.

The current version on YouTube is in two parts, but the first segment (abt 50 min) includes episode 1 ONLY, and the second is episodes 4-6 (over 3 hrs; episode titles are given at breaks. The segment also includes part of a Dr. Who episode). So if there were 6 episodes #s 2 & 3 are missing. All information including the podcast claim that there were 6 episodes, and there certainly appears to be missing material between the two segments.

Does anyone know if the Barlow & Watt show was broadcast at the time in the US?

[Cogidubnus]

Hi CF

Yes I recall the bit of Dr Who...

Dave

[C. F. Leon]

Hi CF

Yes I recall the bit of Dr Who...

Dave

The episode is the final one of The Invasion of Time (Serial #097; 4Z-06). It aired 1978 March 11, so either it was recorded on an older tape or the B&W show was rebroadcast around that time. (The other possibility is that the B&W show was copied onto a secondary tape and then the Dr Who episode was either recorded or copied itself.)

[Ozzy]

Here's my updated list (compiled mostly from the podcast, with some corrections from the videos themselves):

I have been meaning to reply to your post for some time. As I'm listening to the Ashes on Radio 4 LW today I thought I'd tackle it.
It's taken me a couple of hours to cross reference with your list. My records are a complete mess and what with these documentaries being broadcast on other channels and sometimes with name changes, as well as different documentaries with similar titles, that's the reason why I've been putting it off. The Rippercast that features Phil tackling all the documentaries must of been a nightmare to prepare for.
OK I think (but not certain - my brain is starting to melt) all the documentaries in the list below are not on your list.

Bloody Britain S01E07 Jack The Ripper - presented by Rory McGrath

Find My Past S01E06 Jack the Ripper - a show that usually features 3 people connected by something, in this case the Ripper.

Jack the Ripper The German Suspect - Trevor Marriott

Jack the Ripper Killer Revealed - MJ Trow on Robert Mann (mortuary attendant), I think John Bennett is also in this one.

Jack the Ripper Tabloid Killer - Kelvin MacKenzie with Andrew Cook - UK Channel 5's Revealed series

London's Scariest Mysteries Who Was Jack the Ripper?

Mystery Files S01E02 Jack the Ripper - features Pat Brown

Mystery Quest S01E08 Jack the Ripper - features Brent Turvey

Prime Suspect Jack the Ripper - focus on suspect Deeming

The Black Museum - Bill W. - show is about 50 mins with first 5 mins on the Ripper

America's Serial Killers The Monster Within and Among Us The Case of Jack the Ripper - lots of footage from The Lodger included - shovelware if ever I saw it.

National Treasures - Trevor Marriott on BBC in 2011 on Carl Feigenbaum, it's only about 5-6 minutes long.

PM me if you want CF. I might be doing the same but right now it's time for something to eat although before I forget - do you have something similar for radio documentaries?