Romford

[richardnunweek]

Hi Ben,
My mistake obviously married to Toppings grandson,.
Regards Richard.

[Ben]

Thanks, Richard.

Just a note about the Romford "coincidence". There are relatives of Toppy who lived, died, and were buried in Tonbridge which is the nearest town to me, less than 10 minute's drive away. I went to school there. I find that an interesting "coincidence" in light of my fascination with the case, and Hutchinson in particular, but there's no evidence that Toppy himself had anything to do with Tonbridge.

Best regards,
Ben

[Garry Wroe]

Hi Richard.

Thank you for the information. The problem with the Toppy angle, however, is that, at best, it amounts to second- and third-generation hearsay. And whilst I don’t for a second doubt the sincerity of Toppy’s descendants, they are simply relaying a form of familial folklore for which there is not a shred of evidential corroboration. In order to determine the truth about the real George Hutchinson, we need a contemporaneous reference point such as a place or date of birth – or similar data pertaining to, say, one of Hutchinson’s relatives.

But thanks, anyway. And thanks to those who contacted me privately on the strength of my earlier post.

Garry Wroe

[Roy Corduroy]

...the Daily News, 14th November, 1888, in which Hutchinson was quoted as stating:-

'On Thursday last I had been to Romford, in Essex, and I returned from there about two o'clock on Friday morning, having walked all the way.'

Fairly unequivocal, wouldn't you say

Yes. George said he walked, and we can't find a "Romford Arms" in Nov 88'.

The 1910 map. Here #3 is a PH (public house) but it's too late to be The House Where Hutch Swilled.

[Garry Wroe]

Sorted!

[Roy Corduroy]

Bumping up because of what Miss M shared on a Hutchinson thread (here)

Interesting article in this month's Whitechapel Journal by Ian Porter about Hutchinson that calls into question many of the perceived statements made by him. To summarise
Firstly the idea that he had walked back from Romford because he spent all his money . A pub close to Commercial St called the Pride of Spitalfields was known locally as the Romford, so its more likely he had pissed his money down the pub.

"A pub close to Commercial St called the Pride of Spitalfields was known locally as the Romford"

Thank you for that. I don't have the magazine. Can someone who has the article kindly tell me the source material Mr. Porter used for this statement?

Roy

[The Grave Maurice]

This is ancient news, Roy. It wasn't just "known locally as the Romford" the Romford Arms was, in fact, its former name. See, e.g., this: http://www.fancyapint.com/pubs/pub367.php

Somewhere on this site is a dissertation that discusses the issue, but it's too late to look for it now, and I'm going to bed. 'Night.

[Lechmere]

There was a pub on Heneage Street, just off Brick Lane, called the Romford Arms.
I believe it hasn't been proved that it was in existence under that name in 1888.
In any case Hutchinson walked back down Whitechapel Road passed St Mary’s Church which isn’t on the route from Heneage Street to Commercial Street.
Also Hutchinson said he hadn’t been drinking that day, so he would hardly have meant he had been ‘down the Romford’, rather than been ‘in Romford’.

[The Grave Maurice]

In any case Hutchinson walked back down Whitechapel Road passed St Mary’s Church which isn’t on the route from Heneage Street to Commercial Street.
Also Hutchinson said he hadn’t been drinking that day....

Where do you get this from, Lech? I don't know of a source for either of your statements.

[Garry Wroe]

These were statements related by Hutchinson himself in newspaper interviews, Ken. The Romford Arms issue was also discussed last year on a thread to which I posted part of a press report in which Hutchinson stated that he had visited Romford, Essex. It would seem, therefore, that someone wasted a good deal of time and effort composing a dissertation that explored a non-issue.

All the best.

Garry Wroe.

[Garry Wroe]

Hi Roy.

Before putting yourself to more trouble, you might care to check the Daily News, 14th November, 1888, in which Hutchinson was quoted as stating:-

'On Thursday last I had been to Romford, in Essex, and I returned from there about two o'clock on Friday morning, having walked all the way.'

Fairly unequivocal, wouldn't you say?

Regards,

Garry Wroe.

It was actually this thread, Ken!

[The Grave Maurice]

My memory isn't what it was, Garry. This, I think, is what I remembered. The reference to the Romford Arms is in the final footnote, but I'm still not sure if the pub was called that in 1888.

http://www.casebook.org/dissertations/rip-cousin.html

P.S. If you could refer me to the relevant newspaper interviews, I'd be grateful.

[The Grave Maurice]

Sorry, I can't seem to keep up.

[Lechmere]

From St. James Gazette 14 November 1888
Hutchinson’s interview with reporters:
“On Thursday I had been to Romford, in Essex, and I returned from there about two o'clock on Friday morning, having walked all the way. I came down Whitechapel road into Commercial street...
"I was quite sober, not having had anything to drink all day...
“I am able to fix the time, as it was between ten and five minutes to two o'clock as I came by Whitechapel Church.”

[The Grave Maurice]

Ta, Lechmere. Apparently I'll have to spend more time reading the press reports.