Romford

[The Good Michael]

Yes
Its called stalking

It's called boyish infatuation. Who didn't do such things? I remember waiting for a girl almost every day knowing that she would come out of school after track practice about 5 minutes after I did. I would wait and say, "hello." and nothing more.

You can call me a stalker too if you want, but the body was never found.

Mike

[Abby Normal]

It's called boyish infatuation. Who didn't do such things? I remember waiting for a girl almost every day knowing that she would come out of school after track practice about 5 minutes after I did. I would wait and say, "hello." and nothing more.

You can call me a stalker too if you want, but the body was never found.

Mike

sorry
I was not clear-I was referring to Hutch's behavior. He was no school boy.

[Colin Roberts]

I am thoroughly convinced that ... Hutchinson was discredited!

It would certainly seem most probable that ... the man seen loitering by Sarah Lewis was George Hutchinson!

Etc.

[ATTACH]12479[/ATTACH]

What's your point Colin dear?

1/ I have never claimed, nor set myself up to be, an 'expert' on this case. If I had, I would have written a book on it or submitted my knowledge in some kind of formal, professional presentation for the public to digest.

2/ This is a message board forum. It's a place for people to informally share information, ideas and opinions about all aspects of the case. Hutchinson areas for discussion of Hutchinson, which includes whether he was telling the truth or lying, since Casebook itself draws attention to the aspects of his statement which do not add up.

3/ Many many kind, honourable and decent researchers share their knowledge here which I personally have benefitted from and I am very grateful for that, because I myself am not an expert in any way shape or form, nor would I expect anybody to defer to my opinion as such. Said researchers are usually very kind and encouraging to those of us who do not have as much knowledge, however you do get the odd one or two who think anybody who is starting off now, as they did years ago, without the breadth of knowledge they have (now) is an upstart and arrogant to even dare to breath an opinion about something at all. I don't subscribe to that view of things I'm afraid. I do think everyone's opinion is valid, and the only way people will learn is by experessing those opinions, seeking feedback and further information which consolidates and sometimes changes what they know and believe.

4/ As I said to Stewart, I am not going to write *in my opinion* in front of or after everything I write, as most growns ups with an ounce of common sense can take it as read that what I am posting here is my opinion. If I want my postings proof-read, I will submit them formally to a publisher. Otherwise, I will continue to post as I am doing. If you find that problematic I suggest you put me on ignore.
__________________
babybird

WARNING!

The previous posting may contain OPINION. Those with weak stomachs, look away now!

I have never imagined such a paranoid compulsion to read so much into so little, and to accordingly exhibit such a propensity for 'straw man' argumentation.

This is absolutely incredible!

[Colin Roberts]

For those that were not able to grasp the point that I was attempting to make:

I am thoroughly convinced that ... Hutchinson was discredited!

It would certainly seem most probable that ... the man seen loitering by Sarah Lewis was George Hutchinson!

Etc.

[ATTACH]12480[/ATTACH]

Imagine a forum filled with 'Hutchinson' threads, in which conviction is asserted as being just that.

Imagine!

I happen to believe that George Hutchinson is a very worthwhile person of interest that should be pursued most vigorously.

But, when supposition is touted as being absolute fact, as is so often the case, in discussions pertaining to Hutchinson, I tend to lose my appetite.

[Robert]

Bob's idea in "From Hell" was just that : Hutchinson as an obsessed stalker (not the innocent schoolboy kind). I think one can make out a case for Hutchinson without bringing romance into it, but there you go. Bob's book is certainly worth reading.

[Robert]

Mike you could have saved yourself the wait if you'd only run five minutes slower.

[ChrisGeorge]

Bob's idea in "From Hell" was just that : Hutchinson as an obsessed stalker (not the innocent schoolboy kind). I think one can make out a case for Hutchinson without bringing romance into it, but there you go. Bob's book is certainly worth reading.

I like Bob's book. It's a thoughtful consideration of Hutchinson's testimony. Bob correctly points out the problems with his statement. And I would agree with Colin, as I have stated before, that Hutchinson should be considered a person of interest.

Chris

[harry]

Mike,
It was Fisherman who posted about the walking there and back,and on the same day.

[harry]

Mike,
It was Hutchinson himself who gave occupation as labourer.You think he might have been lying.

[Fisherman]

Harry:

"It was Fisherman who posted about the walking there and back,and on the same day."

I don´t know what context you are talking about here, Harry, but for the record, I would say that we only have the journey back from Romford down as a stretch that Hutchinson did indeed claim to have walked. As for the East-end-Romford journey, that could have been undertaken by other means of transport.
Either way, 14 miles is possible to walk in a day, and 28 miles is ALSO possible to walk in a day.

The best,
Fisherman

[harry]

Fisherman,
Maybe,but I haven't heard of any outside of trained atheletes.I have however seen the effect,via t.v,of the ordinary,non trained person attempting only ten miles,in only shorts and vest,and it's not been pretty.

[The Good Michael]

Mike,
It was Hutchinson himself who gave occupation as labourer.You think he might have been lying.

He was also said to have been a groom before that, and we know he was a plumber later in life... well some blind people don't know that, but we amrt guys do. I was only suggesting that he mightn't have been unskilled and perhaps knew of some other opportunities available in Romford other than heavy lifting.

