Who Was Anderson’s Witness?

[Michael W Richards]

A little additional point, Fanny Mortimer used the words "nearly the whole time", and still people use that to remove her from the view of the street for up to 10 minute intervals. Which would constitute a third of the time in question, and as such contrast greatly with an assertion that she was there nearly the whole time. Why not use an unaffiliated unbiased witness instead of presuming so much about her.

She may well have been at her door at 12:45. Why doesnt she dispute Schwartz then? Oh yeah, nobody asked him for his story at the Inquest, its not even mentioned or noted. And she wasnt there because all she actually saw was Goldsteins pass. When Liz Stride was being cut...as early as 12:46...she may well have been at the door. She said she was at her door around 12:50 when she went "back out", and we know she was there at 12:56 because she saw Goldstein. Who may well have been walking past looking into the passageway while the killer is there with Stride. Maybe thats why he waited until Tuesday to come forward, he wasnt sure he should tell the police what he actually saw when he looked in, and why he kept going with empty cigarettes cartons in his bag and cigarette makers awake at the time in the passageway cottages.

Fanny saw only Goldstein. And she said if anyone had come out from that passageway she would have seen them....and she said she was there until 1am. Which tells us A) Diemshutz did not arrive precisely at 1 as he claimed, B) the killer remained at that location after cutting Liz Stride once.

Since she didnt see anyone but Goldstein, she didnt see anyone arrive there either....cue Eagle. The killer almost certainly came from the premises.

[Michael W Richards]

Someone said in message above to me that Fanny didn't contradict medical evidence, but if Dr Blackwell examination was at 0115 and he said that this women was killed 20 to 30 minutes ago then that means he thinks she was killed between 0045 and 0055 so that does actually.

She was killed out of sight of Fanny, behind the gate in the passageway. And you can back Schwartz all you like, but his absence at the Inquest sort of deals with his overall value here.

[caz]

But no witness ever saw the killer !!!!!!!!

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

If MM said that, he could only have known it for a fact if he was the killer.

Good luck with that one.

Love,

Caz
X

[caz]

Of course Fanny Mortimer told everyone that she saw nothing, it's clear she was the real killer. Her name practically screams "death to prostitutes". Hell, she even left her initials in Kelly's room.

Nice one, Josh.

FM said she saw sweet FA because she planned to kill MJK all along.

Love,

Caz
X

[Abby Normal]

I think I am inclined to agree with you Trevor in the fact that this ID parade does appear all a bit mythical to me! Whatever happened I really don't think it can be relied upon as anywhere near close to fact.

not mythical at all. two cops mention it in detail and another alludes to it. two of the three name the suspect and we have the witness IDer who in all liklihood was lawende.
The ID took place, theres just some questions about exactly where.

[Losmandris]

The only reason Kosmisnki has been coveted as a suspect all of these years is because of what is written in the marginalia, and people have ignored the MM in which it states Kosminkski should be exonerated and in which MM makes no mention of this mythical ID parade described in the marginalia.

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

I think I am inclined to agree with you Trevor in the fact that this ID parade does appear all a bit mythical to me! Whatever happened I really don't think it can be relied upon as anywhere near close to fact.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Didnt MM state that as a fact ?

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

Yes. More accurately he should have said ‘probably.’

[Trevor Marriott]

Is that a ‘fact’ Trevor? Or an opinion?

Didnt MM state that as a fact ?

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Herlock Sholmes]

But no witness ever saw the killer !!!!!!!!

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

Is that a ‘fact’ Trevor? Or an opinion?

[GBinOz]

But no witness ever saw the killer !!!!!!!!

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

Hi Trevor,

The subject of the thread is "Who was Anderson's Witness" which is likely to be entirely independent of "Who saw the Killer".

Cheers, George

[Trevor Marriott]

Also 1. Couldn't have been Julius Lipman because he didn't exist. The closest person to him is Barnett Lipman who was a cigar maker not a cobbler and 2. couldn't have been Colocott because the only weapon he was ever alleged to have used was an awl not nail scissors.

The only reason Kosmisnki has been coveted as a suspect all of these years is because of what is written in the marginalia, and people have ignored the MM in which it states Kosminkski should be exonerated and in which MM makes no mention of this mythical ID parade described in the marginalia.

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Astatine211]

Also 1. Couldn't have been Julius Lipman because he didn't exist. The closest person to him is Barnett Lipman who was a cigar maker not a cobbler and 2. couldn't have been Colocott because the only weapon he was ever alleged to have used was an awl not nail scissors.

[Astatine211]

what puzzles me about the ID parade set out in the marginalia, is why if Lawende was the witness was the ID parade organised by the Met Police when Lawende was a City Police witness for the murder of Eddowes. If the infomation about the suspect was that good for the police to instigate a parade why didnt the city police organise it, and why does Major Smith make no mention of this major development in his memoirs.

I have to say yet again the marginalia is clearly unsafe to rely on.

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

At least two versions of it had Pizer and Cutbush rather than Kosminski and Ostrog and so it seems like the content of the marginalia was never set in stone. You would think Macnaghten would at least be able to verify and get the correct jobs and ages of the people who were meant to be the main suspects.

[Trevor Marriott]

Hi Trevor,

I'm not sure about the use of the word "parade" where only one suspect was presented. However, following your logic, the alternative to your unsafe marginalia is that the witness was Schwartz or White.

Cheers, George

But no witness ever saw the killer !!!!!!!!

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Astatine211]

Hi Astatine211,

There is some interesting research by Pat Marshall and Chris Phillips reported in Ripperologist 128 and discussed here: https://forum.casebook.org/forum/rip...perologist-128

It suggests that Providence Street was the likeliest address for Aaron Kozminski at the time of the murders. The comment is:
"walking between Aaron's siblings residences at this time (as Aaron surely would have done), one would obviously traverse either Berner Street or Batty Street, as both streets lie directly between Greenfield Street and Providence Street.".

To me this increases the probabilty that Aaron may have been in Berner St at the time of Stride's murder.

Cheers, George

Interesting. According to the map this could allow Kosminski to bypass Fanny Mortimer I believe.