The Stride Murder

[PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR 1]

That is an interesting suggestion.

[The Rookie Detective]

Please see this thread about a leading candidate to be the witness Israel Schwartz.

https://www.jtrforums.com/forum/the-witnesses-evidence/israel-schwartz/28773-israel-schwartz-new-information

JM

Thank you for highlighting this link.

I find it rather compelling and intriguing.

Excellent research!

RD

[The Rookie Detective]

Why would Stride tell Elizabeth Tanner the deputy at 32 Flower and Dean Street that she has been living with her man at Fashion Street and not Dorset street. Tanner says that she often saw her in the 3 months before her murder. (Inquest evidence)

This seems to be evidence that Stride was a liar

OR

there is a connection to Fashion Street that needs exploring.

NW

Yes, Fashion Street (or Court?) is more important a location than we realize.

Both Stride and Eddowes mention it...and they were both murdered on the same night (morning)


Did Stride have a new lover, and if so, did her new lover (post-Kidney) live in Fashion Street?


Fashion Street connects both victims, but not just in the typical "lodging house" way.


There's more to uncover here.


RD

[Sunny Delight]

Yes, Fashion Street (or Court?) is more important a location than we realize.

Both Stride and Eddowes mention it...and they were both murdered on the same night (morning)


Did Stride have a new lover, and if so, did her new lover (post-Kidney) live in Fashion Street?


Fashion Street connects both victims, but not just in the typical "lodging house" way.


There's more to uncover here.


RD

I very much doubt whatever is uncovered will help in any way solve the 135 year old mystery

[NotBlamedForNothing]

Who supposed the second man was an accomplice? Swanson's report states "Schwartz cannot say whether the two men were together or known to each other". It's almost as though Schwartz gave further evidence at some point.

That is an interesting suggestion.

When doubts were raised about the story, perhaps the police requestioned Schwartz in an attempt to obtain additional information.

The Star, Oct 2: In the matter of the Hungarian who said he saw a struggle between a man and a woman in the passage where the Stride body was afterwards found, the Leman-street police have reason to doubt the truth of the story. They arrested one man on the description thus obtained, and a second on that furnished from another source, but they are not likely to act further on the same information without additional facts.

It would seem that one man was arrested based on his appearance (I guess he must have been wearing a peaked cap), but the other man was arrested "on that furnished from another source". I take that to mean a description that did not come from Schwartz. How is that possible? Schwartz told Abberline that he and the two men were the only men on the street. So, who was the other source? Perhaps it was Fanny Mortimer's description of black bag man.

[GBinOz]

Yes, Fashion Street (or Court?) is more important a location than we realize.

Both Stride and Eddowes mention it...and they were both murdered on the same night (morning)


Did Stride have a new lover, and if so, did her new lover (post-Kidney) live in Fashion Street?


Fashion Street connects both victims, but not just in the typical "lodging house" way.


There's more to uncover here.


RD

Hi RD,

I thought I would bump this thread based on your comments above and on your comments in your post #1006:
Coincidentally, the surname 'Jacobs' appears somewhere else.
When Eddowes was discharged from the police station, she gave her address as 6 Fashion Street.
I've always wondered why.
Well in 1891 there were 2 families living at 6 Fashion Street..one of which was the 'Silverman' family and the other was the 'JACOBS' family.
Joseph Jacobs was a Jewish Tailor (aged 42 in 1891)
It would be within reason to suggest the Jacobs family may have lived there in 1888 also.

The following is from the Times report of the inquest published 2 Oct:
Gilleman came upstairs and said, "There is a dead woman lying in the yard." I went down in a second, and struck a match. I could then see a woman lying on the ground, near the gateway, and in a pool of blood. Her feet were about six or seven feet from the gate, and she was lying by the side of the club wall, her head being towards the yard. Another member, named Isaac, was with me at the time. As soon as I saw the blood I got very excited and ran away for the police. I did not touch her.
The CORONER. - Did you see if her clothes were disturbed?
Witness. - I could not say. When I got outside I saw Jacobs and another going for the police in the direction of Fairclough-street, and I then went to the Commercial-road, all the time shouting "Police!"

The "Isaac" could not have been Kozebrodsky, as he was by this time in the street with Diemshits. When Eagle ran out into the street, did Isaac go with him, and Eagle then refer to him by his surname of Jacobs? Unfortunately I have been unable to establish a link to say his name was Isaac Jacobs but, never the less, it is interesting that there is again this connection with the name Jacobs.

But wait...there's more. Isaac Jacobs was initially suspected, and still is by some, in the murder of Alice McKenzie. I know that you did considerable research on the Silverman family so, when you accessed the 1891 records for the Jacobs family living at 6 Fashion St, was there a mention of an Isaac Jacobs, or any further matters of interest on the Jacobs family?

Cheers, George

[GBinOz]

THE MEMBERS OF THE WHITECHAPEL VIGILANCE COMMITTEE

George Lusk - President	Joseph Aarons - Treasurer
Mr. B. Harris - Honorary Secretary	Mr. J. A. Cohen - Committee Member
Mr. Reeves - Committee Member	Mr. Haughton - Committee Member
Mr. Lindsay - Committee Member	Mr. Jacobs - Committee Member
Mr. Isaacs - Committee Member	Mr. Mitchell - Committee Member
Mr. Hodgins - Committee Member	Mr. Barnett - Committee Member
Mr. Lord - Committee Member	Mr. Lawton - Committee Member
Mr. Vander Hunt - Committee Member	Mr. Sheed - Committee Member
Mr. Van Gelder - Committee Member	Albert Bachert - Chairman (1889)

An interesting list with some familiar names.

A quote from Monty: These men equipped themselves with lanterns, sticks and something the Police never had, rubber soled boots.

Would membership and participation in a Vigilance Committee provide a good cover for Jack? Pure speculation of course.

Cheers, George

[DJA]

Confirms Eddowes and Stride knew each other.

Some very popular names on that list.

Doubt anyone who just left their partner would divulge their new address.

Suspect 6 Fashion Street was part of the soup kitchen (1886 - 1902).There was a list of committee members on the Internet,Frankenstein being one.

[DJA]

The Illustrated London News 1879-12-27: Vol 75 Iss 2117 - sim_illustrated-london-news_1879-12-27_75_2117.pdf

[GBinOz]

The Illustrated London News 1879-12-27: Vol 75 Iss 2117 - sim_illustrated-london-news_1879-12-27_75_2117.pdf

Hi Dave,

Are you endeavouring to be inscrutable again (or still)? I downloaded the publication that you linked - 24 pages of illustrations and print so small that it would task an eagle with a looking glass. Can you provide additional hints please?

Also, can you provide a link to the "list of committee members on the Internet, Frankenstein being one" please?

Cheers, George