Going back to the walking. I have said over and over again that I would have no issue with walking 14 miles. In fact, I'm positive I could do it in well under 4 hours. Could I do 28? Sure, but I wouldn't like it. What I couldn't do is do 14, work 10 hours of heavy labor and do 14 more back. I'm also positive that had HUtchinson told Abberline, Badham, and all the other contables who may have been present that he did so, at leats one of them would have raised an eyebrow. They didn't so he didn't. It's quite simple. Again, the possibility of walking from Romford was not disputed, so you, 120 years later with absolutely no expertise in such things have the right to dispute it by way of it being an impossible, extraordinary, or inordinately difficult taks. I t surely wasn't.

Could he have lied as Ben says to cover for why he didn't make it back to the Victora Home? Sure, but that isn't nearly as logical as simply not having the money and is one of dozens of possibilities that you people fail to see. This close-mindedness reminds me of the same people who argued against womens' rights and emancipation.

Mike

[Fisherman]

Harry:

"I haven't heard of any outside of trained atheletes"

Then you have not read the thread properly, Harry. Numerous examples have been listed of people walking long distances, our own poster The Good Michael being one of them.
Incidentally, Harry, if you google the strain "walked 15 miles", you will get around 70 100 (seventy THOUSAND one hundred) hits to choose from. That should say something about it all, methinks.

The best,
Fisherman

[Ben]

I really don't know why some of the people who defend Hutchinson's claims keep focusing purely on the distance of the journey as though this aspect has been targeted specifically as the most implausible element. It isn't. It only becomes implausible once you factor in the specific circumstances in Hutchinson's case; the small hours of the night, miserable weather conditions, and no money or pass to get into his lodgings. This is what makes the walk of 14 miles deeply implausible. Context is essential.

Undertaking such a journey at that time, in those conditions, and with no chance of getting in the Victoria Home is obviously implausible, because it would mean that he endured all that sleep deprivation, exposure and energy expenditure for no reason. As the police's failure to raise any eyebrow over the issue, I'm not remotely confident that they didn't. Crucially, the police statement included no reference to walking all the way back from Romford; only that he'd spent all his money there. The walking bit was only included in press versions of his testimony, i.e. very shortly before the Star's announcement that his statement was "now discredited". I've suggested in the past that some of Hutchinson press disclosures may well have prompted the belief to distrust him, and this may have been a case in point.

All the best,
Ben

[Fisherman]

Harry!

Just a few examples of non-athletes walking long distances, all found on the internet:

1/ "A dozen miles from Herekino is Ahipara, celebrated for its beach, one of the finest and longest in New Zealand. Ahipara also is a Maori stronghold, and has one of the largest native schools in the country. When I was there this school had more than one hundred pupils, who were instructed by a white man and his wife and two Maori assistants. Although it was a native school, eight or ten white children attended it. In New Zealand mixed attendance in Maori districts is not uncommon, and it is marked by little, if any, friction between Maori and white pupils on account of race distinctions.
Maori boys and girls like to attend school, and to do so many of them travel astonishingly long distances. In one school an inspector found that in a single week many children had covered one hundred and twenty miles. Heta Harewi, a lad fifteen years old, walked twenty miles every day to attend school in 1910!"

2/ "The human body was designed to be used for manual labor. Only three or four generations ago, most men walked around 15 miles every day just doing their daily work. And women walked about half that distance. Kids still walked to and from school."

3/ "My brother in law was a mail carrier for about a decade. He was so overworked. He was actually a carrier and walked 20+ miles every day to deliver his route- rain, sleet or snow."

4/ "Henderson Settlement is located on a beautiful site, with hills and mountains in all directions. Our farm extends to the top of Pine Mountain in the rear of the school. This mountain is one hundred and forty miles long. The school building faces Little Log Mountain. Beautiful Laurel Creek is across the road from Partin Hall, while Pine Creek meanders through the bottoms in its rear.
The people living in this section known as ''South America" are of the parent American stock, descendants of the earliest settlers of English, Scotch and Irish blood. There is not a foreigner among them, and a negro is almost never seen anywhere in the mountains.

The children, most of them tow-headed or golden haired blondes, come to school over rocky hill or mountain paths and roads, some of them for a number of miles. A former high school student for several years rode a mule to school seven miles each way every day. When the mule was not available, he made the fourteen mile round trip on foot. Another student for over a year walked fourteen miles every day."

5/ "He is proud to have been born in Hunza and later having walked some twelve miles every day from Aliababd where he resided and spent most of seven year childhood and school days in Hunza."

6/ "A child in a textile mill walked 48 km (30 miles) every day."

7/ "For ten months Coleman walked nine miles every day to school, showing her determination to fly. (Plantz, Bessie Coleman: First Black Woman Pilot, pg. 45) "

8/ "I learned that Dickens was a dandy, short, and very energetic. He typically walked twenty to thirty miles every day and still found the strength to write a dozen novels, edit magazines, give readings to huge audiences, travel, beget ten children, and carry on a shady relationship with an actress nearly half his age."

9/ "This is William Conway of Crab Tree Row, Bethnal Green, who walked twenty-five miles every day, calling, “Hard metal spoons to sell or change.” Born in 1752 in Worship St, Spitalfields, he is pictured here forty-seven years into his profession, following in the footsteps of his father, also an itinerant trader."

Please note that the people referred to here, are people who did not make just the one trek - THEY WALKED THESE DISTANCES EVERY DAY!
I could easily go on with this, but I think the point is made by now. Hope you agree with that!

The best,
Fisherman